Let's discuss TWC's central line.

Discussion in 'Wing Chun' started by Marnetmar, Jan 16, 2018.

  1. Martial D

    Martial D Master Black Belt

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    Fair enough. I find it confusing to use the same term for two different concepts. If the centerline is the line between you and your opponent, then what do you call the line that bifurcates your own body? If your punches do not travel down that line how do you chain punch? If your hand techniques do not end on that line what of structure?

    Again, I am not talking about aligning with the opponents center. When you shift and punch the punch could very well end up travelling diagonally in relation to your opponent, but still end on your own center where it's strongest.

    I wasn't aware there were strains of WC that didn't use centerline theory.
     
  2. KPM

    KPM Senior Master

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    If the centerline is the line between you and your opponent, then what do you call the line that bifurcates your own body?

    ---The "self" centerline. Only really an issue when training solo.

    If your punches do not travel down that line how do you chain punch?

    ---They do! Because at that point it is the "attacking line."

    Again, I am not talking about aligning with the opponents center. When you shift and punch the punch could very well end up travelling diagonally in relation to your opponent, but still end on your own center where it's strongest.

    ---But you still have to hit the opponent!

    I wasn't aware there were strains of WC that didn't use centerline theory.

    ----Are you saying that my Wing Chun doesn't use centerline theory? Obviously there are different interpretations of what that means!
     
  3. Martial D

    Martial D Master Black Belt

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    So in your WC say, a tan executed on the shoulder line or on an obtuse angle to the body is fairly standard? This seems weird to me as it both isn't covering your center and would be easiest collapsible. If the punches/strikes aren't delivered down the middle it seems to me you'd lose a lot of power.

    Yes, you need to hit the opponent, but I don't see how that ties in to anything. You can hit with an arm punch or a punch driven by your core. Either way you can connect.

    Lastly, it seems your WC ignores a large part of the centerline theory I was taught, especially if you ignore your own center if not training solo.

    Then again we might be losing something in communication. 5 seconds of training with you and you would understand what I am saying here I guarantee.
     
  4. TMA17

    TMA17 Purple Belt

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    Sifu Sergio put it best, “all the lineages have a piece of the puzzle and it is up to you to put it together.” It is almost as if you have to find your true Wing Chun self and use what works best for you, your experiences, and your body type
     
  5. Eric_H

    Eric_H Black Belt

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    Just a bunch of nonsense salesman talk. He's repeating that lie so his chop suey approach to training WC and now other stuff seems more palatable.
     
  6. TMA17

    TMA17 Purple Belt

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    19) After being in Wing Chun for so long what have you learned that stands out the most?

    There are a number of things that really stand out about Traditional Wing Chun (TWC). To begin, what stands out very heavily is the concept of the CENTERLINE, and that there are SEVERAL "centerlines" to be employed; and furthermore, that at longer (non contact) ranges - the most important centerlines are DUAL; ie.- the lines that run vertically down the opponents' body at his shoulders. That is why when I box at long range I'm always making sure that whatever punches I throw are covering those lines (or paths) - so that he can't hook or throw long range round bombs around me - since I'm now using and occupying the TERRITORY that he needs in order to hit or grab me. He HAS to deal with my attack - he can't bypass it.

    This often leads to limb-to-limb contact, which means that now ANOTHER important TWC principle comes into play: the strategies and techniques and contact reflexes that come out of all chi sao and chi sao related drills. So I'm making him play into my strength as a wing chun man.”

    KI Martial Arts Studio: 21 Questions with Traditional Wing Chun Master, Master Victor Parlati
     
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  7. KPM

    KPM Senior Master

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    [So in your WC say, a tan executed on the shoulder line or on an obtuse angle to the body is fairly standard? This seems weird to me as it both isn't covering your center and would be easiest collapsible. If the punches/strikes aren't delivered down the middle it seems to me you'd lose a lot of power.

    ---I don't think you are picturing what I'm saying. Like this: http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9576&d=1441097191

    Lastly, it seems your WC ignores a large part of the centerline theory I was taught, especially if you ignore your own center if not training solo.

    ---You clearly aren't getting what I'm saying. "Center" and "Central" mean essentially the same thing. They also look alike/sound alike. That's why I said it can be confusing to use both terms. I doubt anyone used the term "central line" prior to William Cheung. He came up with that term just so what he was doing would seem distinct from what everyone else was doing. The "centerline" is simply the line that connects your center to the opponent's center....whether that is the center of his body or the center of his technique/attacking limb. It sometimes will divide you equally into two halves, but sometimes does not. When doing a simultaneous defense and strike that Wing Chun is so famous for, there is a "centerline" aimed at the center of the opponent's technique/attack limb and there is a "centerline" aimed at the opponent's core. Both are the "centerline." To make them more specific, the first is the "defense line" and the second is the "attack line." I find this much less confusing than saying "centerline" and "central line."
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2018
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  8. VPT

    VPT Green Belt

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    I was once explained all the "center/central lines" in Wan Kam Leung's branch of Wing Chun. I think there might have been four or five, if not more of them. Since I only really trained with those guys maybe three times and that was soon to be four years ago, I can't unfortunately give much more insight to this matter.
     

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