Shawn Obasi & Emin Boztepe friendly Chi-sau

[jeff_hasbrouck]

These are a couple of vids I'm pulling off my buddies Sifu Alex Wallenwein's Wing Tsun FB page.

Has Mr. Obasi Rolling with Emin, Randy Williams and Sam Kwok.

- Obasi & Sifu Boztepe

- Obasi & Sifu Kwok

- Obasi & Sifu Williams



A lot of people talk big-time smack about Obasi, which I hope we don't see in this thread. But reguardless, I'm just really glad to see someone from our martial family getting in the ring


Enjoy folks!


Jeff

 

[knight2000]

Sorry but he was being an *** with Randy Williams. He is lucky that Randy held back. I can't stand people who make chi Sao a battle. It is not intended to be a match of skills

 

[WTchap]

I'd seen the Randy Williams clip and the Sam Kwok clip, but not the one with Emin. Very nice - never had the chance to meet Emin, but I'd love to... seems like a nice guy as well as a skilled one.

 

[K-man]

I'm sure that someone will come on board and point out what they are doing wrong but from my point of view, where I try to train an uneducated type of Chi Sau, in a karate context, I really enjoyed the first two videos. Once again, from a position of ignorance, I thought the third video was a bit physical. :asian:

 

[mook jong man]

The Shaun Obasi dude tends to lean a bit so that would make him susceptible to being pivoted.
Being a small guy the thing I notice with some big guys in Chi Sau is that they tend to do a fair bit of grabbing and also a lot of pushing your forearms back with their palms in an effort to keep you off balance and to keep you out of range from hitting them.

With the grabbing all you have to do is swing your elbow over the top of his wrist and drop it down , it breaks the grab and pulls them down into a strike.
To counter the constant pushing back with the palms pivoting works quite well.

Now the thing I noticed with the first two masters is that they maintained their optimum angles and always had forward force on.
With the third clip I felt that the masters angles were too close to his body and in some instances were even collapsed by this Shaun Obasi dude.

In my opinion against a big strong guy like Mr Shaun Obasi , Mr Williams should have been doing a lot more pivoting to try and negate that size and strength advantage that Mr Obasi had over him.
Pivoting is a must in situations like that or you are just going to get thrown all over the place like a rag doll.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

Sorry but he was being an *** with Randy Williams. He is lucky that Randy held back. I can't stand people who make chi Sao a battle. It is not intended to be a match of skills

Your right about him being an *** with Sifu Williams. Now not trying to discredit him, but he (Sifu Williams) isn't that great. I've watched many many docs and interviews with Sifu Williams, and theoretically I think he is spot on. But practically I think his WC isn't good at all. Again not to dis-credit his WC or anything. I like Sifu Williams humble nature, he never claims (that I remember) to be some mystic grand-master or a great fighter. Just a humble practitioner that passes his knowledge onto some students. I'm definately down with his mentality.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

I'd seen the Randy Williams clip and the Sam Kwok clip, but not the one with Emin. Very nice - never had the chance to meet Emin, but I'd love to... seems like a nice guy as well as a skilled one.

He (Emin) used to run our headquarters (NAS). My old 'Sifu' has a bunch of pictures with him and a boat-load of stories. Emin is a real-deal kinda guy. A true warrior. You can easily see this by comparing the footage with him and Obasi, rather than the Sifu Williams and Sifu Kwok. Emin easily controls Obasi. It really is effortless with him. The other two clips you don't sense as much control by the other Sifu's. This isn't a "style" or a "branch" thing, this is just Emin is a bad-***. It's the clips like these that made me choose Leung Ting WT. Seeing old Emin clips and Kernshpecht, and some of the other really good Euro guys like Bernd Wagner (RIP), or 'Dai'-Sifu Norbert Madai. They all have insane skills, and thats what I want. If any other WT guys could help me out and remember the other really good Euro guy. I can't remember his name, but he is flipin awesome as well. Sifu Jeff Webb is under him now I believe.

All the best,



Jeff

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

Heinrich Pfaff is the other Euro guy I was thinking of a minute ago. This is more of a "glamour" clip than anything else, but its the first one I found and one I've seen a thousand times. Another flashy clip I used to really enjoy.

 

[geezer]

...Sifu Jeff Webb is under him now I believe.

No, Jeff Webb runs the totally independent "NVTO" (see the link in my signature). But you're right, he knows many of the top EWTO guys and has maintained a close friendship with some of them over the years. He started his training here in the states under LT and then served in the U.S. Air Force and was stationed in Germany where he trained in the EWTO. I believe the EWTO influence is apparent if you compare the "flavor" and quality his technique to that of your old instructor, Will and others (including me) who just trained here in the States.

Now back to the topic of WC leg-work and kicks. Some people just have superior skills, man. Of course they may train like beasts too, But I could train for a lifetime and not have leg skills like that. Sometimes I wonder if kids who grow up raised on soccer might not have different athletic aptitudes from someone from a different culture. Sure kids here love soccer, but most move on to the popular sports like football, basketball, baseball and so on as they get older. I, for example, was never a great athlete, but grew up in the shadow of my big brother, a state champion wrestler. Instincts learned in childhood stick with you, you know.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

I remember Sifu Webb splitting, and I knew that he started his own thing. He took some of our guys from the San Antonio kwoon. I had heard from my si-hing he was training with Pfaff (or under him) because when Sifu Webb left he had just got his 5th I believe a year or so before, and he didn't finish the knives by that point. Whatever the case, I really enjoyed rolling with Sifu Webb. Ya he's a little chubby, but man can he go go go. His precision and speed are really good. He in my eyes earned the title of master.

 

[blindsage]

Those are three very different videos. The first one is like a demonstration and at no point does Obasi put the kind of hard pressure on that he does in the Williams video. The second video looks like a friendly exchange except Obasi seems kind of lost as what the point of chi-sau is. In the last it seems like one person is trying to prove something (Obasi) and the other thought it was just going to be a friendly exchange. Not a really good comparison.

And it really seems to me that Obasi needs to go back and work on fundamentals some more.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

Those are three very different videos. The first one is like a demonstration and at no point does Obasi put the kind of hard pressure on that he does in the Williams video. The second video looks like a friendly exchange except Obasi seems kind of lost as what the point of chi-sau is. In the last it seems like one person is trying to prove something (Obasi) and the other thought it was just going to be a friendly exchange. Not a really good comparison.

And it really seems to me that Obasi needs to go back and work on fundamentals some more.

Well I'll just call a spade a spade. IMO Emin is better, pure and simple. Obasi doesn't have a chance with Emin. Emin is shutting him down before it ever begins. You don't see the other two doing that.

 

[mook jong man]

Those are three very different videos. The first one is like a demonstration and at no point does Obasi put the kind of hard pressure on that he does in the Williams video. The second video looks like a friendly exchange except Obasi seems kind of lost as what the point of chi-sau is. In the last it seems like one person is trying to prove something (Obasi) and the other thought it was just going to be a friendly exchange. Not a really good comparison.

And it really seems to me that Obasi needs to go back and work on fundamentals some more.

I learned the hard way very early on , never to fall for the "Let's just do some light rolling" line.
The first time someone almost broke my nose with an elbow strike , the second time someone tried to trap me and hit me in the throat.

When doing chi sau with unknown people always be "switched on".
Always be ready to go up a gear from "light rolling" into chi sau sparring and even to real fighting if need be.

 

[mook jong man]

Well I'll just call a spade a spade. IMO Emin is better, pure and simple. Obasi doesn't have a chance with Emin. Emin is shutting him down before it ever begins. You don't see the other two doing that.

It's true , you can see he hasn't just spent most of his time doing "light rolling".
He's put in some serious hours doing very vigorous chi sau sparring , probably with opponents that out weighed him by quite a bit.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Well I'll just call a spade a spade. IMO Emin is better, pure and simple. Obasi doesn't have a chance with Emin. Emin is shutting him down before it ever begins. You don't see the other two doing that.

I do not know Randy Williams but from what I watched I am fairly confident here that Samuel Kwok could do the same if he so desired.

 

[knight2000]

Kwok and Williams could both do the same thing. Seems like someone is Emin worshipping.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

I do not know Randy Williams but from what I watched I am fairly confident here that Samuel Kwok could do the same if he so desired.

Emin vs. Sifu Kwok, Emin would destroy him. He is just that damn good. And truth be told, if Sifu Kwok was that good you wouldn't see obasi being so pushy. But this is only my opinion. From my experience, you don't turn it "on" or "off", it is there or its not. And from what I see, its not.All the best,Jeff

 

[Xue Sheng]

kwok and williams could both do the same thing. seems like someone is emin worshipping.

qft

 

[Xue Sheng]

Emin vs. Sifu Kwok, Emin would destroy him. He is just that damn good. And truth be told, if Sifu Kwok was that good you wouldn't see obasi being so pushy. But this is only my opinion. From my experience, you don't turn it "on" or "off", it is there or its not. And from what I see, its not.All the best,Jeff

Well since I never mentioned Emin vs. Sifu Kwok I am not sure why that was even brought into it. As for the rest Kwok was blind folded so it was a demo and if Obasi did anything there he took advantage of the situation. Not saying anything for or against Obasi's skills just I do not think that was a match with Kwok nor do I feel Kwok saw it as such or took it seriously

 

[blindsage]

Well I'll just call a spade a spade. IMO Emin is better, pure and simple. Obasi doesn't have a chance with Emin. Emin is shutting him down before it ever begins. You don't see the other two doing that.

I wasn't commenting on skill level. I've only ever heard great things about Emin's skill, but at no point is Obasi even attempting the pressure he puts on Williams or even Kwok. The Emin video is not the same kind of video as the other two. It is not an exchange of chi sau, it is a demo for Emin.