Korean swords that aren't katana analogs

Discussion in 'Korean Swords and Sword Arts' started by Daniel Sullivan, May 27, 2011.

  1. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    How many of you who practice a Korean sword art do so with a sword other than the Wae Geom (Japanese sword, i.e. a Katana or katana analog)?

    I know that there were a good number of Korean swords that were either not curved, double edged, or otherwise differed greatly from the katana, yet every Korean sword art that I see seems to have people in hakama-like pants with swords that look pretty much like... well... a katana.

    Daniel
     
  2. Namii

    Namii Green Belt

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    You know, thats a good question. I haven't seen any videos or anyone in a Korean sword art with a non-katanalike sword.
    Our group does the katana thing. What I've seen in our dojang so far were some random aluminum kagums that I don't know where they came from-probably the HDGD federation, cheapy Musashi iaitos are very popular, a kagum from MAS, a Hanwei Practical iaito, and my Hanwei Nami iaito. And alot of people who are able to use them just don't. They just stick with the mokgum.
    Our pants are huge and flowy but a lot easier than hakama to put on since the waist band is just a stretchy thing and strings to tie it.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2011
  3. Josh Oakley

    Josh Oakley Senior Master

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  4. Namii

    Namii Green Belt

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    That was interesting.
     
  5. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    Hmm, okay, maybe this is just me coming from a three hour class today on Koryu Iai, but what on earth was that? From the comments on the you-tube page it seems to be a formal pattern (for 1st Dahn, if I read it correctly), but there was so much wrong and simply useless in the entire sequence that I thought it was made up by the guy performing it. Seriously, nearly half of the things he was doing (or more, I stopped counting...) were so far removed from any form of combative logic or reality that there was no point (ha!) having them in there. Sure, he was clean as he moved (well, sorta...), but against an actual swordsman, he's also dead.

    "Interesting" was certainly one word that could apply.....
     
  6. Phenix_Rider

    Phenix_Rider Orange Belt

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    Wow. And here I thought the WTSDA sword forms were silly...
     
  7. Namii

    Namii Green Belt

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    what is WTSDA?
     
  8. Ken Morgan

    Ken Morgan Senior Master

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    Well I'm heading out to two hours of iai and two hours of jodo and I concur with your thoughts Chris, he's dead in a real combat situation.

    All the way through the video I was thinking it was just another version of this...


    Will someone explain to me what it is he is doing please? I don't understand.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014
  9. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    Guess we'll need an actual KSW practitioner to explain. Not at all familiar with the form.

    To Namii, I think that WTSDA is World Tang Soo Do Association. If it isn't Phoenix Rider will have to tell us what it is.

    Daniel
     
  10. Phenix_Rider

    Phenix_Rider Orange Belt

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    It is. I've been watching 2nd and 3rd dans do sword forms. Lots of bouncing on one leg and spinning above the head.
     
  11. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    Are TSD sword forms made up specifically by TSD people (like Hankumdo was invented by Myung Jae Nam)? Or do they have origins in an actual sword art?

    Daniel
     
  12. Namii

    Namii Green Belt

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    He might as well be twirling a baton. haha!
    I dont really understand the form either.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014
  13. Phenix_Rider

    Phenix_Rider Orange Belt

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    I think they're made up, same as the staff forms. The committee takes whatever they know and crams it together so they can market it as unique.
     
  14. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    I don't have any problems with an organization creating its own forms, but when creating a sword form, some consideration should be given to how a sword is actually used and not just to how cool it looks.

    Daniel
     
  15. Phenix_Rider

    Phenix_Rider Orange Belt

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    That's my issue with it. Yeah, it looks cool, it shows off control, etc., but it it doesn't really serve a purpose.
     
  16. Brian R. VanCise

    Brian R. VanCise MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I would say it definitely does not look cool! [​IMG]
     
  17. Sukerkin

    Sukerkin Have the courage to speak softly

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    Altho' I don't normally like to criticise those brave enough to put their 'forms' out for public review, I have to say I stand with my brothers of the blade in this matter.

    The chap in the original video was fancy and well practised, aye. But I mean no braggadocio when I say that I reckon any JSA practioner will watch that and be thinking "He was dead two seconds in".

    That's a critique of the style, not the practioner, just to be clear.
     
  18. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    Perhaps that is the purpose.

    Daniel
     
  19. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    Then it fails. I see little control as it pertains to the use of a sword there, the initial downward cuts are just swinging it around, no controlled cutting at all, the rest is similarly bad. But the big issue for me is that it is put forth as swordsmanship, when it is really little more than fantasy and imaginings of what swordsmanship might be. The only purpose swordsmanship can have in a modern age is learning how to use, manipulate, generate power, and cut with a sword, not self defence, not "completeness" of a system, and certainly not "well, we think it's a cool weapon, so we decided to make something up and put it in there!" And without some connection to the way swords were used (realistically) then there is no way that what is being presented can be considered swordsmanship.
     
  20. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    Actually, we were talking about the TSD sword forms that Phoenix mentioned, not the KSW one that was linked.

    I have not seen any of these forms myself, so I will refrain from commenting on them, aside from saying that sword forms made up (as opposed to sword forms with an historical basis) by a bunch of karate guys do not count as legitimate sword arts in my opinion.

    Daniel
     

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