We have had two threads now that have touched upon the problems some people see with the "traditional" approach martial arts. So let's do a thread that summarizes and adds to it. The problems I have been seeing: 1. Many "traditional" arts don't spar at all. They spend the majority of their time training forms, and in the case of Wing Chun, doing Chi Sau. 2. When "traditional" arts do spar, they very often end up doing a form of somewhat sloppy kickboxing and an outside observer may have a hard time even determining what "traditional" art they represent. Very often no movements from the forms they have spent many hours working on are evident. 3. "Traditional" arts often hold back information. They are somewhat secretive and unwilling to share or talk about what they consider important elements of their system. Among their own students they may teach the "secrets" or the "good parts" to only a select few that demonstrate loyalty over many years. Or they may string out their curriculum over a long period of time simply to keep students coming and paying the tuition. 4. "Traditional" arts place too much value on the idea of "lineage." If a student does something that the teacher doesn't like, they are "disowned" or kicked out of the lineage. Then the teacher often devalues and dismisses that students background and training to try and discredit them. Leung Ting and William Cheung have done this to many students over the years. That was done to me as well. 5. "Traditional" arts often have a very narrow and specific way of defining their method and techniques. So if you depart from that, you are no longer doing their art....and, once again, you may get disowned from the lineage! I could problem come up with more after giving it a little thought! But what do you guys think?