Real Aikido Street Fight, maybe

Discussion in 'General Self Defense' started by JP3, Sep 1, 2017.

  1. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    Gun is used as "long range" weapon. You just don't find any video that teach you how to disarm "bow and arrow".

    [​IMG]
     
  2. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Gun should be used as a distance weapon. It isn't always used properly.
     
  3. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    Definitely a demo BUT against an untrained "street" attacker I have used what you see at ~13 seconds and ~16 seconds effectively. The take down in response to the kick is especially effective because most "street trained" people simply don't know how to effectively kick while minimizing your own exposure.
     
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  4. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    The thing is in a "typical" street encounter the person with the gun is trying to rob you. Because of this the tool is primarily there for intimidation value and they will often get rather close.
     
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  5. Didymus

    Didymus White Belt

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    For one, as soon as he's using it to "win a fight" it's no longer aikido, technically. That first one was a bit painful with extra motions... but I see some principles in there that come FROM aiki...
     
  6. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    This is the aspect of Ueshiba's Aikido I don't really like - for me, personally. In a self-defense situation, I care about the welfare of the attacker only after I've taken care of myself and any innocents involved. I am absolutely there to "win".
     
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  7. Didymus

    Didymus White Belt

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    And there are better styles to accomplish that. If that's what you're doing, it's not aikido.

    Doesn't mean an aikidoka is wrong if someone gets hurt... If they offer you force, and you correct them and direct their force down and they fail to fall properly, or resist and hurt THEMSELVES ... meh... That wasn't wise of them. You're still doing Aiki.

    But if you're putting your own force in TO try to hurt them, aiki isn't what you're doing.
     
  8. Didymus

    Didymus White Belt

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    Biggest time i use aiki is with my kids. I'm not trying to "win a fight" by hurting my opponent... but if they start flailing, doesn't take much to hold their hand a bit different for a nice gentle yonkyo. Shouldn't hurt at all, just doesn't mechanically allow for much choice in where they go. Now, they CAN experience some pain if they fight it hard enough, but that's just them making themselves uncomfortable.

    People get bored of fighting when they're the only one's involved.
     
  9. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    Not necessarily, it all depends on the Aikido you study. If you study Yoshinkan Aikido, as but one example, you are learning to "win" the fight.
     
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  10. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    The thing is more than a few Lineages whose "heads" we're "blessed" to teach by Ueshiba Sensei do teach to win. Yes he himself changed his personal attitudes but he never disavowed the manner of teaching of these personal students of his.
     
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  11. Fuhrer Drumpf

    Fuhrer Drumpf Orange Belt

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    Aikido and Judo branched from jujitsu at the same time. Aikido is all fluffy theory and Judo is practical. Note the differences between the styles.
     
  12. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    Not all Aikido. Aikido has a host of variations. You have those like Yoshinkan Aikido that are much closer to the Jiu-Jitsu roots. There is another, the name of which escapes me at the moment because I never studied it, which actually has a firm competition aspect which some of the "purists" question as much as they do Yoshinkan.

    At this point using the word Aikido is almost as broad a term as using the word karate.
     
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  13. Tarrycat

    Tarrycat Green Belt

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    I wonder who was Steven Seagal's teacher...:woot:
     
  14. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    As an example...

    This is Yoshinkan. Yes it's a demonstration but as you can see most of the techniques are much closer to Jiu-Jitsu. The "circles" are tighter, you don't just let go but use pain compliance (which can quickly move into a break or dislocation), many of the techniques are actually similar to those of Judo as well because they are both closer to the "root" than what Aikido EVENTUALLY became. One has to remember that the founder of Yoshinkan, Gozo Shioda, was one of the first students of the Ueshiba. What he learned from Ueshiba and what Ueshiba taught nearer the end of his life, we're different things. In Yoshinkan you will even enter with strikes if called for as the first example in the video shows us.
     
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  15. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    His style is named after the Tenshin Dojo. The difference between "his" Aikido, by their own admission, is not in style but in mindset. They use the more typical Aikido Techniques with a combative mindset. I have even read interviews with practitioners of the "Tenshin School" say that Yoshinkan and Tomiki count as separate styles but that they aren't different enough to qualify as such themselves.
     
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  16. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    That was Ueshiba’s interprétation of aiki - at least later in his life.
     
  17. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    That appears to be based on one area of Ueshiba’s art. There’s more Judo-like technique and “harder” options in some branches.
     
  18. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Tomiki is the one you were thinking of.
     
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  19. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Now I know why folks sometimes ask if Nihon Goshin Aikido is related to Yoshinkan. All I had seen in the past was some of Shioda’s old videos, and he moved differently in those than this instructor does.
     
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  20. Juany118

    Juany118 Senior Master

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    Agreed. I write off some of the videos of Shioda to two things. 1. Especially in the post 70's videos he is being a bit of a showman, and well he was born in 1915. 2. If you watch some of the videos closely he is just so damn good. He not only intimately knows his own body but the physics of what is going on that it is just eerie. In a video like the one I showed however you have a Sensei who is not just trying to demonstrate how good he is and the potential of what you CAN be if you master it. He is trying to show that it is a practical fighting art. Often in videos, as you well know, context is everything.
     
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