martialartstutor
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Dont like MMA? You don't like Bruce Lee
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Steve
Mostly Harmless
Everybody likes MMA.
drop bear
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I am more of a chuck norris fan anyway.
OP
martialartstutor
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Alot of traditionalists dislike it though...yet they like bruce lee
Dinkydoo
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I think there needs to be a distinction between MMA and UFC. The people I see bashing MMA are generally only referring to things they've disliked about the UFC.
Saying you don't like MMA is more like admitting you just don't like sport fighting - which extends to boxing, karate competition, judo, TKD....any style that encourages competition.
Saying you don't like MMA is more like admitting you just don't like sport fighting - which extends to boxing, karate competition, judo, TKD....any style that encourages competition.
drop bear
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Which Bruce Lee never did. So you could be in the Bruce camp and not like mma. Or like myself in the mma camp and not be so super impressed with Bruce Lee.
If you take your opinion of MMA from the UFC it would be a mistake, there's so much more to it than that. These days so many people think they know Bruce Lee yet weren't alive when he was around so only know what has been written about him, and an awful lot of that is stuff that simply isn't true.
No, a lot of Traditionalist hate MMA fanboys who try to tell everyone that MMA is the answer, and that anyone who doesn't do it is wasting their time.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
I have no interest in MMA, and I don't like Bruce lee. He was a lousy actor, borderline unwatchable stuff.
In your opinion only, it's not a fact.
Hmm ... just in the opening sentences of the video I'm hearing some things to take issue with.
"Bruce Lee is adored by traditional martial artists and mixed martial artists alike."
Bruce Lee is admired by some martial artists (of all types) and not so much by others (of all types). Honestly, his fandom is mostly built on the fact that he was the biggest martial arts movie action star of his generation rather than his actual accomplishments as a martial artist. Yes, he was an accomplished and innovative martial artist, but so were many of his peers who are not nearly so well known. (This is also why Chuck Norris is so much more famous than his peers such as Joe Lewis, Skipper Mullins or Louis Delgado.)
"He's basically the first modern mixed martial artist."
Well, no. He used his fame to advocate for an eclectic ("mixed") approach to martial arts, but there were plenty of people doing the same thing who didn't have that same platform to publicize what they were doing. Kajukenbo was created as an eclectic martial art with a similar philosophy to JKD in 1947, decades before Lee developed JKD. Bruce Tegner created Jukado around the same time that Lee developed his art. You can find plenty of other examples.
Any "traditional" martial artists who object to MMA on the grounds of not liking the mixing of different arts probably don't like Bruce Lee's approach either. On the other hand, many of the folks who don't like MMA are actually objecting to the sportive aspects of modern MMA in its current form. Those objections wouldn't apply to Bruce Lee's approach to JKD which included eye pokes and groin kicks and not nearly so much ground fighting.
"How he came to that conclusion ..."
Here the OP recounts Lee's version of his bout with Wong Jack Man, including Lee's claim that the bout was to establish his right to teach non-Chinese students. Leaving aside the differing accounts by spectators regarding the outcome of the match, Wong Jack Man denied that this was the origin of the fight and that he himself did not discriminate against non-Chinese students.
Unfortunately, I fear the OP is following his usual approach of posting to get some views for his YouTube channel without actually engaging in much conversation here on the forum.
"Bruce Lee is adored by traditional martial artists and mixed martial artists alike."
Bruce Lee is admired by some martial artists (of all types) and not so much by others (of all types). Honestly, his fandom is mostly built on the fact that he was the biggest martial arts movie action star of his generation rather than his actual accomplishments as a martial artist. Yes, he was an accomplished and innovative martial artist, but so were many of his peers who are not nearly so well known. (This is also why Chuck Norris is so much more famous than his peers such as Joe Lewis, Skipper Mullins or Louis Delgado.)
"He's basically the first modern mixed martial artist."
Well, no. He used his fame to advocate for an eclectic ("mixed") approach to martial arts, but there were plenty of people doing the same thing who didn't have that same platform to publicize what they were doing. Kajukenbo was created as an eclectic martial art with a similar philosophy to JKD in 1947, decades before Lee developed JKD. Bruce Tegner created Jukado around the same time that Lee developed his art. You can find plenty of other examples.
Any "traditional" martial artists who object to MMA on the grounds of not liking the mixing of different arts probably don't like Bruce Lee's approach either. On the other hand, many of the folks who don't like MMA are actually objecting to the sportive aspects of modern MMA in its current form. Those objections wouldn't apply to Bruce Lee's approach to JKD which included eye pokes and groin kicks and not nearly so much ground fighting.
"How he came to that conclusion ..."
Here the OP recounts Lee's version of his bout with Wong Jack Man, including Lee's claim that the bout was to establish his right to teach non-Chinese students. Leaving aside the differing accounts by spectators regarding the outcome of the match, Wong Jack Man denied that this was the origin of the fight and that he himself did not discriminate against non-Chinese students.
Unfortunately, I fear the OP is following his usual approach of posting to get some views for his YouTube channel without actually engaging in much conversation here on the forum.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Oh it's self-evident.
Steve
Mostly Harmless
Bruce lee is the best of all time. And everyone loves him, even if they say they don't.
punisher73
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Hmmmm, much is wrong with these assumptions.
Some people don't like MMA because they don't like combative sports at all and view martial arts for self-protection or self-development only.
Other people don't like the type of person and hype that only the UFC puts out there.
Either of those reasons have nothing to do with a person who likes or dislikes Bruce Lee.
Many people don't like Bruce Lee for various reasons and those have nothing to do with why they like/dislike MMA.
For me personally, I think Bruce's "camp" exagerated and lied about alot of stuff to make him sound better than he was. For example, claiming the fight with WJM was due to teaching non-chinese instead of him being disrepsectful. Muscle and Fitness examined the claims from students about how strong BL was, but looked at his meticulous training records and showed that they were average at best.
Some people don't like MMA because they don't like combative sports at all and view martial arts for self-protection or self-development only.
Other people don't like the type of person and hype that only the UFC puts out there.
Either of those reasons have nothing to do with a person who likes or dislikes Bruce Lee.
Many people don't like Bruce Lee for various reasons and those have nothing to do with why they like/dislike MMA.
For me personally, I think Bruce's "camp" exagerated and lied about alot of stuff to make him sound better than he was. For example, claiming the fight with WJM was due to teaching non-chinese instead of him being disrepsectful. Muscle and Fitness examined the claims from students about how strong BL was, but looked at his meticulous training records and showed that they were average at best.
Chris Parker
Grandmaster
Hmm…
Hi. We haven't met yet. I have, however, been reading (and watching) all your posts, here and elsewhere… and I'm going to offer some advice.
First… quit with the videos. There are many reasons for this, but the main one is this: This is a discussion forum. It's based in text conversations, and is designed to take advantage of exactly that… it allows a clear line of conversation, it allows the ability to quote directly (including portions or whole conversations, such as my quote of your OP video above), and allows you to take more time over your wording, as well as allowing you to be more precise. Videos are best used for illustrating a point, not as a whole post.
Second… I'm going to recommend that you take a moment to step back… and realise that, honestly, you have no-where near the expertise, experience, knowledge, insight, or understanding you think you do. Not one of your videos or posts have been close to accurate, this one included. That's okay… you're young, you're not meant to know it all. But you do need to realise that.
Third… let's look at what is said here.
No.
Bruce Lee is nothing at all to do with MMA. Nothing. MMA is a competitive sporting approach, which Bruce did not advocate. Yes, MMA takes aspects of different approaches/systems, but it's not the same type of thing that Bruce did with his JKD, so… no. I mean… in the video, the comment is made along the lines of "Bruce is the father of MMA, what Bruce did was MMA, you can't tell me otherwise". Okay… but you're wrong.
But the biggest issue is this insistence on educating… while having nothing but rather ill-informed opinion backing it up.I get that you're relatively passionate about it… but you're in the wrong place to be the teacher. Especially if this is the type of thing you're "educating" us on (or the "TKD Doesn't Work" idea… or… well, anything you've come up with yet).
So… good to meet you. And I hope you take on board at least the first point… because you really do need to embrace the way a forum works if you want to continue to be using it.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
Sounds like I am listening to a college radio station.... not a big fan of college radio stations
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
I didn't even bother to watch the video. The title of the thread told me enough.
I think a lot of us 'older' ones have a nostalgic fondness for Bruce Lee, he got a lot of people into martial arts of all descriptions and was a very public face for martial artists that we hadn't really had before. Liking or disliking him has nothing to do with MMA, which should be judged on it's own merits anyway.
