Professor Presas' non-FMA teachers

[Mark Lynn]

I seem to recall something about a Dr. friend of GM Remy's who was a karate practionar in the PI. I think I read this in a book, that this Dr. was a high level Shotokan instructor and that he and GM Remy were discussing the physical body mechanics of Shotokan (i.e. hip rotation stances etc. etc.) and that these discussions and such influeneced GM Remy in his development of the anyos and MA. I take it the time frame was such that this is when he was still in the PI, prior to his leaving them.

"By the time he came back to his hometown, Remy was already an expert in arnis and in other sports like Judo, Jujitsu, wrestling and Karate." ....."In 1969.....and founded the National Amateur Karate Organization"
Quoted from the Pink Book 1st U.S. edition.

This was at the time he started his gym in Manila.

"In 1970, Presas went to Japan on invitations of Japan Fuji Telecasting Corporation to exhibit Arnis to Japananese televiewers. He returned to that country in 1974 as a representive of the Ministry of Tourism of the Philippines to the Asian Tourism Fair to introduce this particular Philippine martial art."
Quoted from The Practical Art of Eskrima 3rd edition

From the above quotes it seems that GM Remy learned karate, judo, and jujitsu when he was living abroad after he left home at 14 and prior to his returning there. Then he very well could have learned some added techniques, information etc. etc. when he went to Japan but he learned his base of info in regards to these arts while in the PI.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Rich,

Remy did study some Doce' Paris' from Momoy, if you take a good look at his foot work in Espad Y Daga the Doce influence is very evident.



As far as his Judo from Momoy I don't know .......but it makes sense since Momoy was into Judo.......I just don't know for sure....



Rocky

Rocky,

I do not doubt you. Nor would I have doubted many other posters. I would have asked for some information and followup questions.

Yet Tom has been so wrong on so many topics on so many issues and points, that I now feel that if he does not show his proof, I have to at least question it.

For even if he later states he was trying to draw the link, that is not what was stated in his first point. He makes statements like they are fact untill peopel question it.

I also know he studied DP as some discussions he had with Jim and Jeff while I was being a nosey brat and listening. But I was tired of putting data out there for Tom to then decide that his research now agrees with those on every site I have visited. So, yes I questioned it and placed it with doubt. My Bad. But I wanted someone who's word had not been called into question to make the statement.

Thank you

 

[Rich Parsons]

I seem to recall something about a Dr. friend of GM Remy's who was a karate practionar in the PI. I think I read this in a book, that this Dr. was a high level Shotokan instructor and that he and GM Remy were discussing the physical body mechanics of Shotokan (i.e. hip rotation stances etc. etc.) and that these discussions and such influeneced GM Remy in his development of the anyos and MA. I take it the time frame was such that this is when he was still in the PI, prior to his leaving them.

"By the time he came back to his hometown, Remy was already an expert in arnis and in other sports like Judo, Jujitsu, wrestling and Karate." ....."In 1969.....and founded the National Amateur Karate Organization"
Quoted from the Pink Book 1st U.S. edition.

This was at the time he started his gym in Manila.

"In 1970, Presas went to Japan on invitations of Japan Fuji Telecasting Corporation to exhibit Arnis to Japananese televiewers. He returned to that country in 1974 as a representive of the Ministry of Tourism of the Philippines to the Asian Tourism Fair to introduce this particular Philippine martial art."
Quoted from The Practical Art of Eskrima 3rd edition

From the above quotes it seems that GM Remy learned karate, judo, and jujitsu when he was living abroad after he left home at 14 and prior to his returning there. Then he very well could have learned some added techniques, information etc. etc. when he went to Japan but he learned his base of info in regards to these arts while in the PI.

Mark,

Good points about checking the books.

I like that for I have done it still do it.

Thank you.
:asian:

 

[Rocky]

Rocky,

I do not doubt you. Nor would I have doubted many other posters. I would have asked for some information and followup questions.

Yet Tom has been so wrong on so many topics on so many issues and points, that I now feel that if he does not show his proof, I have to at least question it.

For even if he later states he was trying to draw the link, that is not what was stated in his first point. He makes statements like they are fact untill peopel question it.

I also know he studied DP as some discussions he had with Jim and Jeff while I was being a nosey brat and listening. But I was tired of putting data out there for Tom to then decide that his research now agrees with those on every site I have visited. So, yes I questioned it and placed it with doubt. My Bad. But I wanted someone who's word had not been called into question to make the statement.

Thank you

I know what you are
saying in fact that is why I quit posting for a long time, I can't begin to tell you how many high ranking people didn't know squat about many things until I posted then they acted like they knew it all the time. So I just said screw it until I put a DVD out I will not show Crssada DeMano or Palis Palis Silat, or Espada Y daga. If I never put out a DVD well then unless My kids want to learn it from tapes I leave them or if they are old enough to have learned then it dies with me...... to bad so sad!

As for Monkey I really don't read to much of his stuff , it gives me a head ach, in person he may be a great guy but man his post jump around more then a 10 Detroit Hoe! Sorry Monkey but its true.




Rocky

 

[monkey]

Rocky;
The post jump around are from when I have any were from 5-8 people post multi questions.Its hard enough to answer person with 10 questions asking for ranks ect then in the same breath they state they dont care of rank but who trained me.Then I tell them & they state I drop names.I felt these people were board members who would kick me off the site.I did my best
to answer (for an autistic person)

There are many post like" the interceting fist" I have done & others & recieved good reports.
Its too bad even now there still seems to be this & they probly will never
offer a fair & just shake.
They have made claims I lie Yet -the info I gave has been prooven Fact.
They see the bio of Ernesto as here say & not a bio.
They ask me for proof on the conete tie & I post the url for history of the art & it states conete line.
They come back & thank others yet put more on me for I did join their
sect & occult summonig of the great monkey.
Ive been honest--try & read the post of Mono y mono-Ajuken-& Kombaton.There will always be some one who for some resogn will
not like me for who I am & what I do be it my disability or not joining any
club they belong to.

 

[Brian Johns]

I'll have to double check but I believe that this Dr. friend is Dr. Guillermo Lengson. I do recall the story that Boar Man relates and believe that it involved Lengson.

Take care,
Brian Johns

I seem to recall something about a Dr. friend of GM Remy's who was a karate practionar in the PI. I think I read this in a book, that this Dr. was a high level Shotokan instructor and that he and GM Remy were discussing the physical body mechanics of Shotokan (i.e. hip rotation stances etc. etc.) and that these discussions and such influeneced GM Remy in his development of the anyos and MA. I take it the time frame was such that this is when he was still in the PI, prior to his leaving them.

"By the time he came back to his hometown, Remy was already an expert in arnis and in other sports like Judo, Jujitsu, wrestling and Karate." ....."In 1969.....and founded the National Amateur Karate Organization"
Quoted from the Pink Book 1st U.S. edition.

This was at the time he started his gym in Manila.

"In 1970, Presas went to Japan on invitations of Japan Fuji Telecasting Corporation to exhibit Arnis to Japananese televiewers. He returned to that country in 1974 as a representive of the Ministry of Tourism of the Philippines to the Asian Tourism Fair to introduce this particular Philippine martial art."
Quoted from The Practical Art of Eskrima 3rd edition

From the above quotes it seems that GM Remy learned karate, judo, and jujitsu when he was living abroad after he left home at 14 and prior to his returning there. Then he very well could have learned some added techniques, information etc. etc. when he went to Japan but he learned his base of info in regards to these arts while in the PI.

 

[Mark Lynn]

I'll have to double check but I believe that this Dr. friend is Dr. Guillermo Lengson. I do recall the story that Boar Man relates and believe that it involved Lengson.

Take care,
Brian Johns

Brian

This name sounds familar, but I can't recall where I read it.

Mark

 

[Cruentus]

I know what you are
saying in fact that is why I quit posting for a long time, I can't begin to tell you how many high ranking people didn't know squat about many things until I posted then they acted like they knew it all the time.

Rocky

I call that the "me too syndrom." I hate that when people do that... it happends a lot and it is very annoying.

I'll have to double check but I believe that this Dr. friend is Dr. Guillermo Lengson. I do recall the story that Boar Man relates and believe that it involved Lengson.

Take care,
Brian Johns

Hi Brian. That sounds like it might be a good possibility; Dr. Lengson was covered in one of Wiley's books, I believe, where I think he was recognized for Arnis Sikiron (sp? don't have my reference so I'm going by memory). If I recall reading from different sources that Dr. lengson also did some training in Japan (and possibly Korea).

According to Fred Lazo on the memories page, professor travelled to Japan with Ernesto and Dr. Lengson: http://www.martialtalk.com/remy/memories.html


It looks like on top of everything else, they did some Kendo as well.

I would bet that Ernesto or Dr. Lengson (or someone from that camp) would have these answers if asked.

This is kind of a cool thread - I love learning about the historical stuff.

Paul

 

[monkey]

Those last photos of Ernesto in the kendo uniform just help tell more of
the art that goes with my Arjuken certificate.
This art under Ernesto had Arnis--Judo--some Jumping High kick & Kendo.
The certificate is on what looks to be sheep skin type or rice paper.
There are a few Arnis figures & a few judo figures & yes, Kendo figures.
The certificate is aprrox. 14 x 16 & the figures are in red ink.

My 1981 Certificate from Remy has red figures around the outside on what looks like sheep skin or rice paper.There is a total of 11 sets of figures around the outside displaying various aspects of the art.
I'm glad this info is coming out,as it tells more of what the certificates mean now.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Those last photos of Ernesto in the kendo uniform just help tell more of
the art that gose with my Arjuken certifciate.
This art under Ernesto had Arnis--Judo-- & Kendo.
The cerficate is on what looks to be sheep skin type or rice paper.
There are a few Arnis figures & few judo figures & yes Kendo figures.
The certificate is aprrox 14 x 16 & the figures are in red ink.

My 1981 Certificate from Remy has red figures around the out side on what looks like sheep skin or rice paper.There are a total of 11 set of figures oround the out side dispaying verious aspects of the art.
Im glad this info is coming out,as it tells more of what the certificates mean now.

How does the first paragraph have anything to do with the title of this thread?

 

[monkey]

Tulisan had posted a url on the post #28 & I went to it. Scanning down the long history of how these people met Remy, ect. was an article from Fred Lazo.
Here he gave the history of the kendo & showed Ernesto pictured in kendo suit & then 1 shot w/ Ernesto vs Remy --Remy had no gear & Ernesto was still in the kendo suit.
The Arjuken that I was trained in had kendo influence & I didn't know from where.
Those photos now correlate with the certificate I have on the Arjuken.
Arnis Judo & Kendo Assoc.
The Remy certificate just had what was close range serrada on some-kuntao on others & balintawak on remaining photos around his certificate.

This is how it relates --go to post #28 & click on the url--There's even a thread on Holiford Jones & Remy.

 

[Mark Lynn]

I seem to recall something about a Dr. friend of GM Remy's who was a karate practionar in the PI. I think I read this in a book, that this Dr. was a high level Shotokan instructor and that he and GM Remy were discussing the physical body mechanics of Shotokan (i.e. hip rotation stances etc. etc.) and that these discussions and such influeneced GM Remy in his development of the anyos and MA. I take it the time frame was such that this is when he was still in the PI, prior to his leaving them.

Ran across the book at work today.

From WARRIOR ARTS OF THE PHILIPPINES by Reynaldo S. Galang
Pg 256 from an interview with Roland Dantes

Q How did Professor Remy Presas come up with the name Modern Arnis?
......
"One day when Professor Remy visited Dr. Guillermo Lengson in his clinic next door to the University of the East, they were discussing the hip movements in Karate. There was a book on Dr. Lengson's desk titled "Dynamic Karate written by Mastoshi Nakayama that laid open to chapter 2 which was dealing with applying the power in the hips.".....

So I got part of it right.

Just FYI I highly recommend this book.
Mark

 

[Dan Anderson]

Rich,

Remy did study some Doce' Paris' from Momoy, if you take a good look at his foot work in Espad Y Daga the Doce influence is very evident.
Rocky

In his video interview with Joe Rebelo, he says he got his twirling from Ciriaco "Cacoy" Canete. It is also written he got his sinawali training from Dr. Guillermo Lengson.

Yours,
Dan Anderson

 

[oosh]

Dr Guillermo Lengson also was instrumental in Master Christopher Ricketts development of the Sagasa Kickboxing system of Bakbakan - http://www.bakbakan.net/fightart.html