Information on Dr. Gyi???

[Tgace]

Yeah Bob, but this isnt about "Whoppers" its about building a persona to sell seminars....are you recommending the "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" route?

 

[Tgace]

Does he have ANY verifiable military experience of any type? That website doesnt seem to be able to find any. And Gyi is just one person among many, its not a conspiracy against him.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I do understand the difference, however I've always taken what he said with a grain of salt. Everything negative that I've read has been regarding his military claims, but since anyone can put up a web site, I'm curious as to their validity. No one that I know personally or who I know personally has done the research into those records, filed the appropriate "freedom of information" searches, etc. So, I'm sceptical until someone can prove it's a legit site. As to finding military records, I do remember in the last presidential election that they never did find all of Dubya's info. Like Tim said, records are lost. Some things, simply aren't recorded. That's a fact.

Personally, I'd like to see the truth here, as from what I've read so far, things don't add up. If Gyi's been lying, then the dishonor is his. If he hasn't, then it's not.


Oh, 1 other minor point: Websites. I wouldn't trust anything found on a free-host. Yahoo, Geocities, Tripod, etc. For the rest, I'd like to know the full "poop" if you will on what/how/who/etc they look for data. I've seen alot of guys claim to "train the military" when all it often means is some grunt took a class with them for a 6 week module.

 

[Don Roley]

Many times the reference to Calkins is made. Calkins claims were 1 by 1 disproven, people called, facts cross checked. Where is that evidence, cross checking and references here? For all the damning, I see minimal "fact checking and references".
I'd personally like to read them. I'm sure others would too.

Yes, but also remember that several things were not verified at all. Like his staying at that ninja school in Texas, being shot, etc.

In Gyi's case, I think that at least the fact that he was too young to serve in WWII like he said should set off some major alarms. The fact that he can't seem to prove any of his claims should be damning enough. I often say that I can't prove something that happened three centuries ago but I can prove almost everything that happened to me personally.

I think that someone that feels sympathy towards and knows Gyi should go to him and offer to help him put together a rebutal backed with facts, records, etc. It does not require that each of us go to Gyi to get his side of the story. That side of the story may be just a song and dance routine. But if someone can get the records and such and pass them along to all the independent sites that have slammed Gyi, then maybe that would help solve the problem.

If no one is able to find these facts, then that is pretty damning, eh? If people want others to go train wtih Gyi to get his side of the story, then maybe they should put in the effort to go to Gyi and get the records.

Again, I do not think many are willing to train with Gyi unless theses points are resolved with records. Seeing Gyi in person will not produce records- only excuses.

 

[Don Roley]

As to finding military records, I do remember in the last presidential election that they never did find all of Dubya's info. Like Tim said, records are lost. Some things, simply aren't recorded. That's a fact.

It is a fact that there is no doubt Bush was in the military. There were that many records. Can you say the same for Gyi? Even just being in the military? And his rank of general? Or the fact that he claims to have worked as recently as Desert Storm as compared to the Vietnam era for Bush?

As for the sites integrity, what purpose would they have in slamming someone like Gyi? If you have questions about their methods, maybe you can write them and see how they went about their investigation. Maybe they did do freedom of information searches. Or maybe they just went on what others told them. I doubt the later, but I think they would admit it if they had.

 

[Sapper6]

the last Gyi student that was known to question his claims was told by Gyi himself, "don't question me, you're going to give me a heart attack!".

of course that's all hearsay, but then again, so are Gyi's stories.

 

[Tgace]

The thing is nobody made up this stuff about him. HE MADE THESE CLAIMS...this is from his own organization.

http://www.scubajkd.com/MAMA/Articles/Dr%20Gyi.htm

He was born in Burma in the 1920's. His family has a long history of serving in the military going all the way back to 1760. So it was no surprise at age 16 Dr. Gyi joined the 10th Gurkha Regiment. In 1944 his unit joined with American troops and he was considered part of the original U.S. Rangers. With his cultural training in Bando and his military training, he had a strong background which would be needed in his future. Dr. Gyi served in World War II, Korean War, Vietnam, Malay War, and Gulf War. His assignments consisted of rescuing pilots shot-down in enemy territory, riot control, etc. Unfortunately, he has been a Prisoner-of-war (P.O.W.) twice. Currently, he holds a rank of General.

General in what army? If you are going to make these claims as a means to make money, you better be able to prove them.

I call BS.
:bs:

Its not like people have been spreading around stuff this guy never said himself.

 

[Sapper6]

It is a fact that there is no doubt Bush was in the military. There were that many records. Can you say the same for Gyi? Even just being in the military? And his rank of general? Or the fact that he claims to have worked as recently as Desert Storm as compared to the Vietnam era for Bush?

As for the sites integrity, what purpose would they have in slamming someone like Gyi? If you have questions about their methods, maybe you can write them and see how they went about their investigation. Maybe they did do freedom of information searches. Or maybe they just went on what others told them. I doubt the later, but I think they would admit it if they had.

you don't lose a General's MPRJ. sorry, it just doesn't happen.

i invite anyone to check it out. fill out the Military Record Requests: Standard Form SF-180 and mail to the address listed below.

National Personnel Records Center
Military Personnel Records
9700 Page Avenue
St. Louis, MO 63132-5100
314-801-0800

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Gents, I'm just asking questions. More information pro and con is always of value.

Sapper, thanks for the SF-180 link, as well as all the other info y'all have linked to. :asian:

 

[OULobo]

So in other words his supporters dodge the question. Or ignore it. "The military makes mistakes"? Thats a lame excuse. FOUR WARS worth of records gone? Yeah maybe they misplace a form or dont approve some benefits by accident, but entire military histories including POW status and top secret rescue missions? Heck Ive read claims he even participated in desert storm. Thats pretty darn recent. And a Generals rank doesnt just fall through the cracks. BTW How does meeting the person change anything? What will "seeing him" clear up? Im not debating his martial skills, just his military claims. Is he going to bring some military records to present? If he is I will attend (as long as its free cause hes getting NONE of my money) , as then I would owe an apology. But I doubt he will because this would have been cleard up a long time ago. As a Cop I also know that talk is cheap. Evidence is key. He has made the claims, let him back them up.

No martial arts training, no matter how good, is going to get me to overlook this type of stuff.

Well, even though I don't think it will do any good here considering it looks like the majority of the people here have already made up their minds and are the type that can't open them no matter what the subject, I will throw out a few explanations about some of the 3rd and 4th hand rumors being thrown about. For a full explanation of many of the things mentioned here, check the other threads about Doc.

1st, my guess is that he doesn't really feel the need to justify jack to anyone here or elsewhere, if you don't believe the stories, don't come to the seminars and sling mud here instead, my guess is he could give the coloquial rat's behind.

2nd, I can tell you personally that his camps and his seminars are higher now in attendance than ever before, especially since the support of Marc Denny and Dan Inosanto.

3rd, I have only seen him where a star on one occation, and I was told it wasn't about rank, it was a symbol of the star af Burma, best represented on the WWII CBI theater patch.

4th, Doc's age has never been confirmed, only speculated even by proxy in official documents. I have been told that Doc joined the Gurkha youth corps as a young boy. They were taking every able bodied man and child to join in the struggle. I even have articles written by other "confirmed" Gurkhas that tell of how the majority of the people conscripted into the youth corp and full Gurkha regiments didn't know their birthdate, so the British officers used the date of enlistment as an official birthdate, and many used this date for the rest of their lives.

5th I have personally seen pictures of Doc in Kuwait during Gulf War 1 assisting at a medical post.

 

[Tgace]

If he wasnt marketing himself to military and LEO circles with his crafted military history thats one story. When you are obviously selling youself on your military background you better "feel the need to justify jack to anyone here or elsewhere". In all the time this stuff has been circulating around, not ONE person has come forward to even say that they ever served with the guy. My military history is fairly bland, but I can give you a list of names of people I have served with....

 

[Tgace]

The Pentagon is available to confirm or deny that a name is on the PMSEA list (those officially recognized as being held in SE Asia).
Phone 703-699-1100 - ext 1169 - Please ask for Larry Greer, DOD PAO.
The POW NETWORK list is based on the PMSEA - which, in 30+ years, has never been found wrong (i.e.. - missing a name of someone claiming to be a POW returnee.)

 

[Datu Tim Hartman]

The Pentagon is available to confirm or deny that a name is on the PMSEA list (those officially recognized as being held in SE Asia).
Phone 703-699-1100 - ext 1169 - Please ask for Larry Greer, DOD PAO.
The POW NETWORK list is based on the PMSEA - which, in 30+ years, has never been found wrong (i.e.. - missing a name of someone claiming to be a POW returnee.)

Here are a couple of silly questions:

• When did Gyi move to the states?

• When did if ever Gyi become a US citizen?

• What citizenship was he during these military conflicts?

• If he fought for the Burmese military would the US military have accurate records of his service?

 

[Tgace]

KOREA - CLAIMS THAT HE WAS THEN TRANSFERRED TO THE U.S. MARINES 3RD DIVISION AND FOUGHT ALONG WITH THEM AT THE CHOSIN.

VIETNAM - AS HE IS A STUDENT-INTEGRATOR-BURMESE LINGUIST WORKING OUT OF THE BURMESE EMBASSY (1962-1965). CLAIMS THEN THAT HE WAS SENT TO NAM AS A SERGEANT IN THE US 3RD DIVISION MARINES AND WORKED IN THE PHOENIX PROGRAM, THEN WORKED AS AN AGENT FOR THE CIA TO FIND POW, HE CLAIMS HE WALKED FROM BURMA TO CHINA AND FOUND MANY US POWS BUT COULDN'T GET OUT A MESSAGE CAUSE HIS RADIO WOULD NOT WORK. AGAIN HE IS CAPTURED SOMEWHERE IN 1967 AND ESCAPED FROM 2 N. VIETNAMESE POW CAMPS.

 

[Don Roley]

Well, even though I don't think it will do any good here considering it looks like the majority of the people here have already made up their minds and are the type that can't open them no matter what the subject,

I hate that type of attitude and tactic. Saying that people are closed minded and will not accept the truth is both insulting and a rather bad dodge.

All we need is proof. Gyi freely made these claims and uses it as part of the way he sells himself.

If you think he does not care about what others think of him, then it is strange that you would take others to task about talking about him.

Again, he claims to have been in conflicts from WWII to Desert Storm. The idea that military records can be lost does not hold water when considering the fact that NOTHING he says seems verifiable. You do not lose records about POW status. I have had a test score go missing, several decades of records is beyond belief.

If anyone cares to defend Gyi, the best thing they can do is go to him and explain that they want to prove his claims. Have him work with you to find and produce these proofs and make the numerous sources that have labled him a fraud apologize.

Demonizing them and saying that people can't handle the truth is just not a valid tactic.

 

[Tgace]

And as he claims lifetime membership in the VFW and the American Leigon...you tell me.

As to the rest. Well this guy has posted up his sources and reaserch...
http://www.pownetwork.org/phonies/phonies38.htm

 

[Sapper6]

let's give Tom a minute a two to answer your questions. while we wait, ponder this:

one of many Gyi claims:

WWII - Served as a Youth Ghurka in Burma during WWII ... then served in the first Long Range Penetration Patrol he says he served with MARS GROUP, 1360 COMPOSITE GROUP, MERRILL'S MARAUDERS...

by all accounts, ie drivers license, Ohio University, Gyi was born in 1933. the first Long Range Penetration Patrol was organized in 1943 and was designated the 5307th Composite Group, not 1360. the 5307th was the brainchild of FDR, Winston Churchill, and Brigadier General Frank Merrill. this was a United States Army unit. the unit was consolidated with the 475th Infantry on August 10, 1944. on June 21, 1954, the 475th was redesignated the 75th Infantry. it is from the redesignation of Merrill's Marauders into the 75th Infantry Regiment that the modern-day 75th Ranger Regiment traces its current unit designation. Gyi would have been 10 years old at the time of the unit's organization. so we were letting 10 year olds into the US Army? if he was an original member of the LRPP, his name would be known to many and there would certainly be record of it.

On October 14, the POWNETWORK received the SF180 (request for military records) back from St. Louis. Having had Gyi's social security number, and noting ALL THREE names, the records center could not locate ANY military record and requested the EXACT name he served under to proceed further. [note: records ARE cross referenced by SS# - aka's and a correct social security number HAVE located the correct records in the past.] Therefore, we must assume, NO record will be found.

let's not forget, at the time of all this alleged war fighting, records will show Gyi was attending highschool.

Woodstock High School Permanent Record card:

Name: Gyi Winston Maung Age: March 1933 Place of Birth: Burma

Permanent address 256 Creek St, Rangoon Religious Affiliation: Christian ME

Date of Admission to Woodstock: March 9, 1950

Record of yearly average grades - and credits given toward graduation:

1947: Transferred from Methodist High School Rangoon Burmha 4 credits.

1948: Scripture, English, Geometry, Geography, Chemistry, Physics 3 3/4 credits

1949: English, Arithmetic, Britisi Empire History, Burmese History, Hygiene, Physics and Chemistry 4 1/2 credits

1950: [Class/grade] Scripture/ B, English/ C, Trigonometry/ D, Geometry/ C, Chemistry/ B, History, D, Music/ B, Oral Expression/ B Credits 2 3/4

1950 Number in Class - 30, Rank 30

1950 comments: quiet, polite, fewer depressed moods. English deficiency.

1951 - Number in Class - 33, Rank 24

1951 comments: musical, athletic, religious, comparative, much more stable this year, artistic. English and reading a handicap.

 

[Sapper6]

• When did Gyi move to the states?

• When did if ever Gyi become a US citizen?

• What citizenship was he during these military conflicts?

• If he fought for the Burmese military would the US military have accurate records of his service?

don't you know...? all that stuff is classified.

 

[Tgace]

As a side topic...I always thought the Gurkha Regiments were strictly Nepalese.

 

[Sapper6]

As a side topic...I always thought the Gurkha Regiments were strictly Nepalese.

everything you ever wanted to know about Gurkha Regiments...

http://www.regiments.org/regiments/uk/depot/948gurka.htm