Systema instructer murdered

[ginshun]

Here is a link to the story.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/cdh/20050308/lo_cdh/atelephonecallthentwodead

My teacher told us about it last night in class. We don't do too much systema stuff in our school, only a little bit in some disarms. Apperently one of my teachers friends studied with this guy for a while though.

My condolences go out to his family, and I hope that they find out what happened.

Have any of you guys heard about this?

 

[Tgace]

"With his experience, I don't know how this could happen," his wife said.

And there is one of the biggest problems/myths surrounding martial arts "experts". Theres nobody that cant be killed. By anybody else......

 

[rutherford]

This story says that there were no guns:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...=chi-newslocalnearwest-hed&ctrack=1&cset=true

 

[loki09789]

And there is one of the biggest problems/myths surrounding martial arts "experts". Theres nobody that cant be killed. By anybody else......

Tom,

That isn't you in the Avatar of the SWAT officers is it?

 

[Tgace]

Tom,

That isn't you in the Avatar of the SWAT officers is it?

No...

Apparently somebody didnt like my statement on this thread. I guess they want this to be a memorial thread. My apologies if I offended anybody. This person didnt need to die and my sympathy goes out to his family and friends. However I find it interesting how whenever a martial arts "expert" is killed the media mentions the fact as if its earth shattering. The more we promote the "martial arts master as invincible" myth, we will continue to focus on fighting technique as king in self protection. Instead of the other 99% of stuff that actually keeps us alive.

Beyond that....

:asian:

 

[Cruentus]

No...

Apparently somebody didnt like my statement on this thread. I guess they want this to be a memorial thread. My apologies if I offended anybody. This person didnt need to die and my sympathy goes out to his family and friends. However I find it interesting how whenever a martial arts "expert" is killed the media mentions the fact as if its earth shattering. The more we promote the "martial arts master as invincible" myth, we will continue to focus on technique as king in self protection. Instead of the other 99% of stuff that actually keeps us alive.

Beyond that....

:asian:

Those are good points that need to be considered.

I started a new thread in the memorial section for the purpose of paying respects in the appropriate section here: http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=361570#post361570

That way, we can continue with on topic discussions here, and memorials can be done there...

Paul

 

[Tgace]

:asian:

 

[Tgace]

This phenomena is in the same vein as when a killer is mentioned as a "former Marine". Note you seldom hear if a criminal was a "former Airman", "former Sailor", etc. As if former Marines should be incapable of such acts.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Arkadiy was a great supporter of our magazine, and every contact I had with him was a pleasure. I could tell he was really excited about his art and life in general.

My condolences to his friends and family on their loss.

 

[Tgace]

Sounds now like the two were killed by knife and fist after being called to the scene...I wonder what the **** was going on there?

 

[ginshun]

Ya, that is even wierder that now it seems they were beaten and stabbed.


As far as the wifes comments, I'd like to think that she means that he would have been smart/experienced enough to not put himself in a situation like this in the first place, as opposed to thinking that he was invinsible. Who really knows though, its hard to interpret out of context statements when you don't know the person.

Thats crazy that a Systema instructer was killed in a knife fight though, makes you wonder who the other guy was. Obvously knife fights are crazy things, and anything can happen, but of all the people.

 

[loki09789]

Apparently somebody didnt like my statement on this thread. I guess they want this to be a memorial thread. My apologies if I offended anybody. This person didnt need to die and my sympathy goes out to his family and friends.
:asian:

My apologies as well, I got dinged for the possible interp of disrespect. As Janulis mentioned about moving it to the memorial page, since it was posted in one of the Art topic areas, I took it on tangent with no intention of offending.

Tom makes a good point about 'self defense focused' training. The reality is that technical/tactical hand to hand training is only a SMALL component of the overall package of skills for real world survival in a physically/socially/legally dangerous world.

We need to be versed, if not highly proficient, in the physical techniques that will help us survive/escape an attack (to include at least basic first aid as well).

But, we should also be aware of the 'social/awareness' aspect (human interaction/'people' skills, communication skills, situational awareness, memorization/recall skills....) and the 'legal' area as well (Use of force laws, weapons carry laws, 'banned weapons lists', reporting/responding procedures...).

I know at least 4 BB's that are students in my school that could kick the crap out of me in a 'fair fight' if I matched up with them on the matt, but have no idea of the other areas for street application to see and avoid or report after the fact an incident that might occur....very one dementionally focused.

BUT, that is what they want out of the training - the physical skills/personal development aspect. I don't fault them for what they know, I just shake my head when they dillude themselves into thinking that what they know is ALL they need to know.

 

[RachelK]

Mrs. Stepankovskiy said "With his experience, I don't know how this could happen." She didn't say "With his martial arts experience, I don't know how this could happen." Systema was obviously a big part of Arkadiy Stepankovskiy's life, but it wasn't the sum of his experience. I interpreted her comment the way Ginshun did, but I don't know Mrs. Stepankovskiy, either. She has suffered a tragic loss and perhaps her comment to the press shouldn't be taken too literally.
Requiescat in pace Arkadiy.
Respectfully,
Rachel

 

[NYCRonin]

None here - were there. None.

There is one thing to consider though. Regardless of ones technical skill, if one is protecting another for some reason....and ones skills just cannot catch the threat, then a certain type of individual will, willingly; take that threat upon himself. Consider this.

None here - were there.

The entire Systema community feels the loss of a 'good person'....and Arkadiy was a good person.
He will be loved, remembered and missed by so many.

 

[loki09789]

None here - were there. None.

There is one thing to consider though. Regardless of ones technical skill, if one is protecting another for some reason....and ones skills just cannot catch the threat, then a certain type of individual will, willingly; take that threat upon himself. Consider this.

None here - were there.

The entire Systema community feels the loss of a 'good person'....and Arkadiy was a good person.
He will be loved, remembered and missed by so many.

And the discussion has turned from a 'him' discussion to a 'training' discussion. My comments are/were not intended to be critical of him specifically but a tendency for the martial arts world to focus on technical/physical training but still call it 'self defense' when 'self defense' requires so much more in skill.

There is a memorial thread intended to address discussions about 'him' and the specific circumstances.

 

[rutherford]

My comments are/were not intended to be critical of him specifically but a tendency for the martial arts world to focus on technical/physical training but still call it 'self defense' when 'self defense' requires so much more in skill.

And your comment strikes me strangely. I don't know if I should call it a sense of the ironic, or surreal, but it's definitely not what I would expect, this being a Systema forum.

The whole Systema philosophy is counter to what you call the tendency of the martial arts world.

 

[Tgace]

Police offered no explanation for the slayings, she said. She says she has never heard of Drobetskiy and doesn't know his connection to Arkadiy.


"I want to know how my husband got caught up in this," she said. "He was a good man. He was a great, great father and a great, great husband."

How prevalent is Russian organized crime in Chicago? I wonder if there is any "protection racket" issues involved in owning a storefront/dojo around that mall. Sounds sort of "godfatherish" but it does happen. Either way, this man appears to have gotten between a friend and some bad people. I hope the police act quickly.

 

[Tgace]

And what about this?

Mallard Lake resident Mary Hirsch jumped out of bed after she heard gunshots outside her apartment building. The first four came in rapid succession, she said.

 

[ginshun]

I know, I read that too, but then the coroner says that neither of them was killed by a gun, but instead by a knife. Weird.

I wonder what the deal with the guy that is injured is?

 

[Tgace]

Since the cops are tight lipped, I predict that they have a solid lead/suspect and are closing in...dont want to tip their hand.