Martial Arts Pins

Discussion in 'Hapkido' started by Dwi Chugi, Jan 8, 2015.

  1. Danny T

    Danny T Senior Master

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    LEO's operate under different SOP's as do Medical security staff. Their rules of engagement and technique applications are quite different than a 'regular' citizen in a combative self-defense situation.
     
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  2. Dwi Chugi

    Dwi Chugi Orange Belt

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    Hello,

    When I say pin, I mean less scarf hold (Which I would probably stay away from in a street defense) and more like the two video's posted above where you are locking someone's wrist or arm. However, I do love me a scarf hold when I am on the mat.

    My argument is if I am in a street fight, I am not going to try to control them on the ground. There are no referee's in a street fight and lets face it, they most likely will not tap and go on there merry way.

    I would say in a street fight, where I am with a loved one and someone attacks, I would first try to throw them so violently that they do not get up and I get away or strike them to where they either go to sleep or back off.

    If it is someone I know, (the drunk friend or family member) then pins or locks are what I would aim for. When I worked security, I never threw or hit anyone. It was always a wrist or elbow lock and an escort to the front door where local LEO would give them a trespass notice. I worked on a Psych Unit as well where locks came in handy.

    Thank you for all your reply's and the two videos.
     
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  3. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    depends how it is put on. If you let them get a neck crank it can be real trouble to get out of.
     
  4. Buka

    Buka Sr. Grandmaster

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    My thoughts....pretty much the same as yours.
     
  5. Brian King

    Brian King Master of Arts

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    Depending on the situation, pins can be used while de-escalating the situation. Pin's can also be used effectively to search and disarm prior to de-escalation. Pin's and the resistance to or escape from can also serve as justification of upping the use of force. Not good for all situations but good for some. Your mileage may vary.

    Regards
    Brian King
     
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  6. Transk53

    Transk53 The Dark Often Prevails

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    Yes. From my viewpoint mainly, but good post.
     
  7. Raymond

    Raymond Orange Belt

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    My personal take is that pinning techniques to the nature of scarf hold or north/south position are very important to a well rounded martial artists. There can be many times you need to control or restrain someone that you do not want to use a joint lock or joint break on such as someone with a physical or mental handicap.

    I know the traditional Hapkido practitioner will likely view a "pin" as something like this

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And those are very strong restraining techniques due to the pain the of the lock, I think that pinning techniques we may view as "more sportive" are important as well because they offer full dominating control without injury and if you do a competant level of grappling in your curriculum you will be able to seamlessly transition from various pins without ever losing control of the battle.

    [​IMG]

    I also think that a martial art should grow and evolve to address the combative needs of the current time's culture of fighting. With many brazilian jiujitsu white and blue belts out there, and high school wrestlers, just being aware of pinning techniques like this are also important to self defense. I'm not a military general, but I think that one military will always want to understand the type of weaponry their enemies may use against them. Martial art shouldn't be any different. Also, I don't think pinning techniques like scarf hold or side mount violate the principals and values of Hapkido. But I am also very thankful and interested in the Hapkido traditionalists that prefer to practice the art as closely to what Dojunim Choi taught, and I unfortunately have no way to know if he taught any pins that be also found commonly in Judo or various forms of jiujitsu.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2015
  8. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Easier to punch them in the face from scarf hold
     
  9. Raymond

    Raymond Orange Belt

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    Do you mean for the top person or the bottom person? I personally would probably not punch from scarf hold top as I would not want to risk giving up position.
     
  10. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    from the top position. And it is pretty low risk of them getting out.

    So you basically get free punching.
     
  11. Raymond

    Raymond Orange Belt

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    Suh Bok Sup, Choi's first student in Korea, was a black belt in Judo and Judo has pinning techniques (one method of winning Judo competitions even). I wonder how much, if any, pinning techniques such as scarf hold he taught when instructing Hapkido.123
     

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