Healing in the Martial Art

[tongsau]

After years of teaching an external art, I have created my own internal system of Martial art based on the ancient word for Karate. Anyone else want to begin correctly again and start with the healing and meditation skills of old? You can also use the term: Tongsau
The old word for Karate in Japanese is Toute. Tou is the Japanese word for the Tang Dynasty of China. The remnants of that kingdom landed in Taiwan. The Tong were the people of China until the Communist party destroyed the old history.

Most of the old White Crane practices are standing still. Cranes posture themselves to heal their wings and neck. A healed fighter is never sore or tired. They remain at the base of the mountain with the most powerful stance of near magical ability. Training is the Way but light is how you go far. Light Burden

 

[skribs]

Two questions: what are you on, and where can I get some?

 

[Xue Sheng]

After years of teaching an external art, I have created my own internal system of Martial art based on the ancient word for Karate. Anyone else want to begin correctly again and start with the healing and meditation skills of old? You can also use the term: Tongsau
The old word for Karate in Japanese is Toute. Tou is the Japanese word for the Tang Dynasty of China. The remnants of that kingdom landed in Taiwan. The Tong were the people of China until the Communist party destroyed the old history.

Most of the old White Crane practices are standing still. Cranes posture themselves to heal their wings and neck. A healed fighter is never sore or tired. They remain at the base of the mountain with the most powerful stance of near magical ability. Training is the Way but light is how you go far. Light Burden

The Tang Dynasty was a dynasty in China from 618 to 907 and I'm sorry but I do not believe there is any historical evidence that they went to Taiwan

And Tong can have several different meanings, depending on the character used or the dialect, one basically being the Chinese Mafia. Without the actual character it is hard to say which one you are referring to

 

[Xue Sheng]

Example

唐 Tang of the Tang Dynasty (also pronounced Tong)

堂 Tong of organized crime

 

[JowGaWolf]

The Tang Dynasty was a dynasty in China from 618 to 907 and I'm sorry but I do not believe there is any historical evidence that they went to Taiwan

And Tong can have several different meanings, depending on the character used or the dialect, one basically being the Chinese Mafia. Without the actual character it is hard to say which one you are referring to

I'm glad I decided to sit this one out. I thought it would be best if I just sit and watch. I'm glad I did.

 

[isshinryuronin]

No idea of where Tongsau is coming from (or comes from), but to get to the title of his initial post, there is a long tradition of healing associated with the martial arts.

Starting in about the 1000's (or earlier) there are references to acupressure points/chi meridians and the Chinese were well versed in medicine, more so than any other civilization. About 1500, Feng Yiyuan ID'd 36 vital points that when attacked could cause severe injury/incapacitation, especially at certain times of the day (sichen, 12 hour cycles of blood flow.) This knowledge worked both ways - to injure or to heal and seemed to be taught within the martial arts. Much information can be found in McCarthey's latest version of the Bubishi. Remedies for many common battlefield injuries are listed.

This tradition of martial art medicine continued on to Okinawa, where many of the old toude masters learned such trauma healing skills. It was natural that the dangerous vital points were kept secret (and of course left out of the public school karate curriculum) but it seems to me that the healing aspect appears to have been largely abandoned by karate practitioners by the 1940's.

I don't know if this healing tradition is still common in traditional kung fu, but IMO it should be a tradition that remains a part of MA, at least at the higher levels. I wish it had been a part of my karate training, and now feel that a whole section of MA knowledge is missing from my skill set. My sensei has made a point of learning some of these things on his own, but it would be great if it was actually part of the system.

There have been numerous comments about how after 4th or 5th degree black belt there are few/no required new skills.
This is an area that would be worthy of study by advanced practitioners IF the info could be compiled, organized, and taught by very well informed and advanced sensei.

 

[JowGaWolf]

No idea of where Tongsau is coming from (or comes from), but to get to the title of his initial post, there is a long tradition of healing associated with the martial arts.

Starting in about the 1000's (or earlier) there are references to acupressure points/chi meridians and the Chinese were well versed in medicine, more so than any other civilization. About 1500, Feng Yiyuan ID'd 36 vital points that when attacked could cause severe injury/incapacitation, especially at certain times of the day (sichen, 12 hour cycles of blood flow.) This knowledge worked both ways - to injure or to heal and seemed to be taught within the martial arts. Much information can be found in McCarthey's latest version of the Bubishi. Remedies for many common battlefield injuries are listed.

This tradition of martial art medicine continued on to Okinawa, where many of the old toude masters learned such trauma healing skills. It was natural that the dangerous vital points were kept secret (and of course left out of the public school karate curriculum) but it seems to me that the healing aspect appears to have been largely abandoned by karate practitioners by the 1940's.

I don't know if this healing tradition is still common in traditional kung fu, but IMO it should be a tradition that remains a part of MA, at least at the higher levels. I wish it had been a part of my karate training, and now feel that a whole section of MA knowledge is missing from my skill set. My sensei has made a point of learning some of these things on his own, but it would be great if it was actually part of the system.

There have been numerous comments about how after 4th or 5th degree black belt there are few/no required new skills.
This is an area that would be worthy of study by advanced practitioners IF the info could be compiled, organized, and taught by very well informed and advanced sensei.

I'm pretty skeptical about the OP. Any development of a system should be done based on experience of training within a similar system. To train external martial arts then to say that they are going to create their own system of internal medicine seems impossible to me. So what will the internal healing system be based on if the OP has not already been training in internal system.

I only asks this question because the OP says that they spent many years training an external system. If a person is creating their own internal healing system, then I would expect to hear how many years of they have been training and practicing an internal healing system. I would also like to know who they have been training under and if they are even certified.

Traditionally internal martial arts and especially internal healing is tied to mysticism and religion, so there's that. That seems to be where the OP is going.

Statement like the ones below make me raises read flags and reminds me of the Yellow Bamboo group.
"A healed fighter is never sore or tired. They remain at the base of the mountain with the most powerful stance of near magical ability. Training is the Way but light is how you go far. Light Burden"

People should always be cautious about stuff like this. Both as those who want to teach it and people who want to learn it.

 

[isshinryuronin]

I'm pretty skeptical about the OP. Any development of a system should be done based on experience of training within a similar system. To train external martial arts then to say that they are going to create their own system of internal medicine seems impossible to me. So what will the internal healing system be based on if the OP has not already been training in internal system.

I only asks this question because the OP says that they spent many years training an external system. If a person is creating their own internal healing system, then I would expect to hear how many years of they have been training and practicing an internal healing system. I would also like to know who they have been training under and if they are even certified.

Traditionally internal martial arts and especially internal healing is tied to mysticism and religion, so there's that. That seems to be where the OP is going.

Statement like the ones below make me raises read flags and reminds me of the Yellow Bamboo group.
"A healed fighter is never sore or tired. They remain at the base of the mountain with the most powerful stance of near magical ability. Training is the Way but light is how you go far. Light Burden"

People should always be cautious about stuff like this. Both as those who want to teach it and people who want to learn it.

I agree Tongsau's post is murky at best, but the general topic is interesting. I was hoping to direct the thread to a more constructive serious discussion.

 

[tongsau]

I will look for more educated Martial Artists

 

[JowGaWolf]

I agree Tongsau's post is murky at best, but the general topic is interesting. I was hoping to direct the thread to a more constructive serious discussion.

I was hoping he was going to add more information. It was basically. I did external martial arts for a very long time -> Now I'm going to create an internal healing system -> I'm going to look for more educated Martial Artist.

Now sure how anyone is going to be educated about an internal martial arts healing system that has never existed before. Just from a marketing perspective. At least cover "What it is you're selling." "What problem does it solve, or benefit does it give." "Provide information about it and why it works."

We still have no information about what he does, and he didn't bother to defend his knowledge when I brought up my concerns about his system. Lots of red flags. I'm willing to be proven wrong. I have no problem with that as it wouldn't be the first time.

If I was creating an internal healing system and someone doubted my ability then I would provide more information to put people's minds at ease. So we'll see what happens next.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I was hoping he was going to add more information.

You should not respond to those threads that doesn't say:

- Any comment?
- Your thought?
- What's your opinion on this?

A: Here is what I believe ...
B: You may ...
A: I didn't ask your opinion. This thread is for information only. It's not intend for discussion.
B:

 

[Steve]

I was hoping he was going to add more information. It was basically. I did external martial arts for a very long time -> Now I'm going to create an internal healing system -> I'm going to look for more educated Martial Artist.

Now sure how anyone is going to be educated about an internal martial arts healing system that has never existed before. Just from a marketing perspective. At least cover "What it is you're selling." "What problem does it solve, or benefit does it give." "Provide information about it and why it works."

We still have no information about what he does, and he didn't bother to defend his knowledge when I brought up my concerns about his system. Lots of red flags. I'm willing to be proven wrong. I have no problem with that as it wouldn't be the first time.

If I was creating an internal healing system and someone doubted my ability then I would provide more information to put people's minds at ease. So we'll see what happens next.

alas, the world may never know about this amazing healing system.

 

[Steve]

Here's a question for the group. What's the functional difference between this guy and the folks on this forum who argue against the science of the pandemic? I look at this and the silliness posted in the coronavirus threads, and it looks exactly the same to me.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

I will look for more educated Martial Artists

I think the replies you got was just that you didn't really give much information. Just that you have a healing art based around a word, rather than a philosophy, that you taught an external art but somehow made an internal one, and we are supposed to learn from you just based on that?

 

[skribs]

I think the replies you got was just that you didn't really give much information. Just that you have a healing art based around a word, rather than a philosophy, that you taught an external art but somehow made an internal one, and we are supposed to learn from you just based on that?

That's putting it nicely. Most of his words didn't make sense. The words that did don't make sense in reality.

I know we're not supposed to style bash or fraudbust on here, but this post makes me think of the more fantastical kung fu movies, or maybe anime.

 

[skribs]

I will look for more educated Martial Artists

What about the replies makes you think they're uneducated? What makes you think you're the more educated one?

 

[JowGaWolf]

That's putting it nicely. Most of his words didn't make sense. The words that did don't make sense in reality.

I know we're not supposed to style bash or fraudbust on here, but this post makes me think of the more fantastical kung fu movies, or maybe anime.

There's not enough information to style bash. We literally don't know anything about it or the person that has created an Internal Healing system and that's the problem. Absolutely zero information.

I was waiting for the OP to bring up something like Reiki, or Qi Gong.
I mean even John Hopkins talks about Reiki
What is Reiki?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

created an Internal Healing system ...

I was expecting the OP may say

- Do more hook, uppercut. Do less jab, cross.
- Do more roundhouse kick, foot sweep. Do less front kick, side kick.

IMO, the circular movement is always better for health than the straight line movement.

 

[wab25]

I don't know if this healing tradition is still common in traditional kung fu, but IMO it should be a tradition that remains a part of MA, at least at the higher levels. I wish it had been a part of my karate training, and now feel that a whole section of MA knowledge is missing from my skill set. My sensei has made a point of learning some of these things on his own, but it would be great if it was actually part of the system.

There have been numerous comments about how after 4th or 5th degree black belt there are few/no required new skills.
This is an area that would be worthy of study by advanced practitioners IF the info could be compiled, organized, and taught by very well informed and advanced sensei.

You should take a look at Danzan Ryu. We study both sides of the coin... the martial side and the healing side. The founder, Okazaki, was more famous for his healing work when he was alive, than he was for his martial arts. He taught a massage course, which has been kept as part of the system to this day. Parts of it are taught as part of the normal martial arts class. The more formal teaching of it is through a separate set of classes. There are three classes (semesters) that are taught and require many hours of study. These classes are recognized and after taking the classes, you can test and receive your massage therapy license in all 50 states. From there, you can work as a licensed massage therapist. Many dojos supplement their income by offering massage therapy. Danzan Ryu is an example of a Japanese style art that has kept the healing side, up through present day. And, the healing side of the system is good enough to get your license from.

 

[Flying Crane]

You should take a look at Danzan Ryu. We study both sides of the coin... the martial side and the healing side. The founder, Okazaki, was more famous for his healing work when he was alive, than he was for his martial arts. He taught a massage course, which has been kept as part of the system to this day. Parts of it are taught as part of the normal martial arts class. The more formal teaching of it is through a separate set of classes. There are three classes (semesters) that are taught and require many hours of study. These classes are recognized and after taking the classes, you can test and receive your massage therapy license in all 50 states. From there, you can work as a licensed massage therapist. Many dojos supplement their income by offering massage therapy. Danzan Ryu is an example of a Japanese style art that has kept the healing side, up through present day. And, the healing side of the system is good enough to get your license from.

I’ve been through that training. My Kenpo teacher was a student of Seig Kufferath, and made that a part of our curriculum. That was probably the most valuable part of the training that I did with him.