No women allowed In this guys BJJ class

[Headhunter]

The context is that one of Ricardo De La Riva’s former students (a top female black belt) has accused him of sexual assault. Apparently he thinks the best way to handle that is to just not have any female students.

Well if he actually was falsely accused then fair enough I can understand that. And if it wasn’t false then I don’t know why women would want to train there anyway

 

[jobo]

Depends on what you mean by group and meeting place.

I said discrete group, that a group that jas one or more features or interests in common and a meeting place is where such a group may meet

So by way of further elaberation of this complex point

The womens institute have being women in common, as well as other issues like baking or charity work. Their meeting place would be the place they gather to meet, commonly a church hall or other community building

Hope thats clarified it for you, these defintions can be tricky

 

[drop bear]

I said discrete group, that a group that jas one or more features or interests in common and a meeting place is where such a group may meet

So by way of further elaberation of this complex point

The womens institute have being women in common, as well as other issues like baking or charity work. Their meeting place would be the place they gather to meet, commonly a church hall or other community building

Hope thats clarified it for you, these defintions can be tricky

Men's Sheds | Australian Men's Shed Association | Find a Men's Shed

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[jobo]

Men's Sheds | Australian Men's Shed Association | Find a Men's Shed

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they dont apear to have a meeting place though, rather they each sit in their own shed

 

[paitingman]

This is one reason I think any martial arts school that is able should have a camera system.

Only with the intention of protecting the school and its students.
Incidents of all types can be recorded and reviewed.

Of course this only provides peace of mind for things that take place at the gym.
But whether it's an injury or an assault, the footage can help after the fact.

Cameras may not be like by everyone, but I think it's a heck of a lot better than just refusing to teach women.

 

[paitingman]

I mean cameras just make sense at some point once you've reached a certain size and have a lot of traffic/students. Just so many chances for who knows what to happen and the school owner, the parent, or the student may really benefit from having footage available.

If you give a lot of private classes, depending on the building and layout maybe, some potential private students might feel more comfortable knowing there is video surveillance.

I'm not sure what is the best way to apply this for those teaching informal, non-centralized classes.

 

[Headhunter]

This is one reason I think any martial arts school that is able should have a camera system.

Only with the intention of protecting the school and its students.
Incidents of all types can be recorded and reviewed.

Of course this only provides peace of mind for things that take place at the gym.
But whether it's an injury or an assault, the footage can help after the fact.

Cameras may not be like by everyone, but I think it's a heck of a lot better than just refusing to teach women.

It wouldn’t matter though. In this internet world one accusation even if it’s 100% proved false that place will have that stigma no matter what. Also cameras aren’t a great idea if there is some creep instructor....he can be using videos of woman in his school for his own disgusting purposes and even more risky if they do kids classes having video footage of children. I don’t know the official laws but I know some actual education schools don’t have cameras anywhere inside the school for that very reason

 

[Gerry Seymour]

The demand was that hospitals hire more black doctors and nurses to care for black patients. It’s based on data that black patients are treated very differently by white doctors, than whitE patients.

im on a stupid iPad, so it’s tough to find it, but you’ll be appalled at the data if you do research on it... the worst being pregnancy related death rates, but also data on how pain is treated (based on a racist myth that black people feel pain differently) and all kinds of stuff.

is it strictly legal to request black only doctors? Maybe not, but I do understand where it comes from, and think some additional representation would help.

This is one of those areas where what seems racist isn't (or, actually, is, but for positive purposes). I've seen some of that research you're talking about, and if I was black, I'd probably be looking for a black doctor. The differences in outcome are pretty startling, and don't seem to be based on conscious action or concious bias.

 

[drop bear]

they dont apear to have a meeting place though, rather they each sit in their own shed

Which is a meeting place.

Hence the shed part of the title.

I don't think this is a guys backyard. They are dedicated sheds for the project.

 

[skribs]

This is one of those areas where what seems racist isn't (or, actually, is, but for positive purposes). I've seen some of that research you're talking about, and if I was black, I'd probably be looking for a black doctor. The differences in outcome are pretty startling, and don't seem to be based on conscious action or concious bias.

So should black doctors refuse to serve white patients? Should white doctors tell black patients "I can't serve you, because you're black?"

It made sense back in the 40s when we considered black people to be a more primal version of the human race. I don't think going back to that is a good idea.

 

[drop bear]

So just having a quick skim at this black doctors thing.

Apparently black people will actually follow black doctors advice because they trust them more.

Research: Having a Black Doctor Led Black Men to Receive More-Effective Care

So exactly racism.

But that was my first look. There might be something else.

 

[Steve]

So should black doctors refuse to serve white patients? Should white doctors tell black patients "I can't serve you, because you're black?"

It made sense back in the 40s when we considered black people to be a more primal version of the human race. I don't think going back to that is a good idea.

ideally, white doctors would treat black patients the same as white patients, and vice versa. But that’s not where we are, unfortunately,

The issue I have with you is that you’re arguing the wrong side of this. It’s not that your logic is flawed. It’s that you’re focusing on the request from the perspective that the white doctors are being wronged by black patients... that somehow a white doctor should have every right to treat a black patient. But, while not entirely untrue, that is exactly the kind of logic that perpetuates the problem. We should, imo, be focusing on the black patients and why they do not receive equitable care from white doctors. Fix that, and all would be well. But in the meantime, because this far, pleas for equality seem to be having little positive influence and black people know that they will receive better care from black doctors and nurses, that’s what they’re asking for.

 

[Steve]

So just having a quick skim at this black doctors thing.

Apparently black people will actually follow black doctors advice because they trust them more.

Research: Having a Black Doctor Led Black Men to Receive More-Effective Care

So exactly racism.

But that was my first look. There might be something else.

There is a lot more. I’ll post some stuff if I ever think about it when I am at a real keyboard.

couple of quick links f

Racial and Ethnic Disparities Continue in Pregnancy-Related Deaths | CDC Online Newsroom | CDC

Racial bias in pain assessment and treatment recommendations, and false beliefs about biological differences between blacks and whites

How we fail black patients in pain

[URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2016/04/04/do-blacks-feel-less-pain-than-whites-their-doctors-may-think-so/"]The disturbing reason some African American patients may be undertreated for pain[/URL]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4638275/

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

ideally, white doctors would treat black patients the same as white patients, and vice versa. But that’s not where we are, unfortunately,

The issue I have with you is that you’re arguing the wrong side of this. It’s not that your logic is flawed. It’s that you’re focusing on the request from the perspective that the white doctors are being wronged by black patients... that somehow a white doctor should have every right to treat a black patient. But, while not entirely untrue, that is exactly the kind of logic that perpetuates the problem. We should, imo, be focusing on the black patients and why they do not receive equitable care from white doctors. Fix that, and all would be well. But in the meantime, because this far, pleas for equality seem to be having little positive influence and black people know that they will receive better care from black doctors and nurses, that’s what they’re asking for.

I think you're mixing it up a bit by including color so much in your statements. Any patient should, at any point in time, have a right to decline treatment from a particular doctor. The doctors should be willing (barring stuff like a difference in specialty or physical capability to treat their patient) to treat whatever patient shows up at their practice/hospital.

That means a black patient can refuse a white doctor, but he can also refuse a hispanic, chinese or black doctor as well if he feels they're not treating him right. A white doctor can't refuse to treat a black patient, any more than a black doctor can refuse to treat a gay patient.

 

[Steve]

I think you're mixing it up a bit by including color so much in your statements. Any patient should, at any point in time, have a right to decline treatment from a particular doctor. The doctors should be willing (barring stuff like a difference in specialty or physical capability to treat their patient) to treat whatever patient shows up at their practice/hospital.

That means a black patient can refuse a white doctor, but he can also refuse a hispanic, chinese or black doctor as well if he feels they're not treating him right. A white doctor can't refuse to treat a black patient, any more than a black doctor can refuse to treat a gay patient.

True in a theoretical, philosophical discussion. But I’m talking about a concrete, real world issue. In this case, the issue at hand is observable. As I said before, I’m not suggesting that the request is the best outcome. I’m saying, I get where it comes from.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

True in a theoretical, philosophical discussion. But I’m talking about a concrete, real world issue. In this case, the issue at hand is observable. As I said before, I’m not suggesting that the request is the best outcome. I’m saying, I get where it comes from.

My point is, that focusing so much on the race as you are in your post, detracts from people hearing the message that people deserve to be treated by someone they feel is treating them fairly.

 

[Steve]

My point is, that focusing so much on the race as you are in your post, detracts from people hearing the message that people deserve to be treated by someone they feel is treating them fairly.

I hear you. In this case though, race is intrinsic to the point.

 

[skribs]

I hear you. In this case though, race is intrinsic to the point.

So the question should become: how do we turn that around? Instead of: let's segregate hospitals (which is what the suggestion has been).

How can we have white doctors better serve black patients? How can we have black patients trust white doctors? These are the questions we should be asking.

 

[Steve]

So the question should become: how do we turn that around? Instead of: let's segregate hospitals (which is what the suggestion has been).

How can we have white doctors better serve black patients? How can we have black patients trust white doctors? These are the questions we should be asking.

I agree with that, and also support getting some more black doctors and nurses into hospitals.

 

[drop bear]

I hear you. In this case though, race is intrinsic to the point.

If we had competent doctors it wouldn't be.

Which I think kind of should be a minimum standard anyway.