Kosutemi Seieikan - Kata, Competition and Technique

[OnlyAnEgg]

Tonight we learned fukugata ni (fukyugata). I talked with the Sesei afterwards and he told me that the forms are all Shotokan. The primary difference between Ko Sutemi and Shotokan would appear to be the competive emphasis. We haven't done much mat work, yet; but, there will be some jujitsu when the adults begin to attend regularly again. Apparently, summer is a relaxed time at the dojo.


Thanks to Andrew for pointing me to the forms. It's been very helpful.

egg

 

[Randy Strausbaugh]

Tonight we learned fukugata ni (fukyugata). I talked with the Sesei afterwards and he told me that the forms are all Shotokan.

Not to contradict your sensei, but to the best of my knowledge, Shotokan doesn't practice the fukyugata (ichi or ni). They came from Shorin Ryu. Shotokan's fundamental forms are the Taikyoku forms, and they are different from the Fukyugata. Also, Seiei-kan refers to the next set of forms as "Pinan" (shodan through godan), which is the designation given them in the Okinawan systems, while Shotokan calls them "Heian". And, Funakoshi reversed the order of the first two Pinan forms when he taught them as Heian, so Pinan Shodan is Heian Nidan, and vice versa. Where Okinawan forms utilize the cat stance (Neko-ashi Dachi), Shotokan tends to replace them with the back stance (Kokutsu Dachi).
If you'd like to compare the two systems in terms of forms, Funakoshi's Karate-do Kyohan and Shoshin Nagamine's Essence of Okinawan Karate-do will give you plenty of material.

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

I thank you for this information. I apologize for speaking so quickly when I could've done a bit of research first and saved you the necessity of correction.

I admit that I may have misheard Sensei. It's also possible that my ignorance of the comparative differences between Seieikan and other disciplines led me to misspeak.

I will find these books you noted. I have Karate-do Nyumon and had been planning on getting Kyohan at the first opportunity.

egg

 

[Randy Strausbaugh]

No problem. I'm always glad to help where I can. After all, that's (IMHO) the best thing about these forums. They give you the chance to share information with a wide range of practitioners. Believe me, I've been corrected many times here and elsewhere. I've always appreciated the learning experience.

By the way, you can find a listing of the Seiei-kan kata here. As you can see, some names associated with Japanese styles, some with Okinawan.

Keep us updated on how your training is going. Always glad to hear from another Buckeye .

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Tonight was a fine practice. Much attention to the position of the hands/arms in blocks and punches with a focus on the centerline. I have to stop myself from fully extending my arm.

Then a whirlwind through 4 kata: the two fukyugata and the first 2 Pinan. Pinan Nidan was a lot like one of the kibon from TKD. Sparring was nice and aggressive. For some reason, everyone wanted a piece of the 'old man' It's a very young class. Three days until the next class, so, the kids, wife and I will be doing kata this weekend. Funakoshi said 100 repetitions for each before moving to the next. Sounds like good advice.

Where in Ohio, Randy? I'm in Thornville, a little east of Columbus.

egg

 

[Randy Strausbaugh]

Where in Ohio, Randy? I'm in Thornville, a little east of Columbus.

Chillicothe. A little bit south of nowhere .

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Chillicothe. A little bit south of nowhere .

That's not too far at all.

My school is having a tournament on 10/15 and you're close enough to attend if you wish.

I have not attended a tourney in which I would compete. Anyone who'd like to witness an old man strive toward a level of skill that may merit an award, please attend.

I have no further info on the nature of the tourney at this time. I will get more details Thursday at class.

egg

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

With school back in session, classes have been becoming a little more structured. There is considerably more focus on dojo discipline the past couple classes. Still not too many adults and Sensei's the only advanced belt; though I know of two other blacks that sporadically attend d/t recent injuries.

I have the structure of the first two kata memorized and am practicing daily to refine the movements and add power to the strikes and blocks. Also, this week, I began some weight training. Low weight un the arms and upper body with many reps in order to build up speed, heavier weight on some reps for my legs cause they've always been solid. Now to make them more so.

The tournament is in 2 weeks and Sensei stated he wants me to compete; so, kata and kumite for me. Kinda makes me jittery inside. I look forward to it anyway.


egg

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Last night's class was a little sketchy. About 6 people were half an hour late. Sensei had business to tend to at the onset; so, he gave me the class to warm up! (W00t! am I all that?)

Mostly kumite with a lot of younglings; but, at the end Sensei took us all on one at a time with me in the final slot. My stepson, Jack, told me I looked pretty cool fighting Sensei. That's worth the training right there.

Fukyugatas Ichi and Ni still, so far. Tournament on Saturday. I'm entering Kata and Kumite. Starting to get more nervouser.

 

[Navarre]

You'll do fine, Egg. Having been around the tournament scene a few times, I've found it's best to take it for what it is.


A tournament isn't a fight or even a test of your abilities. Many tournaments, unfortunately, aren't fair. They are all very political, some moreso than others.

Sometimes someone feels cheated. Sometimes someone is cheated. Remember, it's just a game really.

Train as hard as you can. Be confident, neither doubtful nor arrogant concerning your own ability.

You only know what you know. Just like tests in school, some days you do better than others. It's not necessarily a reflection on your ability.

When I'm in a tournament, I do things to stay loose and ready. it also keeps me from sitting around mentally preoccupied about my upcoming event.

You will likely find they handle black belt weapons and katas, as well as synchronized katas, before breaking off into different rings. So, you will have a while to wait. Don't go stir crazy. Watch what you like, talk to ppl, have fun.

A tournament is a great place to meet some nice people. Enjoy it for all it offers and walk away from it wiser than you went in. Have fun!

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Domo, Navarre. It's only nerve-wracking because it's my first tourney. I already have heard how fickle the judges can be and I'm not going to stress over that. I simply wish to do the best I can, regardless of the outcome. To me, it is rather a personal test. Medals, trophies or nothing, my finish will be based on what I feel I've done.

 

[Navarre]

Oh, and my advice on katas, from one who's judged quite a few hundred:

I was trained from the start to incorporate 5 elements: Power, Focus, Concentration, Balance, and Form. I certainly think all of these are vital. Being from my original system, you may have been taught the same thing.

However, don't focus too much on just these 5 elements. The biggest problem I see with lower ranked katas is that the student is too focused on proper technique, trying to show how "perfect" he/she can execute the moves. Consequently, the kata looks very stiff. After watching a few of these, it's hard to want to watch another.

Instead, remember that a kata is supposed to be simulated combat. In a fight I don't focus my mental energy on sweeping my foot in an inside arc as I slide from one zenkusta-dachi to the next, making sure I execute my reverse punch by rotating..blah, blah, blah.

Make your kata "dynamic". By that I mean put yourself into a mental state that is closer to what you would be in during a fight. There is an intensity there that will come through. Let your techniques flow on their own, relying on your training. I would rather see a karateka who is "involved" in their own kata rather than trying to impress me with their stance.

Of course, I don't mean you should be sloppy in your technique. I'm saying that you should practice your katas for the tournament the same way. There are times you need to break down every little aspect of a kata but, in the tournament, let that preoccupation go.

My other advice on kata is to vary the pace. Too many ppl perform the entire kata at the same speed the whole way through. Why would I be impressed just because you kaiai on one of those punches when it was like all the rest?

Like in a real fight, sometimes you move quickly and sometimes you don't. Emphasize speed and power on important visual parts of the kata and wind down/up at other parts.

And lastly, in kata and kumite, here's a small thing that makes a big difference: Relax your shoulders. Most people, when they get tense, tighten across the shoulders and it affects everything. When the timing is right, relax the shoulders ands release the tension as if you were sighing. It helps; you'll see.

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Regarding kata, arigato. I do want the 5 elements to be present correctly. I also want, however, the kata to be fluid and not so much like some kinda robot. I do practice them in that fashion: 5 elements first, fluidity and naturalness second.


I see what you mean about varied pace. I will practice tonight with that in mind.

Regarding shoulder tension. I will need to note that during kumite. Sensei strongly advises relaxed fists, suggesting we tense immediately before connecting a strike or block. I have not noticed my shoulders. It seems I'm so busy noticing everything else at this stage

Again, thank you.

:asian:

 

[Navarre]

You are most welcome, Egg. After all, you gave me the Underdog parade balloon. I figured I owed you all the help I could. lol

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

You are most welcome, Egg. After all, you gave me the Underdog parade balloon. I figured I owed you all the help I could. lol

Excellent point!

 

[Navarre]

Hey, egg, how is your tournament training going? Has any of my advice been helpful or have you picked up more from Saturday morning cartoons?

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

Hey, egg, how is your tournament training going? Has any of my advice been helpful or have you picked up more from Saturday morning cartoons?

Lol! I only accept training from pre-1980 Chop-socky films, not Staurday toonage

Training proceeds apace. The night before last, I began to vary speeds in the first kata. I'm still bringing the second up to the point where I can manipulate the pace.

The tension I have in my shoulders is still evident; though, I'm told that my arms seem more relaxed, leading (of course) to speedier hits.

I've added wrist weights during practice of blocks and strikes. This, too, is adding some speed.

Sensei scoped the competition and dexcribed to me, during sparring, how I may prevail over my potential opponants. I'm still nervous; but, it's my first time and no one will be gentle.

heheh...really, I'm amped

 

[Navarre]

I've found the scariest opponents in tournaments to be white belts and those with a rank just under 1st black. White belts of course have little control and have wild movements.

On the other end of the under-black-belt continuum you have these guys who are so close to black belt they can taste it. They have good technique but are so determined to show it that their opponent ends up unconscious.

Don't sweat the kumite though. Have fun with it. A majority of your opponents will probably barge in a'swingin' like mad. Take your time and don't rush it. Work your angles and let your instincts do the rest.

Katas are worse because it's all sort of surreal. You wait forever in a group of 20, then stand "on deck" while the guy or gal before you does their kata. Then, oddly enough, I used to seem to lose all track of reality and time as soon as my name was called.

I'd hear my name called, vaguely remember walking to the judges, doing my bow, mumbling something about fu ku i dunno, and then it seemed the whole thing was over. Thirty second later I'm like "What happened?".

That's also a lot of what prompted my comment about speed. When I'm out there trying to "look good" I got all technical and everything became stiff. When I relaxed my shoulders, released that tension, and got myself into the mental fight, I could then exhibit better technique.

It also allowed for the variety in pace. I am strong in places and fluid in other. Sometimes I explode into a technique and sometimes I almost seem to take a rest; just like a real fight.

You'll do fine. I'm anxious to hear how it goes.

 

[Navarre]

So did relaxing your shoulders make a noticable difference in your relaxation, endurance, and awareness of your body?

 

[OnlyAnEgg]

So did relaxing your shoulders make a noticable difference in your relaxation, endurance, and awareness of your body?

When I thought to do it (it's not instinctual for me, yet) I felt I was quicker and more fluid. At this stage, I need to focus on being relaxed through my shoulders and, to a lesser extent, my arms.

Endurance seemed to be no greater to me. I admit to focusing more on landing one on Sensei than how long I'd been trying. My endurance has, in general, grown longer since I began.

As to awareness, I'd have to say that relaxing my arms allowed me to focus attention on other aspects of the fight. I can extrapolate from that the more I relax, the greater my awareness. Well, that sounds better reversed: when I am tensed, part of my focus is on the place of tension. Decreasing the tension increases awareness.