Six core elements

[mograph]

Now if we're talking biofeedback, we may want to talk to this fellow. He studies Chen style.
Nice chap, by the way.

UC Irvine - Faculty Profile System

He studies "physiological changes in mind/body functions and bioenergy fields associated with mind-body practices and acupuncture therapy, two major modalities of complementary and alternative medicine."

 

[Minghe]

I just thought lets make peace and move on, I asked him about his research as pertained to White Crane as it may have had some merit and he went all "nutso" on me, claimed I was baiting him etc. So I told him not to flatter himself that much!

Secondly, Sifu Sergio's book is an interesting read. Do I think it's right and correct? No, it is an interesting read but nothing of any real substance comes out of it other than a bit of an extended promo for him and the IWKA. I found the way he explained Hendrik's stuff to have more merit than Hendrik's explanations but again nothing is proven as historically accurate.

As for Hendrik, Well I have learned my lesson!

 

[Hendrik]

This is exactly the type of person . Pretend to be nice but with an agenda of wanting something from me.

When i told him exactly as the folllwing . Look how he behave now.


"Go study with some one who is the real master. That is the only advise i can give you. You idea above is non realistic because you were never train to handle this job yet.

Face it. You want my assessment i have given it to you proffesionally. The rest is your freedom of choice

I woud not be able to help you

I dont practice white crane."

I Encourage Ron to post the message record between him and me.

I just thought lets make peace and move on, I asked him about his research as pertained to White Crane as it may have had some merit and he went all "nutso" on me, claimed I was baiting him etc. So I told him not to flatter himself that much!

Secondly, Sifu Sergio's book is an interesting read. Do I think it's right and correct? No, it is an interesting read but nothing of any real substance comes out of it other than a bit of an extended promo for him and the IWKA. I found the way he explained Hendrik's stuff to have more merit than Hendrik's explanations but again nothing is proven as historically accurate.

As for Hendrik, Well I have learned my lesson!

 

[Minghe]

Hendrik,

Thank you for posting above, It now allows me to address the actual facts!

1/. It was you, not I who copied and posted my apology from the KFO Forum here on Martial Talk. You did this. Not I.

2/. You did so because you wanted people here to know and because you thought it served your own agenda to do so.

3/. I reached out to you to apologise and to be your friend.

4/. You fully accepted this apology in writing!

5/. At no time did I "Bait" you. I did however ask you for your opinion and sharing of your research that applied to the link between White Crane and Wing Chun. I did so as a friend and stated that I would give you credit where credit was due .... this is hardly "Baiting" you!

6/. You fully accepted my apology only to state later on that I was "Not sincere in my apology" and that I had in your opinion an "Hidden Agenda".This would indicate and lead most normal people to then look upon your actions as not being sincere i.e "Accepting my apology" only to go back on your word, in brief a liar!

You then strongly stated words to the effect "that Lee Kong was not all that skilled at White Crane Gongfu" (This is not a direct quote but summerizes what you had written) and Hendrick,I did screen capture what was said as you have a strong history of "deleting" things once written!

You also went on state words to the effect of along the lines of: "Information (Research) does not help as one needs as one needs solid indepth kungfu". (This is not a direct quote but summerizes what you had written)

At no time have I repeated or posted what was stated exactly via the Facebook Private conversation we had. I told you that to do so would be unethical, unprofessional and wrong.

I have however summarized the above to show the level of you obvious hubris, paranoia and outright insincerity.

I did want to work with you as both a friend and as professional but you are unable to get beyond the past, your problem not mine I will no longer defend you either as you are just plain arrogant and think you are above other people.

 

[Minghe]

Hendrik: I repeat:

At no time have I repeated or posted what was stated exactly via the Facebook Private conversation we had. I told you that to do so would be unethical, unprofessional and wrong.

 

[Vajramusti]

Hendrik,

Thank you for posting above, It now allows me to address the actual facts!

1/. It was you, not I who copied and posted my apology from the KFO Forum here on Martial Talk. You did this. Not I.

2/. You did so because you wanted people here to know and because you thought it served your own agenda to do so.

3/. I reached out to you to apologise and to be your friend.

4/. You fully accepted this apology in writing!

5/. At no time did I "Bait" you. I did however ask you for your opinion and sharing of your research that applied to the link between White Crane and Wing Chun. I did so as a friend and stated that I would give you credit where credit was due .... this is hardly "Baiting" you!

6/. You fully accepted my apology only to state later on that I was "Not sincere in my apology" and that I had in your opinion an "Hidden Agenda".This would indicate and lead most normal people to then look upon your actions as not being sincere i.e "Accepting my apology" only to go back on your word, in brief a liar!

You then strongly stated words to the effect "that Lee Kong was not all that skilled at White Crane Gongfu" (This is not a direct quote but summerizes what you had written) and Hendrick,I did screen capture what was said as you have a strong history of "deleting" things once written!

You also went on state words to the effect of along the lines of: "Information (Research) does not help as one needs as one needs solid indepth kungfu". (This is not a direct quote but summerizes what you had written)

At no time have I repeated or posted what was stated exactly via the Facebook Private conversation we had. I told you that to do so would be unethical, unprofessional and wrong.

I have however summarized the above to show the level of you obvious hubris, paranoia and outright insincerity.

I did want to work with you as both a friend and as professional but you are unable to get beyond the past, your problem not mine I will no longer defend you either as you are just plain arrogant and think you are above other people.

 

[Vajramusti]

My advise FWIW- just leave Hendrik alone.

 

[Xue Sheng]

My advise FWIW- just leave Hendrik alone.

Agreed, he is It the perfect example of someone who wants to waste our time and not help us spend it....

 

[seasoned]

Ladies & gentlemen...

Scientific investigation and friendly meet ups can always be interesting. But we're not in the business of proving claims here, and challenges to fight are absolutely forbidden. Let's try to keep the discussion on a friendly and polite basis, OK?

jks9199
Administrator

As a reminder for those that missed it, this warning was placed a short time ago and still stands. Any further disruptions will result in ignoring Moderator warnings.

The Moderator Team.

 

[Hendrik]

1. You come to me asking for my forgiveness , help, and information. Instead of me contacting you.

2. I give you my proffesional reply be it in public or private it will be the same.

3. I post my advise to you that is mine.

4. We have never sign any non disclosure agreement. And I am not interested in your information.



You just don't like it that I don't go with your plan and satisfy your demand. You recent posts and private message just exactly prove by evidence that in your mind, there is only demand and blaming others.

There is no common between you and me. So, it is time to drop all of this " you dont satisfied my demand so I am going to punish you " mentality.


I don't mind , in fact, I would like you to publish all our message record to the public . Please make my day. Published it. If you like to. Let even Lee kong see what is my view on him. I am free to have my view . And not shy to open it to the public. As anyone are free to have their view on me

Hendrik,

Thank you for posting above, It now allows me to address the actual facts!

1/. It was you, not I who copied and posted my apology from the KFO Forum here on Martial Talk. You did this. Not I.

2/. You did so because you wanted people here to know and because you thought it served your own agenda to do so.

3/. I reached out to you to apologise and to be your friend.

4/. You fully accepted this apology in writing!

5/. At no time did I "Bait" you. I did however ask you for your opinion and sharing of your research that applied to the link between White Crane and Wing Chun. I did so as a friend and stated that I would give you credit where credit was due .... this is hardly "Baiting" you!

6/. You fully accepted my apology only to state later on that I was "Not sincere in my apology" and that I had in your opinion an "Hidden Agenda".This would indicate and lead most normal people to then look upon your actions as not being sincere i.e "Accepting my apology" only to go back on your word, in brief a liar!

You then strongly stated words to the effect "that Lee Kong was not all that skilled at White Crane Gongfu" (This is not a direct quote but summerizes what you had written) and Hendrick,I did screen capture what was said as you have a strong history of "deleting" things once written!

You also went on state words to the effect of along the lines of: "Information (Research) does not help as one needs as one needs solid indepth kungfu". (This is not a direct quote but summerizes what you had written)

At no time have I repeated or posted what was stated exactly via the Facebook Private conversation we had. I told you that to do so would be unethical, unprofessional and wrong.

I have however summarized the above to show the level of you obvious hubris, paranoia and outright insincerity.

I did want to work with you as both a friend and as professional but you are unable to get beyond the past, your problem not mine I will no longer defend you either as you are just plain arrogant and think you are above other people.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Lets see post #40

Good luck to all. So long, good bye!

and then post #75

欲加之罪，何患无辞。

Here on I leave this forum forever.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Well, yes, that would make sense to a sensible person. However none of that is what Hendrick seems to be proposing. He's talking about proving his claims in a biofeedback lab, which has nothing to do with power generation of any sort. That would seem to leave a couple of possibilities:

1) He is interested in proving some sort of unspecified theory on some subject other than methods of hitting hard.
or...
2) He is spouting meaningless pseudo-scientific technobabble in an effort to appropriate the authority of science for whatever theory of martial arts practice he is trying to promote.

Unless he chooses to clarify what point he is trying to make with his references to scientific proof and laboratories, we'll just have to guess which of the two apply.

I though we could have a deep level discussion on "WC power generation method" in this thread.

 

[Hendrik]

I though we could have a deep level discussion on "WC power generation method" in this thread.

1. Not the way how everyone wants march their own direction

2. Does biofeedback related to force flow element one of the six core elements? Yes. All the six core elements are interelated and with the modern biofeedback equipment one can monitor to some degree.

 

[Hendrik]

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

1. Not the way how everyone wants march their own direction

2. Does biofeedback related to force flow element one of the six core elements? Yes. All the six core elements are interelated and with the modern biofeedback equipment one can monitor to some degree.

But why does Biofeedback have anything to do with MA? If "health" is the only thing that you care about, why do you even care about "power generation" at all?

I thought "6 core elements" has something to do with "fist meets face", am I wrong?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Biofeedback is the process of gaining greater awareness of many physiological functions primarily using instruments that provide information on the activity of those same systems, with a goal of being able to manipulate them at will.[1][2] Some of the processes that can be controlled include brainwaves, muscle tone,skin conductance, heart rate and pain perception.[3]

Biofeedback may be used to improve health, performance, and the physiological changes that often occur in conjunction with changes to thoughts, emotions, and behavior. Eventually, these changes may be maintained without the use of extra equipment, for no equipment is necessarily required to practice biofeedback.[2]

Biofeedback has been found to be effective for the treatment of headaches and migraines.[4][5]

 

[Tez3]

But why does Biofeedback have anything to do with MA?

I'm so glad you said that! I was wondering that and thought it was just me. As it's a WC thread I thought there was something I was missing!

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I'm so glad you said that! I was wondering that and thought it was just me. As it's a WC thread I thought there was something I was missing!

When combat/self-defense discussion mix with

- health,
- self-cultivation, and
- inner peace,

the discussion can get lost very quickly.

 

[Transk53]

If I get this right, @Hendrik has a beef about the article not outwardly giving enough credit. Then come on MT for the purpose of moaning about that. Moaning tends to illicit the "shut the #### up" as usually required. So why bother

 

[geezer]

I'm so glad you said that! I was wondering that and thought it was just me. As it's a WC thread I thought there was something I was missing!

Hmmm. IMO you haven't missed anything worth your time here.

Power generation is an interesting topic. When dealt with practically. Too much woo-woo here for my tastes. And too much pointless bickering. I'll go away now. Might check back in on this in a couple of days ...or might not.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Will we ever be able to see a clip that used the "6 core elements" principle to punch on a heavy bag, or even punch into the thin air? Someone who trains in "6 core elements" should produce that clip and put up online so we can end this discussion nicely.