Tactical considerations in self defense

[Steve]

This is a very poignant and relevant topic and I appreciate you starting the discussion on it. I always challenge my students to work through this. Even within my city, the difference between living in the city vs the suburbs brings very different tactical considerations.

Sure, don't buy drugs off the street or get wasted and stumble out of bars into alleys in the middle of the night. But, I wait at bus stops (or don't wait as bus stops) and that's a major scenario that I consider in my training. Some of my students live just out of town and thus would never, ever find themselves waiting at a bus stop.

The streets are wet here much of the year, so traction and rooting is important and challenging. It's dark much of the year too, so yeah, 5 months of the year a flashlight is key.

I think this is one of the more worthwhile conversations I've seen here, so I'll give it at bit more time and promise to participate more when I can.

Hills in Seattle are steep and slippery most of the time. There are some areas that are more prone to crime than others, and the tent cities and derelict RVs parked all over Seattle also create legitimate concerns for the residents in those areas.

Of course, it really, really, really depends on what kind of self defense we're talking about. In Seattle, your chances of being robbed on the street are pretty low... about 12 per 100,000 residents in a given month. Your chances of being robbed by someone who is armed are less than half that, around 6 per 100,000 residents, and that's with any kind of weapon.

Aggravated assault is pretty unlikely as well, although far more likely to be domestic violence than random, street violence. So, reasonable precautions would (should?) include avoiding paranoia.

Homicide is pretty uncommon in Seattle. For a big city, it's remarkably safe (although I'd probably avoid bebopping around White Center after dark). We have had 14 homicides in 2016, out of over 600,000 residents. I didn't dig into those stats to find out whether the victims were engaged in high risk behaviors, but I'd bet some of them were.

Craigslist is very risky, so if you're looking to sell some things on that site, take some simple precautions to stay safe.

 

[Juany118]

Okay back to environment, this time "outside" considerations. I would get into "bad weather" related Buka and Short have done a fair job there already.

So is it summer, do you like those shorts? Going to a ground game is going to be VERY unfriendly. My co-workers think I am nuts but even in the summer I wear long pants on bike patrol to minimize road rash to knees that can come from a scuffle.

When walking down the street don't check your text messages or FB. Heck I recommend not even talking on the phone. Studies have shown talking on a cellphone while driving has a similar negative impact to driving under the influence of alcohol. If you need to talk or text wait until you are someplace where you can be safely stationary. All the self defense skill in the world will not help you if you don't see it coming or your reaction time is degraded. To top it off how many of you will just drop or throw that Galaxy S7 or IPhone 7S at the drop of a hat?

Next route. At night, even if it takes you out of your way try to follow routes that have street lights. If impossible a tactical flashlight is advised. Again perception and reaction time.

Don't just look at your companion or the ground. Not only does this reduce your situational awareness but if someone looking for a victim is around it tags you as one. Someone who is "head up" and obviously aware of their surroundings is someone who the predator looking for prey will pass by.

Also, at night, always try to look a bit down the road, not necessarily for potential threats but groups of people, open businesses. Again, in a personal self defense situation your safety is paramount. If you have to stand and fight then do it but if you can get the guy on his butt then go to a group or into a business the bad guy will almost always take off.



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[Steve]

When walking down the street don't check your text messages or FB. Heck I recommend not even talking on the phone. Studies have shown talking on a cellphone while driving has a similar negative impact to driving under the influence of alcohol. If you need to talk or text wait until you are someplace where you can be safely stationary. All the self defense skill in the world will not help you if you don't see it coming or your reaction time is degraded. To top it off how many of you will just drop or throw that Galaxy S7 or IPhone 7S at the drop of a hat?

Next route. At night, even if it takes you out of your way try to follow routes that have street lights. If impossible a tactical flashlight is advised. Again perception and reaction time.

This is just good advice all the way around. I think the self defense benefits are a stretch for most people. But seeing what's going on around you helps you avoid walking into signs, into the street or into other physical harm. And being seen, particularly on dark roads, is a very good idea. Wearing a reflective vest is also a darn good idea, in addition to carrying a flashlight (tactical or otherwise).

 

[Juany118]

This is just good advice all the way around. I think the self defense benefits are a stretch for most people. But seeing what's going on around you helps you avoid walking into signs, into the street or into other physical harm. And being seen, particularly on dark roads, is a very good idea. Wearing a reflective vest is also a darn good idea, in addition to carrying a flashlight (tactical or otherwise).

Oh I know it's good advice all around but I look at the cell phone thing from an experience my brother had. He is now a contractor who does rehabs and new construction but used to be someone who rehabbed house to flip or rent as Section 8. He was in one of "those" neighborhoods, walking from the house to his car talking on his IPhone. He is now a Samsung guy because he didn't have insurance. A thug came up, cold cocked him took the phone and ran. When he got to the store they had a deal on the S5 with a free tablet. He learned his lesson the hard way.

That said I think two things are often overlooked in TMA classes when it comes to self defense.

1. Overall situational awareness when not in a fight.
2. That sometimes kicking the bad guy in the knee and running to a place of safety is the best course to stay in one piece BUT you need to know where safety is to pull that off.

 

[drop bear]

This is just good advice all the way around. I think the self defense benefits are a stretch for most people. But seeing what's going on around you helps you avoid walking into signs, into the street or into other physical harm. And being seen, particularly on dark roads, is a very good idea. Wearing a reflective vest is also a darn good idea, in addition to carrying a flashlight (tactical or otherwise).

Used to be when phones were worth something. Because they were a target for a snatch and grab. Not so much now.

 

[Buka]

Years ago we used to warn against jogging with headphones on. No need any more, cell phones and nifty mobile devices took over. How long do you figure you would have to wait to find somebody not paying attention because they were preoccupied by their mobile device? Five minutes?

Or just a nice snatch and grab.

It's like attacking lambs drinking water.

 

[drop bear]

Years ago we used to warn against jogging with headphones on. No need any more, cell phones and nifty mobile devices took over. How long do you figure you would have to wait to find somebody not paying attention because they were preoccupied by their mobile device? Five minutes?

Or just a nice snatch and grab.

It's like attacking lambs drinking water.

I have seen dudes grab handbags from a car. That gets pretty intense.

 

[Ademadis]

What shoes I'm wearing is normally a quick consideration for me. Kicking quickly in walking boots is normally a lot harder than in trainers.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Years ago we used to warn against jogging with headphones on. No need any more, cell phones and nifty mobile devices took over. How long do you figure you would have to wait to find somebody not paying attention because they were preoccupied by their mobile device? Five minutes?

Or just a nice snatch and grab.

It's like attacking lambs drinking water.

Yeah, this is one of the ongoing challenges in teaching SD. More and more, people are absorbed with something that's not in their real environment (as opposed to their virtual environment). I've even started talking a bit about how to use your smartphone in public, making sure you're not entirely absorbed in the screen in an area where awareness should be higher. For instance, an airport is a relatively safer territory, given the lack of weapons and presence of security, than a street corner.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

What shoes I'm wearing is normally a quick consideration for me. Kicking quickly in walking boots is normally a lot harder than in trainers.

Agreed, and kicking high-ish is more risky in dress shoes with leather soles than in trainers.

 

[Buka]

Yeah, this is one of the ongoing challenges in teaching SD. More and more, people are absorbed with something that's not in their real environment (as opposed to their virtual environment). I've even started talking a bit about how to use your smartphone in public, making sure you're not entirely absorbed in the screen in an area where awareness should be higher. For instance, an airport is a relatively safer territory, given the lack of weapons and presence of security, than a street corner.

And just last night I barked at a half dozen different folks who were crossing the street (against a green light) pulling their suitcases, heads down reading things on their phones as cars just missed them. There was no beeping of horns, though, the drivers were too preoccupied either looking for the passengers they were supposed to pick up, reading posted signs to see where they were supposed to go - or looking at their phones.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

And just last night I barked at a half dozen different folks who were crossing the street (against a green light) pulling their suitcases, heads down reading things on their phones as cars just missed them. There was no beeping of horns, though, the drivers were too preoccupied either looking for the passengers they were supposed to pick up, reading posted signs to see where they were supposed to go - or looking at their phones.

Yikes! Yep, there the street meets the airport. It's reasonably safe inside. Outside there be cars with distracted drivers.

 

[drop bear]

If you are fighting on a slippery surface prevention is achieved by picking your ground to fight on.

Otherwise almost anything can send you to the deck. And the cure is being able to recover quickly.

The reason for this is if you are fighting and you don't have the coolest head you are inclined to throw bombs.

So there are your good safe falls but they can also land you a bit vulnerable to follow up attacks.

You can increase the risk of falling a bit harder with the pay of of springing up and reengaging more quickly.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

If you are fighting on a slippery surface prevention is achieved by picking your ground to fight on.

Otherwise almost anything can send you to the deck. And the cure is being able to recover quickly.

The reason for this is if you are fighting and you don't have the coolest head you are inclined to throw bombs.

So there are your good safe falls but they can also land you a bit vulnerable to follow up attacks.

You can increase the risk of falling a bit harder with the pay of of springing up and reengaging more quickly.

Either you're replying to someone I have on ignore, or you're not as coherent in this comment as you usually are. Or I've suddenly developed some form of reading disorder. I can only reply to the first point, because I'm lost on your last three sentences.

I agree about awareness of your surroundings and retreating to better ground if possible. There can be limitations (sudden attacks, for instance) that take that choice away, but that's a situation with less control in almost every way.

 

[drop bear]

Either you're replying to someone I have on ignore, or you're not as coherent in this comment as you usually are. Or I've suddenly developed some form of reading disorder. I can only reply to the first point, because I'm lost on your last three sentences.

I agree about awareness of your surroundings and retreating to better ground if possible. There can be limitations (sudden attacks, for instance) that take that choice away, but that's a situation with less control in almost every way.

It was a more nuanced idea than i really had the ability to express well.

There are all these little side issues that make up risk and reward of fighting on unsafe ground.

If you want to get up quick you have to fall half getting up.

If you fall half getting up you could just cripple yourself during the fall.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

It was a more nuanced idea than i really had the ability to express well.

There are all these little side issues that make up risk and reward of fighting on unsafe ground.

If you want to get up quick you have to fall half getting up.

If you fall half getting up you could just cripple yourself during the fall.

AH! That makes sense. Yeah, that's true for many falls. One of the things I work with students on is how to go from a good fall (more important on hard surfaces than on the mats - training on dirt and practice on carpet reminds me of that) to a defensive position as quickly as possible.

Makes me want to have a suit made of grappling mats - take my damned mats with me, I will!

 

[Mattattack]

Interesting convo. Important too. Most people think Self Defense is punching and kicking and not as simple as paying attention on the walk to the car.

An Aikido teacher I met told me a story that I retell to lots of people when we talk about self defense: "I was visiting some old friends in Chicago, but my wife and I had to park on a bad block. When we went to get our car, we saw a group of teenagers looking us over before backing into a shadowy alley between us and our car. We went the other way and came back later. That was the best Aikido I ever did."

I think its a great story because it illustrates how martial arts is only a part of self defense. And on that note, I wanted to share this chart that I have used when I taught some very basic self defense to illustrate that same point.

 

[Juany118]

Interesting convo. Important too. Most people think Self Defense is punching and kicking and not as simple as paying attention on the walk to the car.

An Aikido teacher I met told me a story that I retell to lots of people when we talk about self defense: "I was visiting some old friends in Chicago, but my wife and I had to park on a bad block. When we went to get our car, we saw a group of teenagers looking us over before backing into a shadowy alley between us and our car. We went the other way and came back later. That was the best Aikido I ever did."

I think its a great story because it illustrates how martial arts is only a part of self defense. And on that note, I wanted to share this chart that I have used when I taught some very basic self defense to illustrate that same point.

A nice take on the UoF continuum we use at work. Also a very true lesson.

 

[wingchun100]

When in a crowded bar, I would always walk through the throngs of drunken people with one hand on my chest, as if I were constantly scratching it. This is because I did not want my hands to be both pinned to my sides if some alpha male approached me to start something. It might sound silly, but there was actually a time where I deflected someone's attempt to give me a one-handed shove. By the time the deflection was over, I had my other hand up...and they reconsidered taking it any further.

 

[wingchun100]

This one happened when I wasn't even on foot.

I remember driving home from a bar with my girlfriend. We were going up a one-way street when a black SUV turned on the road behind us, and the driver gunned the car so that he caught up to us. They were right on my tail. I came to a stop sign and took a left. Behind us, the SUV paused at the same sign, took a left, and once again GUNNED THE ENGINE so they were right on top of us again. At this point we were almost home, but I drove past my house.

My girlfriend said, "Why did you go past your place?"

I said, "I'm not stopping at my house so this weirdo behind us knows where I live. I'm going to see if he keeps on following us...right to the police station in downtown Troy. Get your phone ready to call 911 because if he is still following us when we're almost there, I want you to call and let them know so they can tell some cops to be outside the precinct waiting for this idiot."

As it turned out, we didn't have to do that because the next time I took a turn, the SUV went in the opposite direction.