From Kung Fu Tea - When Did Wing Chun Become “Intangible Cultural Heritage”?

Discussion in 'Wing Chun' started by Xue Sheng, Apr 5, 2019.

  1. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

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    It is no secret that I like Wing Chun, even trained it a few times, and if not for Taijiquan and Xingyiquan, I likely would have trained it a lot more. And if the guy I talked to a few month back ever decided to relocate here and teach, I would likely go give it another try (he is a Chinese student, learned in Hong Kong, student of Ip Chun)

    Came across this article and thought the Wing Chun contingent of MT might find it interesting

    Article: From Kung Fu Tea - When Did Wing Chun Become “Intangible Cultural Heritage”?

    Kung Fu Tea website
     
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  2. Marnetmar

    Marnetmar Black Belt

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    What the heck is "Intangible cultural heritage" supposed to mean
     
  3. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I always enjoy reading Ben Judkins’s work.
     
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  4. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Yeah, and besides, how can a "hands-on" art like Wing Chun be "intangible". It's all about contact. How can you touch the intangible?

    Whoa...
    [​IMG]

    That would be like ...touching nothingness, or touching the void.

    ...which by the way, was a really intense movie.
     
  5. APL76

    APL76 Green Belt

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    It is a pretty important idea floating around when groups like UNESCO get involved with indigenous/marginal/threatened peoples. What it essentially refers to is anything related to a group of people that is an immaterial element of their culture. It comes up in my research all the time (I'm an anthropologist with training wheels).

    In a wing chun context if you think of the overall system of Wing Chun as an element of intangible culture a wooden dummy, pole or the butterfly knives would be the tangible cultural heritage. Intangible= the system of wing chun, the principals, the techniques etc. the tangible is the material aspects of the system= dummy weapons.
     
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  6. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    a dummy that looks like a clothes rack would not be tangible, with out the intangible elements of wing Chun, it would just be a clothes rack.
     
  7. Danny T

    Danny T Senior Master

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    That would be only if one uses it as a clothes rack. Just because it looks like a clothes rack to a person doesn't mean it is.
    Same as; just because someone looks like a clown that doesn't make them a comical performer.
     
  8. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

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    True, we had the creepy clown thing in my area a little over a year ago.... I called them "out of work Bozos" :D
     
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  9. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    that's an evil clown , we had the clown thing here as well, it all stopped when people started putting banana skins in their drive ways
     
  10. APL76

    APL76 Green Belt

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    Pyramids in Egypt, are they just piles of rocks or Ancient Egyptian pyramid shaped tombs? There is no Ancient Egyptian intangible culture any more yet the pyramids are still pyramids and old tombs. Very basically Its simply a division between material elements of culture and the immaterial elements of culture.
     
  11. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    well there both ?

    theres no such thing as a material element of culture, all culture is intangable.
    culture is only in the mind of the observer, if the observer places no cultural significance to an object, its has no significance, the fairly ancient Egyptians stripped all the cover stones off to use in other building as the pyramids had no cultural significance to them, they wernt a pile of rocks ,they were a pile of building material
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2019
  12. APL76

    APL76 Green Belt

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    Archaeologists literally refer to the stuff they dig up as "material culture". Of course there are material elements to culture, the intangible stuff is culture as a process, as the stuff that helps us make sense of the world and how we fit into it, what allows us to make meaning in and of the world. Analytically they can be divided into separate types of culture. The intangible cultural heritage is the stuff that lives in people, the tangible stuff is the material manifestation of that culture. That could be a clay pot, a sarcophagus or a wooden dummy.
     
  13. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    I'm pretty sure they call them artifacts, att least if they are not trying to increase their sense of self importance by calling old pots material culture

    so go on then how does an oold pot,manifest culture, a pot or infact any ina m8nate object is incapable of any autonomous action including manifestation?
     
  14. APL76

    APL76 Green Belt

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    Well when I learned archaeology they did indeed call artefacts material culture, and indeed there are entire cultures named after the distinctive clay pots that they made; for example:

    Beaker culture - Wikipedia

    An artefact doesn't need to be capable of any autonomous action to be a material representation of a culture.
     
  15. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Great answer. Pardon my previous snarkiness! Actually, social anthropology was my undergraduate major a million years ago, so I´m not totally clueless. Mostly, but not totally. So, not to derail the thread or anything, but are you going on for a PhD. and career in the field?
     
  16. APL76

    APL76 Green Belt

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    Yeah; I'm way too many years (9) into a PhD, mostly extended by firstly suffering near debilitating chronic back injury/infection (2012-2018- now gradually recovering), and secondly lecturing near full time for the last couple of years being the only bread winner in my household.

    As for career??? I am getting really sick of living from contract to contract with no guarantees of having a new contract at the end of the old one. My brother is also doing a PhD but has a full time research job with the government and his full time employment and fat juicy pay cheque both look pretty good to me at the moment. I just haven quite given up on a research/teaching career quite just yet.
     
  17. mograph

    mograph Master Black Belt

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    Sorry to hear -- I've taught in the college system in Ontario. This precarious employment business is the worst. Okay, we can give up the idea of tenure, but maybe a five-year contract would be nice?
     
  18. geezer

    geezer Grandmaster

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    Yeah, my dream career choice was to go into academics too. Got a couple of part time gigs, then got married and started a family. One of my kids was born with a heart condition. I had to get a regular job with insurance. No universal care down here in the States, you know. So that meant teaching high school. What the heck. Working with kids is fun and it pays the bills. The downside is dealing with an abundance of administrative idiocy and (in Arizona) really low wages.
     
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