Dancing arts

[habanero_heat]

I'm looking for info on the martial arts disguised as dancing, such as coepweila (sp?) but more specifically english morris dancing.

The use of sticks is obvious but I am trying to figure out the significance of the bells.

I can see why the aincient chinese would train with grain flails etc after a weapons ban but If anyone has any info on the reasons why this would start up in england i'd be grateful.

 

[arnisador]

What exactly is morris dancing?

 

[jazkiljok]

Originally posted by arnisador

What exactly is morris dancing?

it's a traditional English dance using mainly swords- some say orginally brought over from Spain- aka Moor's dance. not truly a dance featuring disquised technique in the form of dance.

it's evolved to many different interpretations (why the bells), but it is all dance.

:asian:

 

[pesilat]

A couple of things you might find interesting:

http://renaissance-faire.com/Renfaires/Entertainment/History-of-Morris-Dance.htm

http://www.lutterworth.com/jamesclarke/jc/titles/morris.htm

http://www.themorrisring.org/More.htm

http://web.syr.edu/~rsholmes/morris/realhistory.html

http://web.syr.edu/~rsholmes/morris/



As far as others, I think many cultures have folk dances based on martial arts ... or maybe it was the other way around

Here's a tangential thought that's just struck me (if I've ever heard this postulated previously, I don't remember it; so if I'm repeating something someone else has said but not giving credit to them, I apologize).

What if there are cultures where the martial arts were, in fact, based on their folk dances as an expedient to teaching the martial arts? The people already had the principles of movement, balance, etc. The folk dances could have been used as a "template" for the martial practices so people might learn them easier.

Just a random thought. I may have to look into that further. If anyone has ever heard of anything like that, let me know

Anyway ... I know that there some Filipino and Indonesian folk dances that have had martial arts influences. Though many of the people doing these dances today really have no idea that they're also training in martial arts to a limited extent.

I think in the Filipino and Indonesian cultures, the martial aspects weren't in the dances to disguise them, per se. But they were there because the dances often depicted folk tales that involved combat. So the combative aspects of the story were told with martial arts motions. Though, in some cases, they may have been "disguised" as dances ... I don't know.

Mike

 

[Quick Sand]

Hey,

First of all if you want to find information on the African / Brazilian martial art it's spelled Capoeira. If that's the one you meant.

Second, in response to Pesilat, I was kind of thinking along the same lines recently and now that you say that it brought it back to mind. I was wondering if the traditional Russian/Ukrainian styles of dancing might have any connection to martial arts at all. The mens dances often involve some pretty crazy acrobatics and stuff (jumps, flips, split kick type things etc.). I really don't know anything about it. I was just wondering. Anyone else know?

I was also thinking recently that some styles of dancing might be really good for cross training with martial arts because they work on flexibility, balance and muscle control so much.

Does anyone here dance as well as do marital arts? :asian:

 

[Mormegil]

Originally posted by pesilat

Anyway ... I know that there some Filipino and Indonesian folk dances that have had martial arts influences. Though many of the people doing these dances today really have no idea that they're also training in martial arts to a limited extent.

I think in the Filipino and Indonesian cultures, the martial aspects weren't in the dances to disguise them, per se. But they were there because the dances often depicted folk tales that involved combat. So the combative aspects of the story were told with martial arts motions. Though, in some cases, they may have been "disguised" as dances ... I don't know.

Mike

One of the beliefs in FMA (don't know how accurate this really is), is that they were disguised in the dances. The reason being, Spain was an occupying force, and it was illegal to practice martial arts openly, and at certain times to even carry a knife (which is a problem for an agricultural society).

So the story goes, the Spanish enjoyed watching the Pilipinos (termed "indios" at the time), perform their pretty little folk dances for their amusement. The Pilipinos also found it amusing as they were showing the Spaniards how they killed their guards at night.

I can assume it would be similar in Indonesia.

The idea that combative aspects were in the story lines probably holds true too. From what I understand, after a battle, the warriors would come back and tell their story of how this did this and that, demonstrating their moves. These probably started to get some musical accompaniment eventually, and just kind of evolved into a dance. I see a LOT of hidden moves in the folk dances (not the Spanish influenced Maria Clara or "Rural" dances, but in the indigenous and muslim dances). I'll see these even in dances that have no martial story line - such as "Malong Malong" a dance about the uses of the sarong skirt.

 

[Master of Blades]

Okay call me stupid but since when was Morris Dancing a Martial Art as such

 

[jazkiljok]

Originally posted by Master of Blades
Okay call me stupid but since when was Morris Dancing a Martial Art as such

well, saw it once performed at a renaisance fair years ago-- and as i think i said awhile back-- all it is in the here and now is a dance. as in, uh, dancing-- there are a few cultures that did incorporate martial movement into their dances but the true training has always really been separate-- think of the Peking Opera-- that's not real martial arts-- that is acrobatics that mimic the martial arts.

 

[Rich Parsons]

I have not seen or read this book in years. THe last time I saw it, it was in the Flint Public Library.

Alejandro, Reynaldo G., SAYAW SILANGAN The Dance in the
Phillipines, New York, New York, (Dance Perspectives Foundation)
1972

Good Reading

 

[jellyman]

I was wondering if the traditional Russian/Ukrainian styles of dancing might have any connection to martial arts at all.

According to Vladimir Vasiliev, yes.

If you look at certain East Indian dances, there are apparently martial moves from kalaripayat.

Also, I do ballroom dancing, which is quite useful for throwing skill - you just have to figure out how to dance as badly as possible.

 

[Zepp]

I've also done some ballroom and some swing dancing. I find that dancing can always help you out in martial arts (by increasing your agility if nothing else), but TKD really just doesn't help with my dancing.

I vaguely remember hearing something about Okinawan dances that are really concealed martial arts. Anyone know anything about these?

 

[Samurai]

Originally posted by Zepp
[B
I vaguely remember hearing something about Okinawan dances that are really concealed martial arts. Anyone know anything about these? [/B]

You remember watching the Karate Kid Part II? The girl was showing Daniel-san her dance and he was expressed because it was like the same stuff he was learning.

As a side note- I hate the fact that I liked these movies. <Boot to the Head>

--Jeremy Bays