jigsaw poker with wing chun

Discussion in 'Wing Chun' started by Snark, Feb 6, 2018.

  1. Cephalopod

    Cephalopod Green Belt

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    Hi Snark!

    I completely agree that the principles of structure are the most definitive. They kinda form the base of the pyramid, without which nothing else can function.

    Now I should clarify that I am abusing the word 'structure' to include all the movements of the body and limbs, or at least instantaneous snapshots thereof.

    And yet when I roll with practitioners from other lineages, the differences that I usually feel between us are those of tension and timing. However...(caveat)...differences in tension, for example, are often necessitated by differences in structure. For example, the positioning of his elbow in bong sao may require him to flex his shoulder unduly to ward off a sudden attack.

    I do like your point about how you can sometimes pick up on some subtle clues that the dude practicing the form might not have intended to display. An example of this might be little vibrations caused by flexion of muscles.

    So yeah, you can tell a great deal about a chunner's principles by watching his forms but I would still want to touch hands with him before I draw any conclusions about the efficacy of his style. Helps to reduce my diet of humble pie. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2018
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  2. Snark

    Snark Orange Belt

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    I happily concede... forms won't tell you everything and the real detail and skill of a practitioner will only become apparent from touching hands or sparring.

    I am (just to stick in my own prejudices) a little wary about Chi Sau on its own though, as although again it is a very important aspect, it seems to have become almost a separate beast to the wing chun menagerie as opposed to just a transitionary stage during interaction.
     
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  3. wckf92

    wckf92 Master Black Belt

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    @Snark is this public vs private form stuff still in use today on the mainland? Why do they do that?
     
  4. Snark

    Snark Orange Belt

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    I don't know... it's a secret and I haven't been told. :)

    maybe its because knowledge is only valuable to the majority when its held by the minority....

    but what do I know (I can't find a shrugging emoticon so "shrugging emoticon goes here")
     
  5. Cephalopod

    Cephalopod Green Belt

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    Chisao, as I see it, is a lousy quantitative measure of ones fighting ability. It is however an excellent qualitative test of ones skill.

    (Here, i'm referring to the sort of chisao that happens between practitioners from 2 different clubs which invariably heats up to a degree and involves footwork, separation and re-bridging, the occasional random strikes from add angles etc.)

    As I get older, I find myself a little less preoccupied with the former. I can spend a lot of energy trying to work out whether I, or my opponent, would survive the fictitious 'stairwell encounter' but the fact remains that there are many, many variables in survival combat only some of which have anything to do with martial art skill.

    The latter, on the other hand, I find endlessly intriguing. If my opponent finds a way to out position, unbalance, or overwhelm me...now that gives me something to work on, a pathway to improvement.

    Now of course, I never want to lose track of the fact that WC is a fighting art, not some arcane dance. Everything within needs to be considered in terms of harsh reality and tested accordingly. But for me, I have found over the years that focusing more on the latter has actually developed my ability quite satisfactorily in the former. Without all that fetishizing violence stuff. :)

    I realize this might not actually address the points on your post, but you gave me an opening to launch my little tirade on the value of chisao. So...hey, thanks!
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2018

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