Intimidating Clothing and Opponents and that 'feeling'!

[Corporal Hicks]

Hi there,
I just returned from watching Shawn Of The Dead (not bad film!) and as I walked through the market square I saw a group of teenagers, about a year younger than me, so about 16 and they were wearing puffa jackets (nicked named poof jackets) with short hair, but what caught my attention is the way they looked and walked. They looked quite rough, the type (we think we are hard), I dont know why but I got that 'feeling' you get, its not quite fear but its in your stomach and you begin to question your own ability as you walk such as (can I really peform a sufficient side kick, or block a punch?). I'm hoping to go in the Police eventually and I hope that they will teach my how to deal with this sort of thing.
Does anybody else know that sort of feeling I'm talking about, the sort you get when people start to get agrressive and begin to start on you, or when you are getting threatened. Does anybody else know this feeling? and how to stop or at least reduce it?
Regards
Nick

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

Hi there,
I just returned from watching Shawn Of The Dead (not bad film!) and as I walked through the market square I saw a group of teenagers, about a year younger than me, so about 16 and they were wearing puffa jackets (nicked named poof jackets) with short hair, but what caught my attention is the way they looked and walked. They looked quite rough, the type (we think we are hard), I dont know why but I got that 'feeling' you get, its not quite fear but its in your stomach and you begin to question your own ability as you walk such as (can I really peform a sufficient side kick, or block a punch?). I'm hoping to go in the Police eventually and I hope that they will teach my how to deal with this sort of thing.
Does anybody else know that sort of feeling I'm talking about, the sort you get when people start to get agrressive and begin to start on you, or when you are getting threatened. Does anybody else know this feeling? and how to stop or at least reduce it?
Regards
Nick

For me, it seems deeply related to perspective. If someone is mad-doggin me, and my manly-man status is the only thing on the line, I get that feeling. I've never had it (and subsequently been hurt) when in the position of fulfilling a duty or protecting someone who could not or would not fend for themselves.

If it's just a pissing contest at a stop light, I hesitate. On the flip side, I've got a Crusader Rabbit streak as wide as Texas...recently waded into a sea of local gangsta nobs without a thought towards consequence, because they were giving some young, fresh off the boat Armenian gal some crap...WHILE PUSHING HER NEWBORN IN A STROLLER!!! At that moment, I had no doubts I could have put them all down...I may have taken some shots, and even been brutally wounded, but there was no way in hell any one of them were gonna walk out of there, and I wasn't. One of those things you just know.

In a nutshell, if I feel justified, I don't get nervous; I get angry...calm, but searing. Seems to be when I'm at my most dangerous, and my most stupid. If justification is lacking, I doubt my reasons for being knee-deep in the first place, doubt my ability to engage, and so hamstring my ability to engage...usually having the predictable effect of me barely engaging; certainly not enough to look like I knew squat about squat.

Know in your heart you are doing the right thing, and the rest will follow. If you're still intelligent enough to feel the fear, it'll feul the fire in the belly, and not hamper it.

My own experience.

Dave

 

[Touch Of Death]

Hi there,
I just returned from watching Shawn Of The Dead (not bad film!) and as I walked through the market square I saw a group of teenagers, about a year younger than me, so about 16 and they were wearing puffa jackets (nicked named poof jackets) with short hair, but what caught my attention is the way they looked and walked. They looked quite rough, the type (we think we are hard), I dont know why but I got that 'feeling' you get, its not quite fear but its in your stomach and you begin to question your own ability as you walk such as (can I really peform a sufficient side kick, or block a punch?). I'm hoping to go in the Police eventually and I hope that they will teach my how to deal with this sort of thing.
Does anybody else know that sort of feeling I'm talking about, the sort you get when people start to get agrressive and begin to start on you, or when you are getting threatened. Does anybody else know this feeling? and how to stop or at least reduce it?
Regards
Nick

Cherish that feeling; its what makes you train. :asian:
sean

 

[bluenosekenpo]

Cherish that feeling; its what makes you train. :asian:
sean

TOD - mmmmhhhmmmm, fear, the mighty motivator, i hear you bro.

CH - i'm 20+ years your senior, and i still get the wobblies in a situation like you described, if you're lucky
they will never go away, they keep you safe, those feelings are friends, not cowardly enemies. you listen
to them. there will be a time to draw your line and make a stand, just make sure it's worth it, you may
injure or kill someone, be hurt or killed yourself, end up in jail or start a feud that will probably lead up to
one of the aforementioned.

here's a personal anecdote, afew months ago i was working out at a gym, i wanted to use a tricep rope,
at the feet of a 20something big guy and his friends. i asked if he was using it and he spun around
swearing, white knuckled and ready to go! (ROIDRAGE). i thought, this guy ain't joking, so i quietly asked
if he was really going to hit me, and i moved slowly in on him, my left open hand about 1" above his right
(ready to jab to eyes or check), my right in a check between his throat and groin(self explainatory), my left
knee patella about 1" from the side of his knee, right foot ready for a quick oblique kick, and i was talking very
quietly and soothingly the whole time.

he had walked full stride over my line in the sand.

i got to the point where if he twitched, he would have been hurt, badly. he stepped down, i got the rope,
and finished working out.

you may ask,"i say, commander mcbrag, that's all entertaining but what's your point, sah?" (really crappy english accent)

the point is, at this gym there were alot of older(older than me!40+!) people who might have been hurt by this guy, if they
tried to do something as mundane as pick up piece of rope.

be confident enough in yourself and your abilities to walk away, if you have to fight, believe in yourself,
hit hard, fast, dirty and stack the odds in your favour. note, i have only recently returned to the MA's after a
long absence, so i'm not one of those MA superheroes. just a normal guy. with a line in the sand.

the freakiest thing about the whole encounter wasn't the fact that people within ear shot, thought it was one of the
coolest things they had seen, or that his friends walked out on him. it was the fact that i was responding in the third
person, no fear, just deadly analysis, and .....just ...afew wobblies. keep safe.

 

[MA-Caver]

I know that feeling, well. Still get it. It's your human nature warning you to be careful because our base animal instincts are being aroused to danger. Now civilized we learn how to control and harness such instincts. Those of us here, train to utilize those instincts with the skills we have acquired or in process of.
Fear is a healthy thing. It's not being a coward to feel afraid. Being a coward is feeling afraid and not doing anything about it or not helping someone in trouble when it's in your resources to do so. Still that feeling is still there. Nobody wants to be feeling hurt/pain. So it stops us from doing. But we have the ability to over-ride it. Not easy but it comes with practice and self confidence that you can do what you must, even if it's walk-away.
I think I've posted this litany here on MT before but I'll do so again. Yeah, it's science fiction in one perspective but good words in another.

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
– Bene Gesserit Litany from Frank Herbert's Dune

 

[Thesemindz]

Personally, and I think the posts here support a similar view, I feel that way when I'm not really sure I should be doing this. Before I started training, I would get nervous, put my dukes up, and react poorly. Now I'm alot less likely to let it get anywhere near that far. And when I'm sure it's worth fighting for, I've never felt shaky or afraid. More like resigned. When I've been in situations where I really thought it was about to go down, I've felt calm. Neither afraid or excited, at least until afterwards.

All that being said, I've never been in a serious physical altercation, read more than shoving, since I started training in Kenpo. I really believe that this is because I don't panic and put up my fists like I used to, thereby instigating the combat. Instead I usually just stand back and watch to see where this is going. Most of the time, it really does take two to tango.


-Rob

 

[8253]

that feeling is a normal reaction to a situation that gets your adrenaline going, basically if you think there may be a possibility that you may be in a physical altercation and may take some heavy shots by multiple opponents your body is just reacting to the situatuation, preparing itself for trauma. combat breathing will help this feeling.

 

[Corporal Hicks]

Whats combat breathing? How do you do it? I guess this is armed forces stuff?

 

[Tony]

Well I get scared when I'm out at night and its usually at night a lot of fights occur because of silly little things like accidentally spilling drinks over other people, chatting to other guys girlfriends. For instance Saturday night after we got out of the club we were in we were walking down a side street in town and my friend happen to notice someone he did not want to bump into. This person had 4 more of his friends with them and they were all chanting football songs. So we had to wait for them to move away and luckily they did go. I do get afraid all the time in situations like that and always think it best to avoid them. One time I was gestured non verbally to move away from this guy's chair. He didn't say excuse me but with a deliberate nod of his head he was gesturing for me to move. Now this was in a nightclub and I was not prepared to fight about it! But to be honest I was scared because you don't know if that person has friends willing to fight with him. It was rude of him and I still feel like a coward for not doing anything. I have been studying Kung fu for 6 years now and I think i have enough knowledge to handle myself but the prospect of getting into a fight scares me. To be verbally threatened with violence scares me too and I always back off. I was bullied at school from 12 to 16 but at primary school I managed to get the better of many people. It seemed like I had no problem with fighting guys twice my size.
Of course I would like to think that if I really need to I could use my skills to defend myself!

 

[loki09789]

Whats combat breathing? How do you do it? I guess this is armed forces stuff?

Actually, the armed forces (at least in the States) don't do much in terms of mental/emotional preparation for survival stress. Generally there are some mentions of the physiological reaction of fight or flight, first aid courses will mention how to deal with a shockie wound.

Generally, the emphasis in the military is to establish a mission focused mentallity that springs from personal unit loyalty (espirit de corps), army/corps values (selfless service, honesty....) and improving your professionalism with technical and tactical proficiency (technical knowledge of mapreading, radio communication, marksmanship, formations.... and the combat applications appropriate to the situation).

Things like healthy diet, rest, physical fitness, comradery.... are hinted at and alluded to as ways of dealing with the stresses but the main tool seems to be experience and professional/high quality training.

So, if the military model is inspiring, I guess the thing to take is to train train train for the best technique you can and know how to apply it well. The rest of it you have to accept that you can't control everything, and consign yourself that you could get hurt or die in the process... sounds like a great rationale to avoid fighting as much as possible to me

 

[bluenosekenpo]

I think this is more what was suggested?

Emotional Threshold Training
​

"3-Dimensional Training" and the Heart Rate Monitor
​

by: Phil Hughes, PDR Coach

"Here's my chance; time to move! I post his elbow and duck behind with just enough ballistic energy to slip on the puddle of sweat at my feet! I try to maintain control as I fall but he lands hard and heavy on my ribs and I'm sucking wind! Oh ****! I did NOT mean to do that! I shrug and tuck hard as his right arm slides over my face. I think my f***ing `. teeth are going to break! I can taste my fillings, but I pull hard and the arm comes off as I stabilize, rest, and try to keep my breakfast on the 'inside'...
...I am drenched with sweat and my heart rate is 192. I know this because back in the 'real world' the warning alarm on my Polar Pro Trainer has just gone off... Damn, I've only been jogging for 10 minutes!"

Mind, body and spirit. It may seem a bit mysterious, but 3-Dimensional Training, as Chu Fen Do founder Tony Blauer says, "is nothing more than being thorough." The secret is to make sure that you flex your 'mental muscles' and not just your biceps when you train. When I set about developing a cardiovascular program I wanted to confront an old problem: "Why can I run 10 miles in 61 minutes and feel winded after 61 seconds of hard fighting?" The answer, in the beginning, seems elementary: they are not the same exercises. But what about the boxer who can spar hard for 25 rounds in the gym but is completely 'gassed' at the end of round 3 in the ring. I think we would agree there is more to it than a question of 'physical conditioning'.

About two years ago I was approached by a promoter to compete in a submission grappling match against a very famous Brazilian jiu-jitsu black belt, Alan Goes. I agreed to the challenge immediately (In case you're wondering, I've also said yes to bungee jumping and walking on hot coals.). I had very little competitive experience in this arena, and certainly none at the level of Mr. Goes. My reason? I wanted to meet the person I would have to 'become' to face this dangerous man.

At Tony's request I contacted Walt Lysak, founder of Sento jiu-jitsu, a martial system which includes a devastating grappling arsenal, to develop the skill necessary for victory. Walt, in turn, sent me to his brother, Dinosaur Training coach Charlie Lysak, who designed an incredibly grueling power training workout to help me develop real world strength. This training would obviously be of invaluable assistance in developing the muscle memory, finesse, strength and endurance; as well as the confidence that comes from having those physical attributes. But, as Tony has often told me, "I don't care how you do it, I only care that you CAN do it."

Your mind quits before your body does. Period. Few of us have the 'intestinal fortitude' to duplicate the Greek soldier at Marathon who promptly died after running to deliver his message. Just remember, if you are still breathing and still conscious when you quit, it wasn't your body that blew the whistle. It was your mind. It was this 'emotional threshold' that, more than any single physical attribute I, as a combat athlete, needed most to expand. Thus, I began to look for ways to measurably increase this threshold, and how to use it to enhance my 'whole' arsenal; not just the physical one.

What I discovered about '3-Dimensional training' while preparing for this contest was that it is much more than a strategy of time management. It was the understanding that 'the mind navigates the body' and that mental and emotional conditioning are not only more important than the physical; they also, when present, enhance physical performance in ways unexcelled by any other type of 'resistance' training.

Training the emotional/psychological attributes is a subject that has only recently come into vogue. The research of performance psychologists, such as Charles Garfield, James Loehr and Denis Waitley, is now being accepted by athletes and coaches alike. Visualization and mental rehearsal for performance are not new ideas. They are being used extensively in both the athletic and corporate arenas. But how can you best utilize these training tools? Being a student of Tony Blauer's I approached this idea in the way he developed the first 'behaviorally based combative system', S.P.E.A.R. I.T. [1] . In order for any tool to be effective it must possess behavioral, psychological, and bio-mechanical truths. In other words; how is this based upon how I feel; how does how I feel affect how I think and; how do my thoughts and feelings affect how I move?

Feeling, thinking, and moving are all interrelated. Just as you cannot separate your nervous, circulatory, and respiratory systems and remain living; you cannot separate mental, spiritual, and physical training and expect it to remain 'live'. Techniques, such as visualization, are often utilized 'outside' of the physical realm. It is often the athletes 'homework', done while relaxing and listening to soft music. This type of training more closely replicates the 'calm' than the 'storm'. I am not discounting the necessity to develop the ability to retain focus, in fact, that is exactly my point. Remember what Bruce Lee said, "You can't learn to swim standing on the beach.". What will you do when the '**** hits the fan'? The real world does not operate under relaxed, controlled conditions. The mugger doesn't wait for you to warm up and the opposing coach won't postpone 'Superbowl Sunday' because your star player got arrested the night before.

"Failing to plan is like planning to fail", so, how do you plan 'for' failure? Often in training we train 'as if' everything goes according to plan. In our mental rehearsals we succeed with the poise and grace of a 'Saturday morning Superhero'. Without the presence of a 'motivated resistor' much physical training is the same way. Could there be a problem here? I don't know about you, but my biggest adrenaline dumps have come when things went WRONG! 'Oh ****!' is tougher than 'Oh Boy!' every time! How much adversity can you take before 'something gives'?

The Blauer method of expanding this threshold is contained in the terms 'mental blueprinting' and 'psychological void'. Basically this means that whenever you 'what if' a problem and work out the response in advance you have a 'mental blueprint', a plan to be followed if the situation is encountered in the future. Potential problems that have not been planned for in advance leave a 'psychological void' which can leave you scrambling for a plan of action when you should be acting on your plan. It is important to note here that the clarity and intensity of your 'mental blueprints' is directly determined by the clarity and intensity of your training. Blauer's three P's are useful for this: Keep your focus Personal, Passionate, and in the Present.

Experiment #1:

Strap on your heart rate monitor and climb on your favorite exercise machine (treadmill, stairmaster, etc.). After you program a comfortable steady pace and feel warmed up visualize a difficult scenario (Remember the three P's!). If you're performing the exercise correctly you should experience a noticeably increased heart rate. [2] The reason for performing this experiment at a controlled pace is that the natural tendency is to speed up as the level of stress increases. The point here is to see how performing' mental sprints' causes your body to respond accordingly.

It is easy to see here that the physical is very strongly linked to the mental and spiritual. If one area of the 'whole' falls under attack, the other parts quickly join the fight. This exercise is extremely valuable both from a standpoint of increasing your mental stamina and your aerobic/anaerobic capacity. However it is also important to learn how to mentally and physically rest while under duress.

Experiment #2:

Follow the same steps as before but now try to make the experience as intense as you possibly can. The more you can trick yourself into believing the mental movie the better. You should soon find yourself coming very close to your 'emotional threshold'. Do not quit! Now focus on detaching' yourself from the scenario. Be an observer, not a participant. Visualize yourself handling the situation without judging your performance. You should notice that, although your physical pace is unchanged, your heart rate will drop.

This exercise demonstrates the effect that controlling the mind can have on controlling the body. Sometimes you need to rest and regroup while still under stress. That is why I emphasize not stopping. Firstly, it helps you to develop the 'never quit' attitude necessary for success in any arena. Secondly, you may not always have the time or the ability to STOP and rest. Learn to rest while MOVING! In combat those that stop moving tend to stay that way! That is why this process is so important. The more problems you solve in advance the more clarity you will have when you need it most!

When you have worked through some difficult scenarios in this fashion for a while you will find that visualizing them well soon bring less of a physical response. This is normal and is also a good thing. This means your brain has written some good 'mental blueprints' and is accessing them with greater speed and less effort. To use a computer analogy; your hardware is driven by your software, don't neglect one to build the other.

You would do well to remember that your new 'Pentium III' won't work nearly as well without 'Windows' installed. 'Mental Blueprinting' is one of the best ways to make your mind/body/spirit interface 'user friendly'. It's easier to click the mouse than write the program. Write the program in training and run the program when it counts. You will always come up with some new problems to process and, who knows, some of the programs you've already installed may come in handy there too!

Although the experiments shown are just 'mental simulations' it should be pointed out that it doesn't have to stop at a cardiovascular program. Use the principle weight training, meditating and especially in your sport/combat specific training. Try to make your training replicate reality as closely as possible. You can never duplicate the actual event but make your training 'the best fake stuff available'! Remember, a true warrior trains himself 'completely' each hour of every day. Walt Lysak Jr. refers to this as the '24 hour training precept.' Complacency destroys spontaneity! Make your F.E.A.R. [3] your motivation to train. Pain, just like fear, is natures way of telling you something is wrong! Deal with it now. Pay now or pay later. Face your demons in private and when you meet them in a dark alley someday, they'll wish they never picked you in the first place.

It is interesting to note that the match with Alan Goes never came about. But it was never really about him anyway. It was about the process of 'becoming'. Through training '3-Dimensionally' I learned more than a few choice joint locks or how much I could lift. I learned a lot about who I was, what I F.E.A.R.ed and what I was willing or not willing to do to get where I needed to go. In the end, it was about being able to face that dangerous man. On the morning of 'The Day' I looked him in the eyes...

...'He' was Me.



[1] S.P.E.A.R. I.T.(Spontaneous Protection Enabling Accelerated Response, Instinctual Tactics) is based on the behavioral component of the natural flinch to 'push away danger', the psychological icon of a spear as a tool to 'impale' the charging enemy and, is bio-mechanically designed to protect the 'command center', the head, from sudden impact.

[2] If you have a heart rate monitor that keeps track of 'laps' it is easier to track your results. I personally like the 'Pro Trainer' by Polar.

[3] F.E.A.R. in the Blauer system represents three separate and interrelated acronyms: False Evidence Appearing Real (visual external), False Expectations Appearing Real (visual internal) and thus Failure Expected, Action Require

 

[8253]

Whats combat breathing? How do you do it? I guess this is armed forces stuff?

these types of situations lead to heavier breathing, or taking short breaths, usually unnoticed, thus speeding your heart up and dropping your oxygen levels. This is what creates that head is going to explode and nausea feeling. Combat breathing is slowing down your breathing, breathing in through the nose for 5 seconds, holding for 4 seconds and then releasing though the mouth for 5 seconds, this in turn slows you heart rate and allows you body to to absorb more oxygen thus calming you down to look at things with a more clear perspective. I have never been in the military. It is just something i picked up from one of my instructors in the academy. He used to be in the military though.

 

[Han-Mi]

It's late, and I'm tired. So I didn't read all of the replies, so If I say something that someone else said, forgive me. There are certain chemicals that work in your body to make it work right. They are released so that you can do what you need to do when you need to do it. What you are describing is basically the fight or flight syndrome. Certain chemicals are released to shut down and activate certain processes to prepair you to fight or run in the most efficient manner. You get used to it as you get older and more confident, I'm only 19 but 2 years ago, I felt like it meant I was scared, now I understand that It's o.k. to feel like that. It's what is natural, If it didn't happen then you would not be able to perform at full potential without warming up and stretching before you fought, And we all know you don't have time for that.

Anyway, basic Idea is - It's the natural fight or flight syndrome that takes over in order to prime your body for combat. Learn to enjoy it and use it.

 

[OULobo]

Time in the ring. I remember when I was starting in a new art and I was very hesitant to start sparring. I slowly worked into sparring and became more comfortable. The big problem was that the people I was sparring with were all just as reserved as I and they were the same people I had already sparred with. I soon started training on my off days in another art with another teacher. This one was a little more practical and a ton rougher. I noticed right off the bat that the only way to gain a little juice was to just tuck my chin and get in there. To my suprise I found that my skills were still there and still effective, I just had to adopt and more assertive fighting style. After this training I noticed that I was able to look at all situations with a little more confidence. I had the feeling that I had already been through worse and come out alive and educated. My view has changed a little. I still have little question about ability to survive the situation, now I've learned that the best way to survive is to be aware. Aware of dangers, my abilities and consequences. Fear is a natural and beneficial feeling. It lets us know about danger and gives us motivation. Just remember that we are creatures of will not instict and so it is within our abilities to agknowledge and control our fear.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I know that feeling, well. Still get it. It's your human nature warning you to be careful because our base animal instincts are being aroused to danger. Now civilized we learn how to control and harness such instincts. Those of us here, train to utilize those instincts with the skills we have acquired or in process of.
Fear is a healthy thing. It's not being a coward to feel afraid. Being a coward is feeling afraid and not doing anything about it or not helping someone in trouble when it's in your resources to do so. Still that feeling is still there. Nobody wants to be feeling hurt/pain. So it stops us from doing. But we have the ability to over-ride it. Not easy but it comes with practice and self confidence that you can do what you must, even if it's walk-away.
I think I've posted this litany here on MT before but I'll do so again. Yeah, it's science fiction in one perspective but good words in another.

The problem with that dune quote is that "Not Fear" is a negative statement, and will confuse the subconcious. Don't ever repeat that to your self or you just may be a little more fearfull and not know why. :asian:
sean

 

[someguy]

Well if we are all sharing a story then how about this one. For quite a while I would just walk to school. I went down a path that usually was peacefull. No body around. One day I saw a 3 medium sized dogs that looked kind of mangy. They kept watching me but were on the oposite side f the road. This got my heart pumping and got me abit on edge.
Then later that week I saw this guy I was on one side and he on the other. He crossed right were I was in a place were there was nothing on the side of the road I was on to go to. That got my heart pumping and I was very alert for abit. He didn't try anything and there wasn't really a reason to exept for when he crossed.
I wasn't exactly scared either time but I wasn't exactly perfectly calm about either. The guy wasn't some one I would normally be scared of just the timing and that he was bigger than me. The three wild dogs are something to not be to calm about if they are watching you and you can't tell if there are more in the underbrush near you.
I figured if others felt like puting stories up so would I. What good is it? What ever you want to make of it.