Gun Disarm, Pistol Front

[Bester]

No difference with a knife. Big mistake to fear the blade and it's supposed slashing power. It is not a sword. Which Kali was primarily invented for. I say again the knife is not a sword. You will survive a slash attack.Stabbing is what kills.

Again, you show your ignorance. You have no understanding of the Fillipino arts. A stab can injure and kill. So can a slash. (Ever heard the term "evisceration"?) So can blunt force. Of course, ask most knowlegable FMA and they will tell you that there is no such thing as "Kali" in the PI.

A knife is not a sword, but they share many of the same properties. Single or dual edge, and a flat. Edge awareness is a key part of dealing with a blade. Then again, maybe you saw that vhs tape where the superman does disarms with a wallet and draws the blade across his own gut. Abs of Steel indeed.

What else works in your world Ed?

 

[lonewolf12563]

It is easy to hide behind a computer and discredit people. I have credentials. Who cares. Do you really need to know? Do you really think that you are going to gut some one with your spyderco or what ever knife you carry train with.? That is a laugh.
So what do you want for proof. My DD214. Or my class numbers for the schools I have been thru in my 17 years of military service. I doubt you personaly would understand what you were reading.
So far this has been another forum of insults and morons. O yeah arm chair quarterbacks. But I admit you are funny. The knife is a sword is hilarious. They are very different indeed. Do you really know what works in the street?
What style do you study? What do you have to offer other than insults?
A duck is a duck especialy when he ***** on your head. Ed

 

[Rich Parsons]

It is easy to hide behind a computer and discredit people. I have credentials. Who cares. Do you really need to know? Do you really think that you are going to gut some one with your spyderco or what ever knife you carry train with.? That is a laugh.
So what do you want for proof. My DD214. Or my class numbers for the schools I have been thru in my 17 years of military service. I doubt you personaly would understand what you were reading.
So far this has been another forum of insults and morons. O yeah arm chair quarterbacks. But I admit you are funny. The knife is a sword is hilarious. They are very different indeed. Do you really know what works in the street?
What style do you study? What do you have to offer other than insults?
A duck is a duck especialy when he ***** on your head. Ed

Lonewolf,

Ever hear the statment that you do not need to stick three feet of metal through a man when a few inches is enough to kill him?

In this way, a knife and sword are similar. You only need a few inches to wound/injur/kill your opponent. The blade weather large or long has the same attributes with the exception of distance and range (* and recover time *)


I personally would like to hear where you have been teaching the Military. My understanding, is that there can be classes at local bases, that are filled with Military men and women, only it is not offical training approved by a specific branch of the military.

So, in general, you made some statements. Some people have asked if you can provide references. Some for of documentation, that what you say is correct. It may be. I do not know. I do not agree with any name calling, yet I would be interested in learning more. So, if you are military connected, I would appreciate a simple education.


:asian:

 

[Bester]

Ed,
Your credentials are a joke, you contradict yourself at every turn. Those that found fault in your fantasy at Budoseek were experienced military or LEO. This forum also has a good deal of both as well. They are the ones with the real world experience that are disputing your supposed ideas. I discussed your idea with someone with 20 years military experience earlier. Their comment was that you were dead. This was after reviewing your own website.

As to the street, here are the stats, straight from the DOJ
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/abstract/wuvc01.htm

Definitions of weapons

Firearms include handguns (pistols, revolvers, derringers)
and shotguns, rifles, and other firearms (excluding BB and
pellet guns and air rifles).

Sharp objects include knives and other sharp edged and/or
pointed objects (scissors, ice picks, and axes).

Blunt objects include rocks, clubs, blackjacks, bats, and
metal pipes.

Other weapons include ropes, chains, poison, martial arts
weapons, BB guns, and objects that could not be classified.
-------------------------------------------

Firearms

Between 1993 and 2001 victims were confronted by offenders
armed with guns in about 27% of robberies, 8% of assaults,
and 3% of all rapes/sexual assaults.

On average, each year U.S. residents were victims of crimes
committed with firearms at a rate of 4 crimes per 1,000
persons age 12 or older. Of the average 847,000 violent
victimizations committed with firearms, about 7 out of 8
were committed with handguns.

Knives and sharp objects

Annually during the 9-year period, about 570,000 violent
victimizations were committed with a knife or other sharp
object, accounting for 6% of all violent crimes. Thirteen
percent of robberies, 6% of assaults, and 3% of rapes
were committed with a knife or other sharp object.

From 1993 through 2001 crimes involving knives or sharp
objects were committed at an average annual rate of 3 per
1,000 persons age 12 or older. In 85% of these
victimizations, about 480,000 each year, the weapon was a
knife. In the remainder, about 88,000 victimizations per
year, the weapon was another type of sharp object.

Blunt objects

Armed with blunt objects such as bats, sticks, rocks,
clubs, or blackjacks, offenders committed approximately
356,000 violent crimes each year from 1993 through 2001.

Crimes by offenders armed with blunt objects were committed
at an average annual rate of 2 per 1,000 persons age 12 or
older.

Other weapons

Between 1993 and 2001 about 5% of all violent crimes were
committed with weapons other than guns, knives, or blunt
objects. Such weapons include ropes, chains, poison, martial
arts weapons, BB guns (not considered to be firearms by the
NCVS), and objects that could not be classified.

The average unplanned confrontation will occur with whatever is handy. Most people do not carry a firearm.

You have no understanding of the FMA. Try explaining your uneducated concepts to a few petita folks...I'm sure they would enjoy educating you. A sword is a long knife. It has a different center of balance, and a longer range than a knife. Some techniques work, some don't. It is the experienced player who will know the difference.

My training?
FMA, JMA and CMA primarily. 10 years worth.

What do I have to offer other than insults?
Just the truth when dealing with dangerous frauds such as yourself.

 

[Seig]

It is easy to hide behind a computer and discredit people. I have credentials. Who cares. Do you really need to know? Do you really think that you are going to gut some one with your spyderco or what ever knife you carry train with.? That is a laugh.
So what do you want for proof. My DD214. Or my class numbers for the schools I have been thru in my 17 years of military service. I doubt you personaly would understand what you were reading.
So far this has been another forum of insults and morons. O yeah arm chair quarterbacks. But I admit you are funny. The knife is a sword is hilarious. They are very different indeed. Do you really know what works in the street?
What style do you study? What do you have to offer other than insults?
A duck is a duck especialy when he ***** on your head. Ed

Ed,
Normally I stay out of these "discussions", but as this one continues to degenerate, I am going to step in.
You said:

It is easy to hide behind a computer and discredit people. I have credentials. Who cares. Do you really need to know? Do you really think that you are going to gut some one with your spyderco or what ever knife you carry train with.? That is a laugh.
So what do you want for proof. My DD214. Or my class numbers for the schools I have been thru in my 17 years of military service. I doubt you personaly would understand what you were reading.

1.) You have credentials? What are they?
I am a third degree black in American Kenpo, I am also a first degree in Samurai Jui-Jitsu. I have other belts as well that I do not attribute a lot of importance to. I also train in Pekita Tersia. I served in the military doing law enforcement during Desert Shield/Storm. The self defense taught to the military in 90% of cases is just enough to get you hurt. The knives I carry, I have used to field dress animals, I know what they can do to a human. I do not carry junk like spyderco.
2.) Here you say you served 17 years, yet your website says

He served 11 years in the United States Army with the rank of Chief Warrant Officer.

So which was it? This is one reason your credibility is being called into question.
Go ahead and post your DD214, I and many others know exactly what we are looking at.
3.) I looked at your gun disarm, and like many of the people I see "teaching" gun disarms, were I your assailant, you would be dead. Now, I am not saying your gun disarm is BS, maybe the picture is not doing it justice. The way the technique is being photographed is not maintaing positive control of an attacker that size, you are not controlling his height or his width, he still has room to maneuver.
4.) Some of your other statements have some validity, but when you make statements like,

Big mistake to fear the blade and it's supposed slashing power.....You will survive a slash attack

and

The stun shot to do a wrist break is tv horse crap in my opinion.

Not only are you letting your temper get the best of you, you are letting ignorance show through. First of all, some knives are stabbing knives, others are designed for slashing. You should not be afraid of a slash across your throat or the side of your neck? Rule #1 Environmental Awareness, be aware of everything. Secondly, have you ever been playfully slapped by an expereinced Pekita Tersia instructor? They can and will break a bone with that slap. I, personally, do not have that kind of slapping power, but I do have enough striking power to break bones.
5.) Have you, personally, been in live situations with people pointing a loaded gun at you or with someone with a knife intent on doing you harm? I have and I can tell you it sucks. I worked as a bouncer in bars for over 10 years, I also drove a cab for three. That does not take into consideration my experiences in the military.
Now, a few people have told you to lighten up and keep an open mind, you may learn something. We have a lot of very skilled and experienced martial artists on this board. Quite a few of them are military or police. Do not back yourself into a corner you cannot get out of with good grace. We have worked very hard to make this one of the best boards out there, and we are going to continue to make it better. I will deal with Bester, he knows our "Fraud Busting" policy and he is clearly in violation of it. Do not misinterpret that to mean I just called you a fraud, I did not. Sit back, take a deep breath, and try to come across a little less sanctimonious and forcefull and you will be welcome here. We are always open to good discussion and debate.
Mike Seigel
MT Admin

 

[Seig]

The average unplanned confrontation will occur with whatever is handy. Most people do not carry a firearm.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
That depends on where you live, now doesn't it?

 

[MJS]

This gun disarm was and is taught in the Army. That is where I learned it. So mmm...Yes it is really used in real life. Krav Maga was not. It is the civilian version of military CQC.The Isrealis that I know tell me it is not close to what they learned. KM is karate and judo combined. Two sports. But that is what they said.

And your art is nothing more than a sport at best due to your VERY uneducated thinking. KM is not karate and Judo as you say. Do some research before you make a crazy statement like that.

So go a head and grab the knife hand. With one hand I will easily pull it out. Grab the knife hand with two hands and you will eat the fist from the other hand. By Grabbing the knife hand you are doing nothing to shut down the attacker.Which is your primary goal. The stun shot to do a wrist break is tv horse crap in my opinion.

Misunderstanding AGAIN Eddie!!! Let me explain for you little hot head pal. In the FMA, we redirect the flow and then counter grab. By not grabbing as you did in that joke of a knife defense, you WILL get cut. Try it with a little aliveness and see what happens!! Funny you should talk about not doing anything to shut the attacker down cuz in your cheesy gun disarm, you are doing nothing to shut him down either. Yet, you bash KM because that is what I said that they do, and spoke of the importance of it. Get your story straight Eddie!!!

By the way I was attacked with a screw driver and I used the same upstrike to the radial nerve as in the photos. I knocked the screw driver out of the perps hand. So yes it does work. No difference with a knife. Big mistake to fear the blade and it's supposed slashing power. It is not a sword. Which Kali was primarily invented for. I say again the knife is not a sword. You will survive a slash attack.Stabbing is what kills.

Wrong again Eddie!!! A screwdriver will not cut you like a knife. Come back from fantasy island pal. Kali as well as all of the FMA deal with knives, so again, do some research. A crappy block like you do, will result in a cut. Even the smallest of cuts will result in blood loss and take a toll on the body. Do some research on the FMA Eddie, and maybe you'll learn something. A slash WILl take a toll on the body. More uneducated thinking from the so called "master" of it all!! LOL!

So continual striking the attacker untill he shuts down is your best bet. Shut down the attacker he will not be able to use his tool ( Knife ,machette ect). Above reproach?
Thats funny. MJS I belive your quote on the BJJ street fighting question was "But then again, it does not have to be something fancy to work right!"
A little two faced? Ed

And nothing I said was fancy. I'm talking realistic pal, not fantasy like you!

 

[MJS]

Again, you show your ignorance. You have no understanding of the Fillipino arts. A stab can injure and kill. So can a slash. (Ever heard the term "evisceration"?) So can blunt force. Of course, ask most knowlegable FMA and they will tell you that there is no such thing as "Kali" in the PI.

A knife is not a sword, but they share many of the same properties. Single or dual edge, and a flat. Edge awareness is a key part of dealing with a blade. Then again, maybe you saw that vhs tape where the superman does disarms with a wallet and draws the blade across his own gut. Abs of Steel indeed.

What else works in your world Ed?

Obviously it goes to show that Eddie is seriously showing signs on a troll!! Notice how his hot head got him banned from the other forum where he was spouting his garbage!!

Eddie....take a pill, relax, and try to be just a little open minded to what others have to say. You come off like you are the know it all, when in reality YOU are not!!!!

Mike

 

[MJS]

Oh and Eddie....I think that it is important to tell us about yourself, seeing that you are such the know it all. Your profile does NOTHING for you at all, and neither does your web site. People who constantly say that its not important give the others on here, alot of doubt as to what you're talking about.

Again, you preach a big game. IMO, you have a very poot attitude and you seem to get very upset when people question you. Why is that?? Seems that I'm not the only one on here who is starting to question you. I noticed that Sieg is doing the same thing. Do you have something to hide Eddie???

Mike

 

[MJS]

It is easy to hide behind a computer and discredit people. I have credentials. Who cares. Do you really need to know? Do you really think that you are going to gut some one with your spyderco or what ever knife you carry train with.? That is a laugh.
So what do you want for proof. My DD214. Or my class numbers for the schools I have been thru in my 17 years of military service. I doubt you personaly would understand what you were reading.
So far this has been another forum of insults and morons. O yeah arm chair quarterbacks. But I admit you are funny. The knife is a sword is hilarious. They are very different indeed. Do you really know what works in the street?
What style do you study? What do you have to offer other than insults?
A duck is a duck especialy when he ***** on your head. Ed

Eddie...If you're not happy with this forum...its very simple...LEAVE!!!

I seriously think that you need to back what you say, because you seem to be VERY uneducated when it comes to weapons.

Mike

 

[MJS]

Do you really know what works in the street?{/quote]
Yup, and its nothing that you teach!

What style do you study?

Kenpo- 17yrs, 3rd black
BJJ- 10+ yrs. Blue/Purple level
Modern Arnis- Brown, 6yrs
KM- On and off for about a year.

What do you have to offer other than insults?

Well, I was trying to have a good, friendly discussion, until you let your hot head and poor attitude come into the picture. There are many very good people on this forum, who have alot to offer. Maybe instead of always bashing people, you can lower yourself a few pegs, and listen to what they say. You come off like your style or whatever you want to call it, is the end all-be all of SD. NEWS flash Ed...IT ISNT!!!!

Mike

 

[MJS]

So go a head and grab the knife hand. With one hand I will easily pull it out. Grab the knife hand with two hands and you will eat the fist from the other hand. By Grabbing the knife hand you are doing nothing to shut down the attacker.Which is your primary goal. The stun shot to do a wrist break is tv horse crap in my opinion.

And go ahead and grab that gun with 2 hands, turn your back to the armed attacker, and you will most likely have the same happen to you!!! Listen to what you're saying here Ed. You're starting to contradict yourself VERY badly.

In addition, the FMA also have limb destructions that are applied during the course of the disarm of the blade.

Again, I suggest a little research on the FMA. You may learn something

Mike

 

[MJS]

If you do reasearch I did post my experience to the Army sargent down in florida. Sorry forgot his name.

This quote was taken from another forum in which Ed was a member. My question is: How do you forget someones name? That would be like me forgetting the names of my Kenpo inst. who I have trained with over the past 17yrs.

Mike

 

[MJS]

2.) Here you say you served 17 years, yet your website says [/color]
So which was it? This is one reason your credibility is being called into question.

And then in another post from the other forum he says this:

I am sure my 20 years of experience really pales in comparison.

Seems to me the numbers are changing. 11,17,20 yrs??????? :idunno:

Mike

 

[Disco]

Hold on here guy's............ I went to the web site and clicked on to the fitness....... :inlove:

Hey lonewolf, you really need to increase that section of the site :wink:

artyon:

 

[lonewolf12563]

I thougt these forums would be a good idea, but I think they are a joke. Bester initial stated he liked and used the technique. Then he got on the band wagon like everyone else.
It fiqures a bunch of Karate guys can't figure out a simple armbar. It fiqures that you have to train in multiple arts most of which are sports to cover all your senerios.MJS ten years at bjj and you are a blue/purple belt. First of all what is a Blue/purple belt. You have either or. After ten years you should be a black belt. Maybe your techniques are not that good. I didn't know that phillipine arts had a belt system. Just levels. Who is full of crap? You need to do some of your own reaserch. Litchfield the KM founder even stated he took the best from karate and judo to come up with his fighting system.
All you have proven to me is that you are good at slinging mud but know one has talked about leverage, CNS reaction to stimuli or any thing else of scientific value. "Your techniques suck because your pictures suck and you cant pose your uke properly blah blah blah". That is the best that you can do. But yet anything I brouht up about the weakness in other systems you overlooked and covered it up with your bashing.
I really honestly do not feel I have to prove to some twit over the computer my qualifications. I could say I trained with Leo White in Ft Eustis VA. O Yeah he was the Capt of the US olympic team. Or I could show you my military credentials . Or I could hang for all to see my certificate from the Jujutsu club in Japan. But its in kanji you couldn't read it anyhow.
All you have demonstrated is that forums like this one are basicaly served for the same group of people. It is like a teenibopper club.
In closing MJS you have no clue about fighting with a weapon or someone really intent on killing you. You have proven this with you statement about the screwdriver. I can kill you much faster with a screwdriver than any of the pocket knives that you carry. You have no clue about blood loss the affects of adrenaline and vital strike points. Just like the early Gracie days when you Kenpo guys came to the classes, you had no clue untill you were getting ***** slapped by Rorion or Royce. Only a few inches is need to kill someone with a knife, someone said that( Rich Parsons). Yeah maybe that is what they teach at your Kali or arnis class, but that is simple untrue. Well ok if I just stood there. You need at less 4 inches to penetrate vital organs of the body that is if you get past the rib gage. Even a slash to the neck is not always going to drop him to the ground. Ask any city ER Doctor. Stabbing and deep penetration is what kills.
So I find this forum a complete waste of time. There is no friendly discussion here. Just bashing. I bet if we met face to face it would be a different story. Ed

 

[Rich Parsons]

. . .

Only a few inches is need to kill someone with a knife, someone said that( Rich Parsons). Yeah maybe that is what they teach at your Kali or arnis class, but that is simple untrue. Well ok if I just stood there. You need at less 4 inches to penetrate vital organs of the body that is if you get past the rib gage. Even a slash to the neck is not always going to drop him to the ground. Ask any city ER Doctor. Stabbing and deep penetration is what kills.
So I find this forum a complete waste of time. There is no friendly discussion here. Just bashing. I bet if we met face to face it would be a different story. Ed

Ed,

My Comment was not really from the FMA. I believe I read it in a book about fencing, and that a few inches relatively speaking is sufficient compared to the wgole three feet. therfore 4 inches compared to 36 inches is a few. I apologize for not listing a specific number.

As to the deep stabs, I have seen first hand people survive deep stabs with 6 to 8 inch blades to rib cage and just below it. Lung Punctured, knicked the heart, etc. What causes the biggest reaction was the slashing of the blade to free it by the knifer, who actualy was the defendant. The blood is what told the person he was in trouble.

His Quote as he grabs his gut and midsection.
" Look! Nothing!, you could not hit me. I am invincible. You are going to die now." Then he moved his hand to his side the catch the wetness. He saw the blood then said the following: " I think I need to go to the hospital." He walked 40+ feet to his car and got in the passenger side while a friend got into the drivers side and drove him to the hospital.

Personally, I think both the stab and the slash are very good techniques.
And I never said that stabbing was bad. Only that you were not paying attention to the slashing.

With respect, I still ask for the explanation of your comments, and my education.

 

[Bester]

Ed,
I never said I liked your stuff. I said consistently it was crap.

You obviously can't keep your lies straight, and have no real world experience. as in -this- world. The fantasyland you live in may be another story. Your crap will get people injured or worse killed.

When that happens, I hope they nail your fraud *** to the wall and hold you criminally liable for your negligence.

I'm done.


-Al

 

[MJS]

Eddie- More uneducated thinking from the Master who talks big, but knows nothing. I'm done with this thread, seeing as how talking to you, is like talking to a child. As for the BJJ...the ranking goes like this....white, blue, purple, brown and black. Takes a little longer than your average trad. MA program. IMO, ranking means nothing, instead, its the knowledge that you have. Does not matter if you are a 5th degree black belt or 3rd, it does not make you a Superman. As for me...the BJJ training has been over the course of 10yrs on and off. Like I said about the rank....I have not tested for ranking in BJJ, but I have covered ALL of the material for those levels. And, just FYI, I am more than confident with my ground skills. Are you??? I've had the chance to roll with many people and have held my own. Then again, seeing as how your grappling is so superior, maybe I can leran something from you.

As for the screwdriver...more uneducated thinking on your part. You can think what you want, I really dont care. Open your mind, stop talking from your ***, and get some education on the FMA....maybe you'll learn something, then again, most likely you will not!! You really should train with a skilled FMA student...maybe your blind eyes will be open.

You know, I notice that you STILL have yet to tell us about YOU. Instead, you talk like the big tough child that you are, and tell us NOTHING about you. Just another anony*****!!! Talk about sitting behind the computer and being an armchair QB!!! Ohhh..wait...thats right..you said that I couldnt read your ranking!!! :boing2: :boing2: WOW!!! Another feeble excuse to not tell us about you!!! Give me a break!!! Look whos talking about excuses now Eddie!!!!! A slash to the neck wont drop someone?? :boing2: Yeah, ooook. Ed...is that why its important to protect your arms from a knife strike? By taking a cut/slash, etc, on the inner arm, where all of the veins are, you will be in more danger than on the top of the arm. Again, Eddie...do some research on the FMA. And as for ranking..again, do some research.

As for meeting....I'd be more than happy to. You're in NY, which is not that far from CT. If you ever felt the need to come down and do some training, let me know...I'd be happy to have you down to CT. If you think that my training sucks, and that you can teach me something, then again, take me up on my offer to come to CT. Let me state, that this is not a threat or a challenge, but an offer to simply train. I, unlike you, have an open mind, and am always willing to train with people from various arts. Feel free to PM me and let me know if you'd be interested! I'd be more than happy to put you up, as well as pay for your expenses, while you were here.

Oh, and I notice that you said that this forum is a waste of time. Does this mean that you're gonna leave???? We can only hope!!!!

Mike

 

[lonewolf12563]

Sure I would love to train. E-mail me with the information. We can meet and chat. Do not advertise BJJ unless you are ranked. Other wise you are just MMA. I agree with the inner arm aspect or your coment, but it still will not stop a determined attacker. That is the problem. Those fancy sparing moves that are thaught go right out the window during hi threat. It goes basic my friend. So why train those technique..because it is an art form. I honestly think you freelance in your training and the only degree you might have is your kenpo belt. Ed