Eosin Panther belt comparison to Tokaido/Shureido

[ma-bob]

I'm looking to get a new belt. I've had Tokaido belts in the past and liked them, but I keep hearing good things about Eosin Panther, and their option of front side-only embroidery that doesn't have stitches over top it is extremely appealing to me. However, I don't know anyone who has an Eosin I can look at in person, and I haven't been able to find much in the way of good reviews or discussions about how it compares to Tokaido belts. Some things I'm wondering:

1. As I said, their method of front side-only embroidery sounds amazing. Can anyone comment on whether it comes with any downsides, like maybe an inconsistent structural integrity that causes it to twist? I find it curious that no one else is doing this.
2. I know the company's been around since something like 1974 and has sold a lot of belts to karate and TKD practitioners, but most of the discussions and reviews out there focus on them in the context of BJJ. That might just be because BJJ is the hot thing right now, but I do wonder if the way the belts are built has shifted more toward the needs of BJJ -- where usage and expectations aren't the same as for, say, a TKD guy. Anyone with a recent Eosin belt that can comment on its suitability for arts like karate? For example, will the "soft" belts hang in the classical, downward-curve style if one gets enough length, or are you stuck with the chopsticks look that BJJ folks prefer? I don't think I've seen a single in-depth review from a TMA perspective, so very curious about this.
3. I like satin belts. I can't put my finger on it, but something about the way they tie (once broken in) and hang and feel around the waste appeals to me. However, I also know many people believe they wear faster. I don't mind a little wear over time, but the common refrain about these belts showing wear after just a few months is very off-putting to me. That said, I actually had a silk Tokaido once. Over a decade or so of use, it did get pretty worn on the edges, particularly in the knot area, but it wasn't out of control. But that was in the late '80s/early '90s, and it was real silk. It doesn't look like Eosin has the option of real silk, but I'm wondering how Tokaido's old-school real silk compares to their current real and artificial silk offerings and to Eosin's aritificial silk. Is the texture the same? The way they hang? The durability?
4. Finally, any general opinions on how Eosin compares in terms of quality to the old-school top dogs like Tokaido and Shureido? I know this sounds snobbish in way, but this is a belt I'll have for many years, and it's a bit of a leap for me to break from those companies and buy from a much newer, American company that also sells flag belts. But, the logical side of my brain can prevail, and if the product is truly of similar or better quality, then why not? I'm just getting a new belt that looks basically the same to anyone else, not turning my gi in for a rash guard.

Opinions/feedback/other thoughts warmly welcomed!

 

[Dirty Dog]

I'm looking to get a new belt. I've had Tokaido belts in the past and liked them, but I keep hearing good things about Eosin Panther, and their option of front side-only embroidery that doesn't have stitches over top it is extremely appealing to me. However, I don't know anyone who has an Eosin I can look at in person, and I haven't been able to find much in the way of good reviews or discussions about how it compares to Tokaido belts. Some things I'm wondering:

1. As I said, their method of front side-only embroidery sounds amazing. Can anyone comment on whether it comes with any downsides, like maybe an inconsistent structural integrity that causes it to twist? I find it curious that no one else is doing this.

Their method is pretty straight forward. Their belts are really two belts. Embroider them in the usual fashion, put the back (ugly) sides together, and stich them into one belt.

1. I know the company's been around since something like 1974 and has sold a lot of belts to karate and TKD practitioners, but most of the discussions and reviews out there focus on them in the context of BJJ. That might just be because BJJ is the hot thing right now, but I do wonder if the way the belts are built has shifted more toward the needs of BJJ -- where usage and expectations aren't the same as for, say, a TKD guy. Anyone with a recent Eosin belt that can comment on its suitability for arts like karate? For example, will the "soft" belts hang in the classical, downward-curve style if one gets enough length, or are you stuck with the chopsticks look that BJJ folks prefer? I don't think I've seen a single in-depth review from a TMA perspective, so very curious about this.

If it's long enough, it will absolutely hang. The stiff belts will, too. They just require a breaking in period. During that time, the knot is difficult to get/keep tight. I am partial to their 2" soft cotton belt, but that's a matter of personal tastes.

1. I like satin belts. I can't put my finger on it, but something about the way they tie (once broken in) and hang and feel around the waste appeals to me. However, I also know many people believe they wear faster. I don't mind a little wear over time, but the common refrain about these belts showing wear after just a few months is very off-putting to me. That said, I actually had a silk Tokaido once. Over a decade or so of use, it did get pretty worn on the edges, particularly in the knot area, but it wasn't out of control. But that was in the late '80s/early '90s, and it was real silk. It doesn't look like Eosin has the option of real silk, but I'm wondering how Tokaido's old-school real silk compares to their current real and artificial silk offerings and to Eosin's aritificial silk. Is the texture the same? The way they hang? The durability?

I have no personal experience with their silk belts.

1. Finally, any general opinions on how Eosin compares in terms of quality to the old-school top dogs like Tokaido and Shureido? I know this sounds snobbish in way, but this is a belt I'll have for many years, and it's a bit of a leap for me to break from those companies and buy from a much newer, American company that also sells flag belts. But, the logical side of my brain can prevail, and if the product is truly of similar or better quality, then why not? I'm just getting a new belt that looks basically the same to anyone else, not turning my gi in for a rash guard.

Opinions/feedback/other thoughts warmly welcomed!

I think their quality is top notch. Would whole heartedly recommend.

I'm partial to their double sided embroidery. I put English on one side and Korean on the other. The default is stripes on one end and their label on the other. I always ask them to remove the label and put stripes on both ends, which has never been a problem. There's no good reason for doing it this way. I just have a thing for symmetry.

 

[ma-bob]

Their method is pretty straight forward. Their belts are really two belts. Embroider them in the usual fashion, put the back (ugly) sides together, and stich them into one belt.

That sounds similar to the butterfly technique that other companies offer, where the two faces of the belt are embroidered before they fold them together around the core and stitch the belt closed. But that technique requires the rows of belt stitches go over top the embroidery. Thus, the choice has always been embroidery that doesn't go through to the back but has stitches over it, or embroidery that shows on the back but is cleaner on the front because the belt stitches are underneath it.

Eosin's technique, however, appears to combine the best of those two approaches: clean embroidery on top the belt stitches that doesn't go through to the back.

I'm partial to their double sided embroidery. I put English on one side and Korean on the other. The default is stripes on one end and their label on the other. I always ask them to remove the label and put stripes on both ends, which has never been a problem. There's no good reason for doing it this way. I just have a thing for symmetry.

Very nice! I note in your photos that the lines of text appear very straight on the belt and that the dan bars appear parallel and have pretty consistent spacing.

It's also good to hear they'll leave off the label, as I was going to request that, too, if I went with them.