Maxims.

[Highlander]

That was my ponder. This leads to the segmented movement argument. I can make a finite amount of power if I use only my arm or leg. With my back pressed to a wall for example. They are a spring in the functional sense but with potential energy only. When I add the powerful spring in my mid-section the strike is exponentially stronger. So if the arms and legs are springs, I would add that the waist is also a spring. And you could argue that the shoulders and hips are also springs.

The hips and shoulders aren't so much springs as they are pivot points for the springs to bend and turn when necessary IMO.
Anatomy supports this (also supports the other discussion about hands=feet elbow=knee hip=shoulder)
The wrist and ankle joints are gliding joints. Great for making single direction movement and small circles.
The knees and elbows are hinge joints; great for.. well.. hinging lol. Larger amount of movement but stuck to one plane.
The shoulder and hips are the most free moving joints in the body, a ball and socket joint. This gives you movement at every angle but requires a lot of muscle to stabilize.
So now if we start thinking about the types of joints our body has and apply the theory of the arms and legs being springs attached to the spine you can very clearly see how the arms and legs can compress (much like a spring) through the hinging joint. Once the joint moves in too close to the body it becomes weak and requires muscles to hold the structure (instead of bone). To get around this, let your ball and socket joint relax and pass the tension to the larger spring of your spine. Think about how a very strong heavy spring bends under pressure that isnt applied directly to the center. Then you snap back to center and hopefully hit your target. This is all assuming contact has already been made and you cant simply just punch the guy......

 

[Highlander]

The hips and shoulders aren't so much springs as they are pivot points for the springs to bend and turn when necessary. Anatomy supports this (also supports the other discussion about hands=feet elbow=knee hip=shoulder)
The wrist and ankle joints are gliding joints. Great for making single direction movement and small circles.
The knees and elbows are hinge joints; great for.. well.. hinging lol. Larger amount of movement but stuck to one plane.
The shoulder and hips are the most free moving joints in the body, a ball and socket joint. This gives you movement at every angle but requires a lot of muscle to stabilize.
So now if we start thinking about the types of joints our body has and apply the theory of the arms and legs being springs attached to the spine you can very clearly see how the arms and legs can compress (much like a spring) through the hinging joint. Once the joint moves in too close to the body it becomes weak and requires muscles to hold the structure (instead of bone). To get around this, let your ball and socket joint relax and pass the tension to the larger spring of your spine. Think about how a very strong heavy spring bends under pressure that isnt applied directly to the center. Then you snap back to center and hopefully hit your target. This is all assuming contact has already been made and you cant simply just punch the guy......

^^TLDR. Let your joints bend and flow naturally to deal with incoming force

 

[dvcochran]

The hips and shoulders aren't so much springs as they are pivot points for the springs to bend and turn when necessary IMO.
Anatomy supports this (also supports the other discussion about hands=feet elbow=knee hip=shoulder)
The wrist and ankle joints are gliding joints. Great for making single direction movement and small circles.
The knees and elbows are hinge joints; great for.. well.. hinging lol. Larger amount of movement but stuck to one plane.
The shoulder and hips are the most free moving joints in the body, a ball and socket joint. This gives you movement at every angle but requires a lot of muscle to stabilize.
So now if we start thinking about the types of joints our body has and apply the theory of the arms and legs being springs attached to the spine you can very clearly see how the arms and legs can compress (much like a spring) through the hinging joint. Once the joint moves in too close to the body it becomes weak and requires muscles to hold the structure (instead of bone). To get around this, let your ball and socket joint relax and pass the tension to the larger spring of your spine. Think about how a very strong heavy spring bends under pressure that isnt applied directly to the center. Then you snap back to center and hopefully hit your target. This is all assuming contact has already been made and you cant simply just punch the guy......

I feel we are in the same vein of thinking. When we talk about making power from the torso we use the description of the torso as a very high tension vertical spring. The spring is loaded by rotation of the waist with the ends affixed at the shoulders and waist. Like a high tension spring it doesn't take a great deal of rotation on its axis to fully load the spring creating very great potential energy. Once the motion of the technique is set in motion the energy is converted to kinetic and creates a massive power boost for the strike/block/kick, etc...
I never go into this level of detail with a new student; they would just glaze over.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

My thoughts on this is the body is one large spring working together. If I had to break it into three sections I would say it's the legs, spine, and arms, but they should all flow/work as one.

The "twist and spring" throw require 3 forces going into 3 different directions at the same time.

1. Pull your opponent's right arm toward south direction.
2. Push his head toward west direction.
3. Spring his left leg toward east direction.

 

[Highlander]

The "twist and spring" throw require 3 forces going into 3 different directions at the same time.

1. Pull your opponent's right arm toward south direction.
2. Push his head toward west direction.
3. Spring his left leg toward east direction.

Not really sure what you're going for with this comment... is this how you define the three springs of the body?
Or are you simply breaking down a particular throw?

 

[mograph]

Their purpose is to remind of a specific principle, not to fully describe the movement.

Agree. They refer to experience, which gives them context.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Not really sure what you're going for with this comment... is this how you define the three springs of the body?
Or are you simply breaking down a particular throw?

The 3 springs function can be seen in striking as well.

Your

- left hand pull your opponent's blocking arm.
- right hand punch his head.
- left foot kick his groin.

In training, your left hand, right hand, left foot all start at the same time and also stop at the same time.

 

[Highlander]

The 3 springs function can be seen in striking as well.

Your

- left hand pull your opponent's blocking arm.
- right hand punch his head.
- left foot kick his groin.

In training, your left hand, right hand, left foot all start at the same time and also stop at the same time.

So you define the three springs as just three attacks happening at once ?

 

[dvcochran]

Hopefully this picture helps explain my opinion on the shoulder and hips being their own kind of spring. The compression is rotational so the energy is stored and delivered rotationally.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

So you define the three springs as just three attacks happening at once ?

3 part of your body move and stop all together. It doesn't have to be used in offense. It can be used in defense too.

For example, you can block a punch by

1. only move your arm without move your body.
2. move both your arm and body at the same time.

IMO, 2 >1. Even if you may miss your arm blocking, but you have moved your body out of your opponent's attacking path.

 

[Highlander]

3 part of your body move and stop all together. It doesn't have to be used in offense. It can be used in defense too.

For example, you can block a punch by

1. only move your arm without move your body.
2. move both your arm and body at the same time.

IMO, 2 >1. Even if you may miss your arm blocking, but you have moved your body out of your opponent's attacking path.

We define the 3 springs a little differently in our style. But I see what you're getting at with this concept.
"The best way to avoid a punch, is to not be there" Mr. Miyagi

 

[Yoshiyahu]

- The body follows the movement of the hands. The waist and the stance move together.

- Complement the hands with posture to make good use of the centerline.

- Coordinate the hands and feet. Movement is together.

- Unite your waist and stance.

- In uniting the waist with the stance, power can be generated.

 

[Yoshiyahu]

- Yee Jee Kim Yeung Ma - Train the chi by controlling the Tan Tien.

- Store mental energy with the mind. Move chi with mental energy. Exert strength with chi. Generate power with strength.

- Fill the Tan Tien with chi and distribute the strength to all parts of the body.

- chi comes out of the Tan Tien, and travels along the waist, the thighs, and the back.

- To release chi from the Tan Tien, will enable proper release of power.

- Internally develop the chi; externally train the tendons, bones and muscles.

- Power is generated from the joints. Strength originates from the heels.

- Store mental energy with the mind. Move chi with mental energy. Exert strength with chi. Generate power with strength.

- No harm will come if chi is nurtured naturally. Power can be stored but with enough to spare.

- Storing energy resembles pulling a bow. Releasing power is like shooting an arrow.

- Direct the mind to store spirit, not chi, in the body. Otherwise it leads to sluggishness. No power is obtained when occupied with chi.