This type of footwork exists in Jow Ga forms. The video above is a rare case where the person retreats straight back for a mile. Most people would take one of the other options:One thing that I don't understand is why this kind of footwork and punching combo doesn't exist in any MA form? I would love to create a form that contain this footwork and punching combo.
I had someone charge me like that and it only takes about 3 punches, before you get the feeling that your opponent is still going to charge in. The guy in the video figured it out quickly as well. He just didn't have a better response other than go straight back.
If it works in an MMA contest, it'll get used in MMA. If it doesn't work, it'll get tossed by the wayside. MMA guys are only interested in whether or not it is useful in the ring.
Moving straight back repeatedly is seldom a good idea. It's usually a better idea to move back and indirect.
I'm going to disagree with this one. I'm see a lot more long fist techniques now than I have in the past, and I'm not talking about haymakers. I can tell the difference because the long fist punches have a distinct circular motion. It winds, up, goes out, and it comes back in. For example @ 6:30 mark, classic long fist. technique. I see tons of this where I didn't see them before. We'll probably start to see other TMA techniques that we haven't seen before as fighters are looking for new and unexpected ways to attack.
I can only see this as an advantage if the person can move back faster than you can advance. I've sparred against a newbie who was chubby, but he had the gift of retreating and he could move move back faster than I could advance when my technique had a 45 degree angle in it. Where other people would freeze, he would move out of fear, really quick, but where my first and second strike would be too short to throw. My third strike would set up my footwork for a charge. The second strike was more to keep him from advancing on me, It's thrown hard just in case, but I'm not expecting anything other than preventing my opponents advance. This is what It seems like I'm seeing in the video here. The extended fist hides the advance and is use more like "jousting" than a punch..In my yesterday class, we trained this footwork 20 times. In the beginning, we started from only 10 feet distance. It was just slow forward steps. After 20 reps, we had reached to the running speed. We could reached to maximum 18 feet distance.
I find some advantages for this kind of training:
- Since the leading stiff arm is similar to the rhino guard, you can use it to destroy your opponent's defense.
- You will develop courage and feel comfortable to attack your opponent from a farther distance.
- By adding a small jump, this footwork can cover more distance (I really like that small jump).
I want to try to repeat this footwork 100 times daily for a month and find out what benefit that I can get.
The extended fist can act like a boxer's stiff jab arm in front of opponent's face that
Old school boxing. Used to be called a round blow or sometimes a swing.
I couldn't find much on the description of a round blow and what I found didn't sound the same as the long fist techniques. I found the description below and it didn't sound like what I've been doing or the new stuff I've seen in MMA. The first sentence below isn't how a long fist technique is powered. I don't pull my hand back and then send it forward. This would mean that I
MMA is still too young. Many TMA techniques have not been used in MMA yet. Give another 100 years, there won't be any difference between TMA and MMA.
I think you are right considering that we are seeing an increasing number of TMA techniques with something new every year.
I have not seen this throw been used in UFC yet - extend your leg between your opponent's legs. It creates an excellent side mount opportunity on the ground. I'm sure someone will use it in UFC in the next 20 years.
I couldn't find much on the description of a round blow and what I found didn't sound the same as the long fist techniques. I found the description below and it didn't sound like what I've been doing or the new stuff I've seen in MMA. The first sentence below isn't how a long fist technique is powered. I don't pull my hand back and then send it forward. This would mean that I
1. Pull my hand back then send it forward.
2. When I throw my long fist techniques, my fist are going in the same direction like a wheel.
"When about to deliver a round blow it is impossible to do so without first drawing the hand back. This gives notice of your intention to hit, and prepares your opponent for what is coming. As most of Welsh's blows were of the circular variety, McFarland always heeded the notice of Welsh's intention, with the result that most of his blows went very wide of their mark--so wide, indeed, that Welsh looked almost foolish, and the faults and weaknesses of his style--the American style--were clearly shown. McFarland kept on piling up points, and I fully expected to see Welsh suddenly flash into brilliant and bewildering attack, but it never came, and he looked a loser round after round, and never seemed to me to equal his opponent in either speed or skill. McFarland was far more precise in his hitting than Welsh was, and he varied his attack very nicely; he judges his distances well, and his footwork was really splendid. His ducking and slipping reminded me of Pedlar Palmer in his best days, and, taken altogether, he was much the superior boxer, in style, execution, speed, footwork, judgment and precision of hitting. There was not a stage of the contest when McFarland could not have been declared the winner. He won from beginning to end, and I tender him my sincere sympathy at being deprived of the victory he had so fairly earned." source: Old timers' technique/style descriptions
I found another source that described it as a "primitive hook" "Three years earlier, Dempsey had knocked the Canadian out in the 13th Round. In the 32nd round of this bare-knuckle affair, Lablanche threw a “round blow,” essentially a primitive hook." Source JL: The Pivot Punch
This one is from a .pdf book online source: http://www.nycsteampunk.com/bartitsu/manuals/TheArtAndPracticeOfBoxing1825.pdf
"The parts of the body and face, which are subject to suffer by round blows,are the temporal arteries, the jaw-bone, the glands of the ears,the ribs, and the loins; those subject to straight ones, the eyes,the mouth, and the pit of the stomach"
Long fists hits similar locations except the ribs and loins. For example, The long fist techniques that I'm seeing would not be effective against the ribs because of the big circular path.
I even went to look at some of my sparring videos to see if I was pulling my hand back. For the long fist punches that I'm referring to, You either rotate your arm forward or backwards. Never back then forward, to do so will greatly cut down the speed and power. It's also not a punch that you can just stop and then send it in the opposite direction. If I were to throw a back hand or hammer fist off the punch that I'm referring to, then I would easily tear up my shoulder. Below is an example. of how my arm rotates in one direction.
This wasn't a hard nor fast punch. The punch grazed him because he's sneaky fighter and stepped on my foot which prevented me from moving forward. It looks like I'm pulling my arm back, but I'm just circling my arm forward. Notice how it drops down to my knee and then circles back up. The bigger long fist punches follow a similar path. I may start from the back, but I don't pull back, then go forward.
https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/old-timers-technique-style-descriptions.625389/
James is a friend but I disagree that the round blow, or swing, was a "primitive hook." It wasn't a primitive anything. It was a circular blow designed for the longer range outfighting of the time. I also wouldn't put Dempsey during the hay-day of the Swing/Round Blow.
Look at the second page, the dedication, right after the Special Thanks portion. Does that name look familiar?
There's one version that pulls back the hand but it wasn't favored or popular because, as noted, it telegraphs.
Absolutely disagree. MMA started as a "battle of the styles" and that's what it was for the first year or so. Since then it has imported fighters from every style including karate, sanshou, judo, muay thai, boxing, wrestling, various kung fu's, etc. There have been hundreds of thousands, maybe millions, of sanctioned MMA matches ranging from amateur through professional. And EVERY competitor is looking for the tiniest of edges to use. Any punch that they find which might possibly give them the smallest of an edge will be tried.
Still disagree. MMA and TMA are two different things with two different goals. While there will inevitably be bleed from one to the other, they will never look indistinguishable from each other for the same reasons that an IPSC match doesn't look like an actual self defense with firearms event.
I don't watch MMA much but I've seen it a couple of times. When I've seen it, the person thrown was pushed up against the cage and was in defensive posture, trying to defend against knees to the inner thigh which gave the thrower opportunity to circle the neck. It didn't look as clean as this Demo, of course.I have not seen this throw been used in UFC yet - extend your leg between your opponent's legs. It creates an excellent side mount opportunity on the ground. I'm sure someone will use it in UFC in the next 20 years.
Who works for style points? I just want to go home and have dinner.
