Judo or Taekwondo for best self defense?

Discussion in 'General Self Defense' started by BmillerWarrior, Nov 27, 2017.

  1. sinthetik_mistik

    sinthetik_mistik Purple Belt

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    Flintlocks all the way :D
     
  2. sinthetik_mistik

    sinthetik_mistik Purple Belt

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    actually most martial arts start out as self defense then turn into sports. Taekwondo is an Olympic sport, which by my way of thinking, is about the highest honor a martial art can have
     
  3. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    Really? I’m not sure that’s true.
     
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  4. sinthetik_mistik

    sinthetik_mistik Purple Belt

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    well I mean even the ones that turn into sports it doesn't mean that they are no longer effective for self defense. although there are some martial arts that I would not recommend in a self defense situation. also, the sport aspect creates professional fighters, people who train 5-6 hours a day... who can beat up just about anybody
     
  5. shobukanmartialarts

    shobukanmartialarts White Belt

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    For self defense, I believe judo is the best. First off, taekwondo and karate both focus primarily on striking techniques. And there’s nothing wrong with that, but self defense in my opinion is best when it can be shown. Judo or martial arts focuses mainly on grapples, which don’t physically do damage on their own.If your daughter gets into an altercation and she ends up punching her attacker in the face, that would look a lot worse for her than simply grabbing her attacker and throwing them to the ground. And of course, like every other user on the planet, I have to say that it shouldn’t really matter because it should never get to a point where she has to use it, but of course that’s easier typed than done. And if she does need to use it, in the real world, a broken nose could result in a lawsuit, and a grapple really couldn’t result in much backlash.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 28, 2018
  6. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    I think a throw, joint lock, and/or choke can be more effective for an undersized person trying to defend themself. A broken bone, dislocated joint and/or a choke that results in unconsciousness could result in a lawsuit just as easily and possibly more easily than a broken nose.

    You seem to be comparing a grappling restraint to an alleged excessive strike rather than an alleged excessive grapple. It doesn’t matter in which manner you defend yourself; if you’re going to put your hands on someone you’d better be able to justify why and the amount of force used, rightfully or wrongfully.
     
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  7. PiedmontChun

    PiedmontChun Blue Belt

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    True. People can have serious damage from a throw. An untrained person is likely to try and post out an arm if falling or being thrown, which is just asking to break a limb, or not know to tuck their chin to their chest if falling to the rear. That can be almost as hard to explain as giving a black eye or broken nose.

    I personally think grappling of some kind is needed for self defense though, not because it is "better" or more "effective" than striking, but because it helps with self-preservation in ways a lot of striking arts ignore. Some fights start with a punch, but just as many start with pushing, grabbing of the limbs or clothing. If you don't know how to fall or deal with being grabbed and pushed, then your striking is going to less effective.
     
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  8. kravmaga1

    kravmaga1 Yellow Belt

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    Judo and Taekwondo, both are good self-defense techniques. But which one is better, it depends upon the person, that's how well he or she has gone through a training and practiced it and what is best and comfortable for him or her in self-defense.
     
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  9. axelb

    axelb Yellow Belt

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    Neither are good for "self defense", the self defence part comes from all the scenario up until the fight starts.
    Observation, conversation, body language.
    All these are rarely taught in judo or tkd.

    After that point, which is better for fighting?
    That depends on how the school trains.
    I have seen more constituency in live training in Judo, than TKD. Judo has newaza and randori to regularly test the techniques under pressure.

    That being said, there are plenty of TKD schools available that will teach you to strike/defend striking, and aren't just about forms/pad work.
     
  10. thekaratekid

    thekaratekid White Belt

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    Judo!!! but train both cant hurt
     
  11. Isaiah90

    Isaiah90 Orange Belt

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    Neither one for these reasons.



    Both have no striking - In Taekwondo, it's illegal for you to strike. Not to mention, not enough time is spent on striking in Taekwondo. Striking is one of the most common forms of unarmed attacks. Same goes for Judo. I've compiled cases of Judokas and Taekwondo practitioners getting beat up in real-life attacks. Check it out.



    Both don't address weapons - The second problem with Taekwondo and Judo is the lack of weapons training for self defense. If you're not effectively training to deal with weapons, you're setting yourself up to get hurt or killed. That's what happened to many Judokas and Taekwondo practitioners. One Judoka got sprayed with a toxic chemical then got his fingers chopped off one by one. He was beaten to death with a hammer. Other Judokas and Taekwondo practitioners were shot dead in drive-by shootings.



    Those arts will likely get you beaten or killed on the streets.
     
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  12. pdg

    pdg Senior Master

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    I absolutely love it when someone is so sure of themselves yet are so massively, hugely uninformed that they make themselves look utterly stupid.

    Come to TKD class with me, get punched in the face, go home happy.

    The clue is in the name, (very roughly translated) the way of the foot and fist.

    An olympic match isn't everything about TKD, and not all TKD is focused purely on that aspect of sport.

    Of course, you probably won't accept that because some guy on YouTube told you different.

    And exactly what art would defend against that anyway? Using your chi to divert the bullet?

    And anyway, the closest we get to drive by shootings around here is when I take a picture while travelling in a car.

    Again, exactly what art is designed to protect you against that?

    I'm not even going to go near the idea of other weapons, because you won't accept anything I say.




    Here's an idea, pull your head out of your butt for a while and have a look around. Get some real facts about things before you attempt to publicly bash and berate them.

    So now we've discovered you're spouting absolute balls, what magic art are you going to say is infallible and that everyone should do instead?
     
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  13. pdg

    pdg Senior Master

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    Oh yeah, I've just remembered - you're trying to start your own school.

    Yeah, trash talking other arts is a fantastic way to get respect.

    So come on then @Isaiah90 , describe how you'd defend against an acid attack, where someone just walks up to you and throws liquid in your face.

    Or, describe your defence against a drive by shooting.


    Or are these so secret and deadly that I have to sign up for a 3 year course and you'll tell me at the end?
     
  14. Dirty Dog

    Dirty Dog MT Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    What the hell are you talking about? Have you ever actually been in a dojang? TKD is all about striking. Grappling, joint locks and throws are taught, certainly (to varying extents, depending on the specific style and school), but the primary focus of TKD is striking.

    Again, what the hell are you talking about? I've been studying TKD since about 1969. I've spent a lot of time practicing (and teaching) the very things you claim don't exist in TKD.

    First, I'd like to see a citation for this little story. Because honestly it sounds like something from a movie. Or something you just made up.
    On the other hand, I'd really like to hear how you expect ANY martial arts training to stop a bullet in a drive-by shooting.
     
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  15. frank raud

    frank raud Master Black Belt

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    Hmmm in Judo the Kime-no-kata was developed in 1888. It has techniques against both unarmed and armed opponents, mainly sword. The Goshin jutsu kata was updated in 1956 and includes defense against stick, knife and gun. If you want to discuss how the particular techniques are ineffective or outdated, that is one thing. If you want to point out that many judoka don't practice these katas, that is another. To claim that judo does not have training for weapons only shows that you don't know what you're talking about. Judo also has striking techniques, again in kata form. Just because striking is not legal in competition, does not mean it doesn't exist.
    No striking in Tae Kwon Do? I'm not sure even where to begin with that stupidity.
     
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  16. Isaiah90

    Isaiah90 Orange Belt

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    lol that's my point - none. The best defense is having guns, knives, melee weapons, and other weapons yourself. Trying to resolve everything with grappling, kicking, or striking, etc. is limiting your chances of survival.
     
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  17. mdavidg

    mdavidg Yellow Belt

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    I personally believe that any martial arts program should incorporate weapons training. And this is why me and my boys, may choose one martial art but we will also take a Kali or Escrima class. Why? Because who else is going to teach you how to use your car key as a weapon? And that one key may mean the difference between life and death for you.
     
  18. Isaiah90

    Isaiah90 Orange Belt

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    Well many don't. At least not for self defense. What are you going to do when you have someone firing rounds at you? Are you going to try to get in close with your Kali or Escrima sticks?

    Why would you use Kali or Escrima sticks to begin with? They lack the reach and power of modern melee weapons like baseball bats, pipes, etc. If i wanted to defend myself, i'd use those weapons instead.
     
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  19. pdg

    pdg Senior Master

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    OK, so for a start - not everyone lives in the apparent war zone that you do.

    If I carry a gun and get caught with it (that's just carrying, not brandishing or using) then last I heard that's an automatic 5 year prison sentence.

    If I actually use it, well then my sentence is increased exponentially, whether I cause harm or not.

    Carrying a knife? That I can do, if I have a justifiably good reason to do so and it's size and design meets certain criteria - "self defence" is NOT a legally defendable good reason.

    Baseball bat? Sure, I can carry one if I'm going to or from playing baseball.

    Pipe? Yeah, if I'm a plumber I'd get away with some pipe in the van. Tucked in my belt while shopping? That's at least a night in the cells and most likely a court appearance.

    Basically, I'm not allowed to carry a weapon - or any item that I'm intending to use as a weapon.

    Even if I could, none of the weapons would give you any extra edge in a drive by or an acid attack.
    None.
    No edge.
    At all.
    Even a bit.

    Also, I'd look a right wanker wandering about carrying a baseball bat.

    Someone firing rounds at me?

    For one thing, a lump of pipe isn't going to anything.

    For another, the chances of that happening anywhere near here are less than winning the lottery, while getting struck by lightning.
     
  20. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    In most cases, carrying a baseball bat or pipe around is going to get you in trouble. Of course, so would carrying a rattan stick. However, knowing how to apply stick and staff technique makes a lot more useful weapons available in the environment around you.

    And no, guns and knives are not universal solutions. They are tools, and sometimes have a place.
     
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