How long should you hold a choke so as not to kill?

[RTKDCMB]

I am no expert in the choke but I would say that if they stop breathing then you probably held on too long.

 

[GiYu - Todd]

According to Hollywood, most people die within two seconds of the star choking them out. This is very similar to the non-starring characters being winged in the shoulder by a bullet and going down instantly like someone flipped a switch.

The general rule I read a couple years ago (sorry, can't remember source or I'd site it) was once the person loses consciousness, for every additional second you maintain the choke, they should remain unconscious approximately 6 seconds after release. So for 1 second, they should take 6 seconds to recover (which is roughly what I've personally experienced). For 10 seconds, they should take 1 minute (haven't wanted to test this).

For training, I quit within a second of my partner slumping. No need to risk anything beyond that. For a general fight, I'd hold long enough to make them take 15-30 seconds or so to wake up (so... 3-5 seconds), so I'd have time to get clear, gather my things, dust off, and be ready for round two if they're not that bright. For a real life-or-death fight, I would hold long enough (likely 10-20 seconds) to make sure the person won't be a threat for enough time to escape, secure them, disable them, whatever... with only a slight (legal) concern for potential brain damage.

Brain damage typically begins about 3 1/2 to 4 minutes after loss of oxygen. Although the longer you go, the higher likelihood of medical problems occuring, even if you quit before 3 1/2 minutes. After a minute or two, their heart my fail, or the compressed arteries may fail to restore full flow in time.

 

[Paul_D]

As for the actual time, the more proficient the choker, the better the clock.

The would make sense if you had said strangle, as the harder/better you apply it the more blood you are cutting off to the brain, but how does your proificanery affect a choke?

A choke cuts off air, making it impossible to breathe, so the time frame is dictated to by someone's ability to hold their breath. Applying it more proficiently doesn't alter how long they can hold their breath for before passing out.

 

[Tez3]

This is very similar to the non-starring characters being winged in the shoulder by a bullet and going down instantly like someone flipped a switch

Seems that is true in real life but the reasons why are still being debated.

Why Do People Fall Down When Shot? | RealClearScience

 

[Tony Dismukes]

The would make sense if you had said strangle, as the harder/better you apply it the more blood you are cutting off to the brain, but how does your proificanery affect a choke?

A choke cuts off air, making it impossible to breathe, so the time frame is dictated to by someone's ability to hold their breath. Applying it more proficiently doesn't alter how long they can hold their breath for before passing out.

The "strangle" vs "choke" distinction is a feature of medical terminology. In martial arts terminology, "choke" is generally used for both. (Typically "blood choke" vs "air choke" makes the same distinction.) In this case, I believe Buka was referring to a blood choke (or "strangle" in medical terms).

I'll put it this way. We teach to only ever hold a choke for 15 seconds at the most. By that point, they're either unconscious, or you don't have it on properly, so you'd need to move onto something else.

That's pretty much what I teach my students. If they haven't already tapped out or passed out in 10-12 seconds, you don't have the choke set properly and you're wasting your energy.

I've been put to sleep once in 6 years, and it was from a baseball bat choke that was so tight I was out within the short second or two it was being applied.

I think I've seen more people pass out in competition from a baseball bat choke than from any other choke. (Specifically the version that you catch someone with as they pass your guard.) Properly done, it's so sneaky that the opponent doesn't realize he's in trouble until it's too late.

Body will start to spasm, then deep sobs for air then foaming at the mouth. Right after that you cause brain damage then death. I had to use death choke when attacked by some street thug once, he was dead, by the grace of God he came back to life he was foaming, stopped consciousness he was done, I am sure I would have been locked behind bars forever in this screwed up Justice System for self defense. Use arm bar guili for 10 seconds to 20 should be passed out. Put on their side and sit on top of them in control position wait for police. Worse part is this person was talking smack like 5 months later from his car, some people just don't learn. This punk never understood God gave him a second chance.

Umm ... your attacker may have been passed out, but he wasn't dead. Dead people don't spontaneously come back to life.

I don't think the foaming at the mouth is particularly common. I've seen a fair number of people choked unconscious and I've never seen foaming at the mouth. Maybe the guy you fought had some other health issue going on.

The following video by Rener & Ryron Gracie helps break down some important signs for recognizing when the recipient of a choke has gone unconscious.

 

[Dirty Dog]

In medical terms, if you're alive it was a choke. If you were strangled, you're dead.

And no, the person referenced above was not dead.

Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Not TapaTalk. Really.

 

[Hanzou]

I typically see people pass out from Guard chokes. I think people instinctually try to fight off chokes while in someone's guard instead of tapping. The worst are people trying to pass guards while a choke is being applied. You're pretty much assured to be asleep in a matter of seconds.