Nunchaku & Bo Katas

[Gerry Seymour]

Staffs have been used as weapons since time immemorial, I doubt they needed to be invented from a stick to steer a boat. Sounds akin to the flying sidekick being used to kick a man off a horse.

I suspect that would be more accurately said something like, "The movement used with a bo to block a low kick may have been derived from the motion used to steer a boat with a pole." Even then, I question how often the movements were actually derived from those sources, versus that being used as an example to teach people who knew a similar movement.

 

[Tez3]

I suspect that would be more accurately said something like, "The movement used with a bo to block a low kick may have been derived from the motion used to steer a boat with a pole." Even then, I question how often the movements were actually derived from those sources, versus that being used as an example to teach people who knew a similar movement.

As any student from Oxford or Cambridge Universities can tell you one 'punts' a boat with a pole. One of the joys of Cambridge is sitting in a pub garden next to the river and watching people strand themselves on the pole as they watch the boat continue down the river on it's own.
video on here telling you how to do it, doesn't look like martial arts lol. Punt Hire Cambridge - Scudamore's Punting Cambridge

 

[Tarrycat]

I can do with some advice on this too. I'm using Nunchaku, for the fun of learning the skill, but I've hit myself in the face & in the head quite a few times now...

I think it's best to learn from an instructor & not from videos, like I do (Nunchaku in particular, not staffs). We don't train with Nunchaku in Ninjutsu, as far as my knowledge extends. It's an amazing tool though. I quite enjoy it at home... I may look like a VERY special person swinging it around like some barbarian, but at least I'm trying. I will look into some one-on-one Nunchaku training later on.

It used to fascinate me, because I found it rather difficult to work with when I was around 11 or 12 years old...

 

[jks9199]

I suspect that would be more accurately said something like, "The movement used with a bo to block a low kick may have been derived from the motion used to steer a boat with a pole." Even then, I question how often the movements were actually derived from those sources, versus that being used as an example to teach people who knew a similar movement.

I think that's a key... many times, movements were likely compared to everyday activities, or maybe even encouraged to practice in their everyday activities... There are tons of stories of masters teaching students by having them do things that are unrelated to the martial arts, then only after long periods of "sweeping the temple" or "wax on/wax off" were the movements "true" use shown. They had to come from somewhere, no?

I've always been somewhat skeptical of the whole "weapons were made from farm implements" type stories. Outside of a staff, and a few obvious special cases (Okinawan boat oar, Chinese horse bench) -- most farm tools are just not real well suited to use as a weapon. An axe for chopping a tree down is balanced and set up differently from a battle axe... I could maybe buy the tonfa as a handle from grinding by hand, but I've seen articles about the nunchaku and nobody can find a "rice flail" farming implement that matches. And sai? I don't really see how they would be useful as made for weaponry in any sort of farming. Of course, I could be wrong... but nobody seems to have a good explanation for it as a farm tool. I think maybe some of those explanations are just stories, maybe to deflect haphazard investigation when "weapons" were seized... But, that theory of mine and $3 will get you a cup of black coffee at Starbucks.

 

[TigerHeart]

I suspect that would be more accurately said something like, "The movement used with a bo to block a low kick may have been derived from the motion used to steer a boat with a pole." Even then, I question how often the movements were actually derived from those sources, versus that being used as an example to teach people who knew a similar movement.

I could be wrong, and I’m just a beginner. However, the story does add up how my instructor explained about the bo. It is just make it easy to remember even though this story could be made up.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I will look into some one-on-one Nunchaku training later on.

Just a note - if you train yourself before going for the 1-1 training, you're likely to develop some bad habits that need correction. If you are enjoying exploring it (except for the head shots, of course), then keep doing it by all means. Just know you're likely to develop habits that will slow down your later learning. It's something I've often accepted about my own explorations - just best to go in with eyes wide open.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I think that's a key... many times, movements were likely compared to everyday activities, or maybe even encouraged to practice in their everyday activities... There are tons of stories of masters teaching students by having them do things that are unrelated to the martial arts, then only after long periods of "sweeping the temple" or "wax on/wax off" were the movements "true" use shown. They had to come from somewhere, no?

I've always been somewhat skeptical of the whole "weapons were made from farm implements" type stories. Outside of a staff, and a few obvious special cases (Okinawan boat oar, Chinese horse bench) -- most farm tools are just not real well suited to use as a weapon. An axe for chopping a tree down is balanced and set up differently from a battle axe... I could maybe buy the tonfa as a handle from grinding by hand, but I've seen articles about the nunchaku and nobody can find a "rice flail" farming implement that matches. And sai? I don't really see how they would be useful as made for weaponry in any sort of farming. Of course, I could be wrong... but nobody seems to have a good explanation for it as a farm tool. I think maybe some of those explanations are just stories, maybe to deflect haphazard investigation when "weapons" were seized... But, that theory of mine and $3 will get you a cup of black coffee at Starbucks.

Likely some of them started as such, with people either messing around in boredom or grabbing what was on hand in a moment of need. When they started actually training to use them, they likely made versions specifically designed to be weapons (different balance, made to withstand impact, etc.).

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I could be wrong, and I’m just a beginner. However, the story does add up how my instructor explained about the bo. It is just make it easy to remember even though this story could be made up.

There are lots of origin and historical stories that are apocryphal. So many that it is almost certain nearly every one of us (students and instructors) believes more than one that isn't literally true. Unless one makes too much of them (in this case, perhaps, trying too hard to make it exactly like some motion used by Japanese boatmen), there's little real harm and not much to gain by trying to figure out if they are accurate or not. At worst, most of them just bug some of us.

 

[Tez3]

At worst, most of them just bug some of us.

It's only annoying when people repeat it as being the total truth which is has to be because 'their instructor told them it was'. As just a story it's fine but it's when people fervently believe these things it's worrying.

 

[Tarrycat]

Just a note - if you train yourself before going for the 1-1 training, you're likely to develop some bad habits that need correction. If you are enjoying exploring it (except for the head shots, of course), then keep doing it by all means. Just know you're likely to develop habits that will slow down your later learning. It's something I've often accepted about my own explorations - just best to go in with eyes wide open.

I 100% understand where you're coming from; that's usually the case with practicing several martial arts systems at once too, isn't it?. I will look into some professional training for the Nunchaku. I don't want to make a fool of myself either . I hope they'll have that sort of training here in SA. I'll google around.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I 100% understand where you're coming from; that's usually the case with practicing several martial arts systems at once too, isn't it?. I will look into some professional training for the Nunchaku. I don't want to make a fool of myself either . I hope they'll have that sort of training here in SA. I'll google around.

In most schools, weapons training starts well into the curriculum. You may be able to find an instructor who is willing to offer some private lessons to specifically work on that weapon.

 

[Tarrycat]

In most schools, weapons training starts well into the curriculum. You may be able to find an instructor who is willing to offer some private lessons to specifically work on that weapon.

Oh, I see. I thought I was going to have to resort to private lessons, since I'm already training in an art. Thank you for your input. I value it.

 

[JR 137]

I think that's a key... many times, movements were likely compared to everyday activities, or maybe even encouraged to practice in their everyday activities... There are tons of stories of masters teaching students by having them do things that are unrelated to the martial arts, then only after long periods of "sweeping the temple" or "wax on/wax off" were the movements "true" use shown. They had to come from somewhere, no?

I've always been somewhat skeptical of the whole "weapons were made from farm implements" type stories. Outside of a staff, and a few obvious special cases (Okinawan boat oar, Chinese horse bench) -- most farm tools are just not real well suited to use as a weapon. An axe for chopping a tree down is balanced and set up differently from a battle axe... I could maybe buy the tonfa as a handle from grinding by hand, but I've seen articles about the nunchaku and nobody can find a "rice flail" farming implement that matches. And sai? I don't really see how they would be useful as made for weaponry in any sort of farming. Of course, I could be wrong... but nobody seems to have a good explanation for it as a farm tool. I think maybe some of those explanations are just stories, maybe to deflect haphazard investigation when "weapons" were seized... But, that theory of mine and $3 will get you a cup of black coffee at Starbucks.

Add the kama and kuwa (Okinawan farming hoe) to the list of actual tools turned weapons IMO.

Most people believe the peasant farmers developed the tools as weapons, but some very credible sources argue it was the MA experts of the time who took said tools and taught them as weapons instead, which seems more plausible to me. But I guess that part’s another thread entirely.