New anti Sine Wave pattern deliveries on Youtube

[Acronym]

Sir, since I have no information concerning the extent of GM Yeo's classroom experience with General Choi I have no opinion on this. Eve if I did, As far as me commenting on who is a "Higher Authority" if it is based solely upon whether your instructor or mine is of senior rank - you lose. Other than that - Courtesy will not let me comment on the accuracy of your claims, as to the accuracy of GM Yeo's perspective.

You said that you couldn't find any info on him, then you did.. So do you take that back?

 

[Steve]

I agree. And GM Yeo has more credentials than Weiss as far as I know.

Isn't YMCA a pretty prestigious merit?

Don't misunderstand me. It's a fallacy unless everyone agrees on the relative credibility of the authority in question. Generally, if someone disputes the credibility of people involved, it's a good idea to present objective information from other credible sources.

 

[Acronym]

Don't misunderstand me. It's a fallacy unless everyone agrees on the relative credibility of the authority in question. Generally, if someone disputes the credibility of people involved, it's a good idea to present objective information from other credible sources.

Which has been done

 

[Acronym]

No sir, yet sitting on a sofa is not the same as being in a classroom. What has been indicated to me is you have language processing issues vis a vis conventional meanings. II have been on the floor instructed by several who trained with General Choi at various times. Yet, my first hand experience revealed revealed numerous items that needed refinement based on first hand experience. If you expect me to criticize GM Yeo, that won't happen the best you would get, if I were to ever have first hand classroom experience with him is that we have a difference of opinion. This is not unusual. The Triumvirate that took over teaching IICs after General Choi's death during dinner related how between them they had been to 100 IICs with general Choi andid not always agree on what the standard should be.

And you never self reflected that the vast majority talk about sine wave as juxtaposed to hip twist? Everybody else is wrong, you are the only one who formed the impression that it was intact...

Why NLTKD does not teach Sine Wave - North London Taekwondo

Ask anyone to punch as hard as possible and he or she will naturally twist their hips and shoulders. It is a natural movement hard coded into our DNA. The “hip twist” technique has been used for centuries in most fighting and martial arts styles. The NLTKD practices it too.

In competition sparring, example Taekwondo, kick boxing, regular boxing or MMA, everyone uses “hip twist” to generate power and speed. Sine Wave is non-existent anywhere in the real world.

Now bear in mind, no one ever joins a martial arts club to learn patterns, so adding a bobbing up and down movement called “Sine Wave” to patterns lessons seems pointless. People join a martial arts club for fitness, self defence, sparring and/or confidence. The sine wave style does nothing to help achieve these goals.

So that is why the NLTKD does not teach Sine Wave style. We teach the original Traditional style Taekwondo as in the video below and still practiced in many taekwondo schools worldwide.

 

[Earl Weiss]

You said that you couldn't find any info on him, then you did.. So do you take that back?

My initial search revealed little. Then by happenstance I ran across something - I think it was on FB, I found what I posted - a very brief history of his TKD experience. - Born in 1953, started TKD in 1966, with some experience under Han Cha Kyo who coincidentally my instructor was under when I started in 1972 or so. Other than that not much in the way of his experience vis a vis courses or sessions with General Choi, such as IICs, or promotion history so the comment stands. Too little information found to form any sort of opinion..

 

[Earl Weiss]

No no, Mr Weiss used it first (which is fine, argument from authority is not always a fallacy)

Sir, my argument from authority cited THE AUTHORITY, far different than opinions . It would be likemaking a claim about Mozart's music and citing something Mozart said to support it.

 

[Earl Weiss]

I agree. And GM Yeo has more credentials than Weiss as far as I know.

Isn't YMCA a pretty prestigious merit?

Here is a link to excerpts from my credentials.. Microsoft Word - Resume TKD.doc (googlegroups.com)
Important updates would be an ITF IC in Denver in 2010, and promotion to 9th Dan (USTF) 2016.
If you have something similar for GM yeo I would be happy to compare. However it is of little import since I know of some whose credentials exceed mine when it comes to TK-D and we have differences of opinion. As I related in a prior post even the most seniors who took ove after general Choi died admitted to having differences of opinion on some technical issues.

As for your >>>Isn't YMCA a pretty prestigious merit?<<< question, I do not know what you refer to.

 

[Acronym]

Sir, my argument from authority cited THE AUTHORITY, far different than opinions . It would be likemaking a claim about Mozart's music and citing something Mozart said to support it.

You have not cited anything said in any one of Chois classes with regards to hip twist and sine wave. The encyclopedia quotes were taken out of context and are also old statements that are left in from the very first editions.

 

[Acronym]

I will ask again: Why is there a perceived juxtaposition between Sine Wave and hip twist in the public eye if no such conflict exist?

General Choi must have been a very poor communicator of his own revised system.

 

[Earl Weiss]

And you never self reflected that the vast majority talk about sine wave as juxtaposed to hip twist? Everybody else is wrong, you are the only one who formed the impression that it was intact...

Why NLTKD does not teach Sine Wave - North London Taekwondo

/QUOTE]
>>.And you never self reflected that the vast majority talk about sine wave as juxtaposed to hip twist?<<

.

Not certain what you mean by "Juxtaposed" . If you use a dictionary definition "To place side by side, especially for comparison or contrast." then the premise is faulty. since it is not one compared to the other , it is both used together- that is what General Choi taught. So the article linked to which seems based upon an either or premise is based on a faulty premise. Everyone else is not wrong. It seems the articles written to the contrary seem to be from those who did not train with General Choi and and make faulty assumptions based upon internet snippets

 

[Acronym]

Chang Hon TKD instructor Mitch quote from MartialArtsPlanet:

"Gen Choi changed the way many techniques were delivered, initially through how hip movement was used to develop power in some techniques and later through the more controversial "sine wave."


Again, everybody but Weiss and his circle of friends have a different impression. Very curious

 

[Earl Weiss]

You have not cited anything said in any one of Chois classes with regards to hip twist and sine wave. The encyclopedia quotes were taken out of context and are also old statements that are left in from the very first editions.

Encyclopedia quotes were in context. Sorry, if you did not like them .

Here you go from my notes: HOWEVER, I did not necessarily record things if they were a repeat from other courses / classes. So, the absence of the notes from other sessions does not mean it did not happen:

Regular numbers are June 1990 instructor course Grand Lake Colorado: Taught By General Choi

Numbers P1., P2., etc. are from the December 6, 1997 seminar with General Choi Hong Hi in Phoenix Arizona.

Numbers J1., J2., etc. are from the November 1998 Instructor course with General Choi in Jamaica.

27. Move bigger muscles (hips) slightly before and ahead of smaller muscles, (finish at same time) to utilize body mass.

P4. Must move hip and abdomen to bring entire muscle system into play and start moving the larger and slower muscles before the smaller faster muscles which will catch up.

J6. Movement of Hip and abdomen See P4.

J7. Only TKD has 2 ways to generate power with hip, up and down and sideways

 

[Earl Weiss]

Chang Hon TKD instructor Mitch quote from MartialArtsPlanet:



Again, everybody but Weiss and his circle of friends have a different impression. Very curious

Sir, which of my friends have you heard from . Of course by my friends if you are referring to people with first hand experience with General Choi as opposed to those relying on internet snippets, I am flattered. By the way not as curious as your above quote from "Chang Hon TKD Instructor Mich. " Sorry, but I ma not familiar with his qualifications. Can you provide them?

 

[Acronym]

Encyclopedia quotes were in context. Sorry, if you did not like them .

Here you go from my notes: HOWEVER, I did not necessarily record things if they were a repeat from other courses / classes. So, the absence of the notes from other sessions does not mean it did not happen:

Regular numbers are June 1990 instructor course Grand Lake Colorado: Taught By General Choi

Numbers P1., P2., etc. are from the December 6, 1997 seminar with General Choi Hong Hi in Phoenix Arizona.

Numbers J1., J2., etc. are from the November 1998 Instructor course with General Choi in Jamaica.

27. Move bigger muscles (hips) slightly before and ahead of smaller muscles, (finish at same time) to utilize body mass.

P4. Must move hip and abdomen to bring entire muscle system into play and start moving the larger and slower muscles before the smaller faster muscles which will catch up.

J6. Movement of Hip and abdomen See P4.

J7. Only TKD has 2 ways to generate power with hip, up and down and sideways

Thank you for that. Those parameters are open to interpretation. No explicit mention of hip twist, just as I suspected. TKD obviously generates power through the hip in various techniques outside of SW punching so that is not a vindication of your contention.

 

[Earl Weiss]

I will ask again: Why is there a perceived juxtaposition between Sine Wave and hip twist in the public eye if no such conflict exist?

General Choi must have been a very poor communicator of his own revised system.

Sir, Because to many people make rash generalizations based on limited observations. .

 

[Earl Weiss]

Thank you for that. Those parameters are open to interpretation. No explicit mention of hip twist, just as I suspected. TKD obviously generates power through the hip in various techniques outside of SW punching so that is not a vindication of your contention.

They are open to interpretation / misinterpretation if someone has only the limited resource of the written word. (Heck I misinterpreted stuff in the texts like "Pick Shape Kick" and "Hooking kick" even with some photos. proper understanding was easy when the written word was coupled with demonstration.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Hearsay is dismissable in court.

Sir, not sure what the heck you are referring to since my experience is firsthand. As such my experience is not hearsay. On the other hand you are relating what someone else told you happened.

 

[Acronym]

They are open to interpretation / misinterpretation if someone has only the limited resource of the written word. (Heck I misinterpreted stuff in the texts like "Pick Shape Kick" and "Hooking kick" even with some photos. proper understanding was easy when the written word was coupled with demonstration.

It states specifically "2 ways to generate power". if hip twist and SW went hand in hand, it would make more sense to label it as 1 unified way. Whether this was intentional or not, it is ambiguous.

 

[Earl Weiss]

I agree. And GM Yeo has more credentials than Weiss as far as I know.

Isn't YMCA a pretty prestigious merit?

I see now - you seem to refer to the info I posted about GM Yeo teaching at a YMCA. The answer to your question >>>Isn't YMCA a pretty prestigious merit?<<< would be "No".

 

[Earl Weiss]

It states specifically "2 ways to generate power". if hip twist and SW went hand in hand, it would make more sense to label it as 1 unified way. Whether this was intentional or not, it is ambiguous.

Sir, when you write a text or two, (how about publish an article or two) and have it read by tens of thousands of people let me know if any readers or even you yourself might not think there might have been a better way of writing something. Perhaps that is why instructors consider texts to be a good reference but not a substitute for the instructor..