Gov. Cuomo bans possession of "undetectable" knives in NYC

[Invisibleflash]

Governor Cuomo has signed S4202, a ban on manufacturing, shipment or possession of "undetectable" knives.

NY Giveth & NY Taketh - New NY Knife Ban Signed by Governor + Gun For Hire Radio

 

[jobo]

Governor Cuomo has signed S4202, a ban on manufacturing, shipment or possession of "undetectable" knives.

NY Giveth & NY Taketh - New NY Knife Ban Signed by Governor + Gun For Hire Radio

both laws seem to be extremely sensible, repealing th gravity knife ban seem stupid step

there is a slight logic issue of how they detect undetectable knives in order to enforce it, as clearly mass monitoring using metal detectors to gain entry to a building don't work, which is presumably why they were banned you can only really enforce it after they have stabbed someone

 

[frank raud]

By banning sale and shipment of undetectable knives, they will reduce the amount of such weapons available to New York residents. While metal detectors won't find such weapons, as their main purpose is to be somewhat armed in a Non Permissive Environment, if found in possession by other means (frisking ,search of car or property), you will be charged.

 

[jobo]

By banning sale and shipment of undetectable knives, they will reduce the amount of such weapons available to New York residents. While metal detectors won't find such weapons, as their main purpose is to be somewhat armed in a Non Permissive Environment, if found in possession by other means (frisking ,search of car or property), you will be charged.

I'm struggling to see the sense of the repeal and the new law together, if detectable knives aren't banned, then there no point in owning a none detectable knife and being frisked by the police and charged, however if none detectable knives are to dangerous to have in the hands of the population then also are detectable knifes,

there's clearly an advantage in a situation were all knifes are banned, but clearly not in public areas or private area were frisking isn't the norm, and there's no point at all having a metal detector to speed access, if you have to frisk every one anyway

 

[frank raud]

both laws seem to be extremely sensible, repealing th gravity knife ban seem stupid step

there is a slight logic issue of how they detect undetectable knives in order to enforce it, as clearly mass monitoring using metal detectors to gain entry to a building don't work, which is presumably why they were banned you can only really enforce it after they have stabbed someone

I'm struggling to see the sense of the repeal and the new law together, if detectable knives aren't banned, then there no point in owning a none detectable knife and being frisked by the police and charged, however if none detectable knives are to dangerous to have in the hands of the population then also are detectable knifes,

there's clearly an advantage in a situation were all knifes are banned, but clearly not in public areas or private area were frisking isn't the norm, and there's no point at all having a metal detector to speed access, if you have to frisk every one anyway

You can't, or shouldn't be able to get a normal knife made of steel past a metal detector. The intent and design of an undetectable knife IS to be able to get it past a metal detector. As a plastic blade (G10, carbon fiber, whatever), it does not have better edge retention than steel, does not cut better, is not more efficient in anything a knife does EXCEPT have the ability to pass through a metal detector. As the intent of the undetectable knife is to defeat measures intended to help keep the public safe, it is not unreasonable to make such things illegal. Don't expect weapon laws to make sense. Nunchakus are illegal in many places, not because of the vast amount of people who have be killed by them, but because of their reputation.

 

[jobo]

You can't, or shouldn't be able to get a normal knife made of steel past a metal detector. The intent and design of an undetectable knife IS to be able to get it past a metal detector. As a plastic blade (G10, carbon fiber, whatever), it does not have better edge retention than steel, does not cut better, is not more efficient in anything a knife does EXCEPT have the ability to pass through a metal detector. As the intent of the undetectable knife is to defeat measures intended to help keep the public safe, it is not unreasonable to make such things illegal. Don't expect weapon laws to make sense. Nunchakus are illegal in many places, not because of the vast amount of people who have be killed by them, but because of their reputation.

I can see the logic if banning them, what I cant see is the logic of simultaneously unbanning gravity knifes.

making things illegal doesn't work unless there is a significant risk of being caught

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

I can see the logic if banning them, what I cant see is the logic of simultaneously unbanning gravity knifes.

making things illegal doesn't work unless there is a significant risk of being caught

my assumption is, even if the knives are not banned by the city, they are banned in plenty of places in nyc, with some form of metal detector (museums broadway blah blah). This provides a way to press charges on the people who do sneak in with knives (theoretically the people with "detectable" ones are refused entry to begin with).

 

[jobo]

my assumption is, even if the knives are not banned by the city, they are banned in plenty of places in nyc, with some form of metal detector (museums broadway blah blah). This provides a way to press charges on the people who do sneak in with knives (theoretically the people with "detectable" ones are refused entry to begin with).

I'm wondering how much of a problem knife crime is in Musium s is, they may well be able to press chargers if someone finds a good reason to try and smuggle a knife in to the Musium but unless they are going to frisk every customer , they are not going to catch anyone oing, if they do frisk every one then you aren't going to try to smuggle a knife in, are you and you still won't have anyone to charge

 

[Deleted member 39746]

Dont they scan and frisk to get two different kinds of object? Like they frisk you, then scan you with a metal detactor to find any metallic objects. or the reverse way around. Or other wise any other contraband which wont get picked up. or to find any contraband which was picked up.

And if no one smuggles a knife in due to frisks, then your job is done basically.


for the record, "stealth" knives are banned in the U.K as well. If i interpreted the banned weapon list on the Gov website correctly, if it wasn't otherwise known.

 

[jobo]

Dont they scan and frisk to get two different kinds of object? Like they frisk you, then scan you with a metal detactor to find any metallic objects. or the reverse way around. Or other wise any other contraband which wont get picked up. or to find any contraband which was picked up.

And if no one smuggles a knife in due to frisks, then your job is done basically.


for the record, "stealth" knives are banned in the U.K as well. If i interpreted the banned weapon list on the Gov website correctly, if it wasn't otherwise known.

that's very debatable, they are illegal to import sell or even give away, but not to own and anyway the country is full of ceramic and plastic knives that have home/ kitchen use, so there's clearly a definition missing somewhere ! of what a stealth knife is, if it isn't one not made of metal

 

[Buka]

I wish only the most horrible things to befall the people who invented these undetectable knives and the people who carry them.

 

[Flying Crane]

I wish only the most horrible things to befall the people who invented these undetectable knives and the people who carry them.

Are you aware of any legitimate need for them, or are they simply meant to sneak by security systems?

 

[Flying Crane]

Dont they scan and frisk to get two different kinds of object? Like they frisk you, then scan you with a metal detactor to find any metallic objects. or the reverse way around. Or other wise any other contraband which wont get picked up. or to find any contraband which was picked up.

And if no one smuggles a knife in due to frisks, then your job is done basically.


for the record, "stealth" knives are banned in the U.K as well. If i interpreted the banned weapon list on the Gov website correctly, if it wasn't otherwise known.

When was the last time you got on an airplane? Scanning and frisking together are not typical. You get scanned, and if the detector goes off, then you get frisked. The vast majority of people only get scanned.

 

[MetalBoar]

When was the last time you got on an airplane? Scanning and frisking together are not typical. You get scanned, and if the detector goes off, then you get frisked. The vast majority of people only get scanned.

Strangely, I only get frisked...

 

[Flying Crane]

Strangely, I only get frisked...

Well, one or the other.

 

[Deleted member 39746]

When was the last time you got on an airplane? Scanning and frisking together are not typical. You get scanned, and if the detector goes off, then you get frisked. The vast majority of people only get scanned.

Arent the scanners at a airport those full scanners now days? or at least in some countries?

They have dogs and such milling about as well though, but fair enough.

 

[Flying Crane]

Arent the scanners at a airport those full scanners now days? or at least in some countries?

They have dogs and such milling about as well though, but fair enough.

There are both the metal detector and the full body image, most people walk through metal detection. It seems some random people are selected for body image. I flew just a couple weeks ago. I forgot to take off my belt when I walked through the meta detection and it triggered a beep. So they pulled me aside and frisked me.

So you get frisked If you trigger the metal detector. But if not, you don’t get frisked.

I don’t know if these knives would show up on the body image scanners. If a new policy mandates that everyone must walk through the body imaging scanners, that will dramatically increase the time needed for people to get through security at the airport. It will clog the airports.

 

[dvcochran]

I can see the logic if banning them, what I cant see is the logic of simultaneously unbanning gravity knifes.

making things illegal doesn't work unless there is a significant risk of being caught

I anyone advocating banning gravity knives? I had to look them up as I did know what they were. If I have my pants on I have a "gravity" knife clipped in my pocket. Just way too convenient not to considering my day-to-day work.

 

[dvcochran]

I wish only the most horrible things to befall the people who invented these undetectable knives and the people who carry them.

I don't fault the people who invented/discovered the new materials and technology to make a "better" or sharper/longer lasting edge. I fault the deviant minds who use the new material/tech to create something with evil intent.
As usual the few screw things up for the many. This is where/why the majority of laws are written.

I much prefer unconcealed guns/knives. Puts everything on the same plane.

 

[jobo]

I don't fault the people who invented/discovered the new materials and technology to make a "better" or sharper/longer lasting edge. I fault the deviant minds who use the new material/tech to create something with evil intent.
As usual the few screw things up for the many. This is where/why the majority of laws are written.

I much prefer unconcealed guns/knives. Puts everything on the same plane.

but weapons generally are a best amoral,the, may not be created with evil intent, but the people who make them care nothing about people with evil intent getting their hands on them, as they very often do. I'd put these in the same cxatorgy as any other weapon as having no moral imperative at all