Koga Ha Kosho Shorei Ryu Kempo...

Discussion in 'Organizations' started by koga ha, Mar 16, 2005.

  1. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    Gentlemen/Ladies,

    The webiste is up; however, it is still under construction.

    I think you will find the writings an excellent read and a breath of fresh air.

    Take a look: kogahakempo.com

    Do not short change yourself; read the information.
     
  2. The Kai

    The Kai Master of Arts

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    Well they say if you can say nothing nice say nothing at all............


    Just two things tho'
    1.) There is no record of Mitose travel "extensively" in Japan
    2.) Motobu's family denies Mitose ever trained with Choki Motobu

    If you write it's not a fact
     
  3. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    where are you getting your data from?
     
  4. The Kai

    The Kai Master of Arts

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    Well basically anywhere but Durbin!!

    In all the stories about Mitose there is no recollection of his travel throuughout Japan (In fact in Durbin's fiction was the first time I ever read that)

    Motubu, Journal of Asian Martial Arts had a article a couple of years back, which motubu stated there was no family connection nor any training between the two men.
    Where do you get your data??
     
  5. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    Your comments lead me to believe that you should re-read the information again. Slow down a little, so you don't miss or misinterpret what you are reading. Thank you.
     
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  6. Kembudo-Kai Kempoka

    Kembudo-Kai Kempoka Senior Master

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    A breath of freash air and an excellent read? We have had this issue discussed ad nauseum by men on this board who are well-accomplished kenpo/kempo historians, and who have authored many of the best-researched articles on the history of Mitose, Nimrod Hassan, etc. Not an excellent read: A juvenile attempt at justifying ones own lineage, when it is not justifiable. At least get the Japanese honorifics right, and the use of title in writing (also beaten to death in other threads on this site).

    I read it. It's silly. And if you opt to believe the grandiosity proclaimed in it, I have a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you. The whole "Koga Ha" thing has, itself, been beaten to death by better educated men without a stake in the outcome. Hassan is not a ninja. Mitose was not privvy to the secret teachings of koga-ryu ninjutsu adepts. Durbin made up his kyujite (however the hell he spells it), and granted some bunch of guys recognition ranks, who in turn recognized his. And to have the audacity to check in to a community of historians and law enforcement officials who know better with this clap-trap junk...

    I've been wondering why they haven't responded to your posts. But I get it. Telling a hallucinating psychotic that he really isn't Richard Nixon...or a toaster, or tunafish sandwich, or vampire...will never cause him to sacrifice his buy-in to the alternate reality he's created for himself. What there is to be said, has been said. And if you're still choosing to believe in the preposterous...Well, it is America, and that (for a while, at least, and on some issues) grants you the right to free speech.

    Good luck on your journey, and may you never fully believe your own delusions.

    Dave
     
  7. The Kai

    The Kai Master of Arts

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    "While the Bugei Ryuha Daijiten lists many facets about Ryu where a lineage is known, in regard to the Kosho Ryu there is no lineage given. This could be so, if Mitose, who traveled extensively to Japan, was the founder of the system and did so after being in the United States for a period of time. "
    Posted from the website


    "It might be asked, why did Mitose want to conceal the Okinawan connection of his art? The answer to this is two fold. First of all, Mitose was a very spiritual and peaceful man, as one of those who knew him in Hawaii put it, "he was a very nice person, if he wasn't, I wouldn't have studied with him".

    Karate as taught to Mitose by Choki Motobu, was complete and effective, yet Motobu himself had a less than sterling reputation. He was known as a person who would engage in combat for what most people would consider less than appropriate reasons. However, this reputation, while somewhat deserved, was not totally accurate. "
    Also Posted from the website


    Alas, oh Obscure One what I am I misreading???

    Do you have any other sources than Durbin, basically anything creditable??
     
  8. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    i might respond when you start speaking in your big-boy voice.
     
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  9. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    the sentence stated mitose traveled TO japan, not in or throughout like you stated. again, please slow down and read what is being wrote, not what you think it reads.
     
  10. The Kai

    The Kai Master of Arts

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    What does travelling extensively to a place supposed to mean?? But point taken the way it was written fooled my eye

    Wasting time reading poorly written fiction, now I have to read to even more carefully!!
     
  11. BlackCatBonz

    BlackCatBonz Master Black Belt

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    a lot of kempo newbies fall for durbin's stories
     
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  12. Kembudo-Kai Kempoka

    Kembudo-Kai Kempoka Senior Master

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    Then don't respond. I reserve that voice for men of honor, not self-deluding wannabe's.

    Y'all have fun.

    D.
     
  13. Matt

    Matt Black Belt

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    How's this for a big boy voice.

    Dr. Durbin's effort is inadequate. Motobu Chosei has gone on record categorically stating that there is no relation to Mitose by family, and that there is no record of his training as a student with Motobu Choki. Durbin never met nor trained with Mitose. Durbin's impression of Mitose's trial appear to be the perspective of one who has not actually read the transcripts. As far as Terry Lee / Nimr Hassan's role as murderer, if you call breaking in and surprising an elderly gentleman and his wife as they slept and then stabbing the man with a screwdriver 'reasoning', than Durbin may be on to something.

    If we want to use opinion pieces, let's use mine, at:

    http://home.comcast.net/~matthewabarnes/mitose.html

    It's not completely done yet, but, I like to call it:
    James Mitose: Conman and partner in a murder conspiracy or innocent victim of a vast conspiracy that was probably orchestrated by the real killer in the O.J. Simpson case?

    In case you have any illusions that Mitose trained with Motobu extensively, it references this map, as many people are not familiar with Japan, and are apparently of the mind that it is like a small town; if you and I travel there, we'll be destined to cross paths. http://home.comcast.net/~matthewabarnes/map.html
    Seeing as it is instead hundreds of miles from where Mitose was to the closest dojo run by Motobu Sensei, it is unlikely that they trained together.

    I will say that Nimr Hassan does often get shortchanged in the estimation of his training in Martial arts. He was apparently a black belt when he met Mitose, so maybe he could have absorbed two entire systems in those seven weeks. Of course, if you've been training with him for more than seven weeks and you don't know the whole of the two systems, you should probably ask yourself, is he a lousy teacher, or are you just a horrible student.


    Matt
     
  14. Randy Strausbaugh

    Randy Strausbaugh Master Black Belt

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    The phrase implies that Mitose made several trips to Japan - something which is totally unsupported by documentation (AFAIK).
     
  15. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    matt, randy, kembudo, blackcatbonz, and kai...i really don't put a lot of weight to your comments and it's interesting how much energy and effort you put into trying to prove me wrong...

    i know each of you have heard this before or maybe not, but it's kind of like the tail thinking it's wagging the dog. you guys are the tail.

    i know you and others out there think along the same lines in regard to your comments; however, your little group is not the only people this information touches.

    so, let me not keep you guys from making the same redundant comments.
     
  16. The Kai

    The Kai Master of Arts

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    It's ot always a good thing when a BS'er begins to believe his own lies, So Koga good luck.
     
  17. Matt

    Matt Black Belt

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    Actually, I just try to research, preserve and promote as much truth about kempo history as I can. That's where the effort goes. This isn't about you. Posts like yours just give me an opportunity to post a fact or two and spread the knowledge.

    When the dog goes around posting wildly inaccurate history, it's good that the tail is around to set him straight.

    What exactly is my little group? Am I president of it? Do we have to have meetings? I hate meetings.

    If you are referring to a 'martial art' organization, I don't think I belong to any that you may have in mind. My posts don't necessarily reflect the views of any organizational entity, they are just mine. I'm just trying to be sure that the other people touched by your information have access to some facts in addition to what you are offering.

    If you are referring to us as a group because we all share a wacky preference for truth as opposed to fairly tales in martial arts biographies and history, then yes, I guess we are a group.

    No meetings though, I hate meetings.


    I think they seem redundant because one does not have to periodically change a story when it is based on facts. What exactly are you hoping for?

    Matt
     
  18. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    no, don't change your story, i was pointing out the fact that it is redundant.
     
  19. The Kai

    The Kai Master of Arts

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    Again the truth is redundant. It does't change, or make hugh leaps in logic.
     
  20. koga ha

    koga ha Orange Belt

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    no, what you're saying is redundant.
     

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