Create Your Own Kata

[Tez3]

You jits guts should make up a Jiu-jitsu kata. I imagine it would look like a spider wrestling with itself. That would be so much fun to watch.

Perhaps they could look to the Judo kata for inspiration?

 

[jks9199]

I know this is in the Japanese section but did not Ed Parker require students going for black belt to create their own form?
I see nothing wrong with a student who has been studying for years to create their own form. It will show their interpretation of what they feel fighting is about. However if it is simply a form to win competitions ( a show form) then I am against it. This form should NOT be considered part of the required curriculum for the school or system but should strictly be a personal form.

I know of a few schools that require students at some point to create a form. I've had students do it, in fact -- and done it myself. It can be a good exercise to test and demonstrate whether the underlying principles of movement and sequencing are understood -- and if done from a solid knowledge base, can be pretty impressive.

And, after all, someone somewhere invented the original forms, no?

 

[Steve]

This is as close to forms in bjj as I've seen.

 

[hoshin1600]

This is the only statement that I disagree with in your post. I can only disagree with it as far as the pre-existing kata of China and Okinawa and I can't offer any conclusive proof to support my view.

I myself have a couple of made up forms that I practice for my own amusement and to preserve skills and knowledge from different sources. If I taught, I might have taught them to others too.

So as I said, I'm not against the idea. I just think that kata in karate and Chinese arts generally hold a very central role. They contain the system and they are drilled constantly as exercises to shape the movements of the fighter. They are the source of what is correct in a martial art both technically and tactically. When we string a few combinations together with little or no thought to what's behind them: whether they follow a theme or not, whether they compliment each other or not, whether endless drilling of our new creation will add any benefit or usefully shape the student; when we do that are we really living up to the cultural heritage passed down to us in our martial arts?

this is one version of the kata i am talking about. now i cant read Chinese but looking at the from one could say that the application of this form would be limited.(Guy grabs your wrists, you defend,,he grabs your wrists again, you defend,,, then again,,, then another guy grabs your wrists...)
it would seem that a this form would not have been created to catalog fighting techniques but rather, has a more internal purpose.
there could possibly be an application but that is not the point of the form. the bunkai is not really needed and if there is a bunkai at all it is only there as a secondary point.

 

[DaveB]

this is one version of the kata i am talking about. now i cant read Chinese but looking at the from one could say that the application of this form would be limited.(Guy grabs your wrists, you defend,,he grabs your wrists again, you defend,,, then again,,, then another guy grabs your wrists...)
it would seem that a this form would not have been created to catalog fighting techniques but rather, has a more internal purpose.
there could possibly be an application but that is not the point of the form. the bunkai is not really needed and if there is a bunkai at all it is only there as a secondary point.

But if you don't know what the form is about why would you want to take elements of it? Would it not be better to go and learn what it is about and it's use before cannibalising it?

I know a version of this form and have studied it a fair amount. I had to do it for a year before moving on to an almost identical second form. Like the Okinawan versions, this form does ingrain the core mechanics of White Crane, but it does also contain some of the core fighting principles and is broken up into training drills designed to work some very important skills.

If anything this form exemplifies what I've been saying. The application (tactics) are intrinsicly based on the mechanical elements, such as correct stance and use of the waist to generate force. Without one the other fails. The applications include attack and defence elements as well as wrist escapes and imbalancing methods. All based on applying those fundamental mechanical skills.

Simple kata are simple so that we look more deeply: if a correctly rooted stance and block is all we do then how can I use those two concepts together to win my fight. How do I hit with the straight thrust minus any fancy entry techniques.

Few applications is distinctly different to no applications.

 

[tshadowchaser]

If you take your favorite 15 self defense techniques and put them together to make a form do they still instill the ideas of the system you study? Do they still maintain the structure of stance and the principles of how to kick and punch. If so you may have created a good form, if not the form is just for show.

 

[hoshin1600]

But if you don't know what the form is about why would you want to take elements of it? Would it not be better to go and learn what it is about and it's use before cannibalising it?

as a note i have been studying sanchin kata for over 20 years. i just picked this one version from youtube because i thought it was a good representation of my thoughts.

I know a version of this form and have studied it a fair amount. I had to do it for a year before moving on to an almost identical second form. Like the Okinawan versions, this form does ingrain the core mechanics of White Crane, but it does also contain some of the core fighting principles and is broken up into training drills designed to work some very important skills.

If anything this form exemplifies what I've been saying. The application (tactics) are intrinsicly based on the mechanical elements, such as correct stance and use of the waist to generate force. Without one the other fails. The applications include attack and defence elements as well as wrist escapes and imbalancing methods. All based on applying those fundamental mechanical skills.

Simple kata are simple so that we look more deeply: if a correctly rooted stance and block is all we do then how can I use those two concepts together to win my fight. How do I hit with the straight thrust minus any fancy entry techniques.

i agree with you. we are in a way saying the same thing. i would have to reply that the definition of bunkai i was thinking of is more narrow. i was only thinking of application as block, kick, punch combinations as a response to a specific attack. in the groups i associate with we use the term bunkai to mean "if the attacker does this then you do that" bunkai is a very heated debate there. so i have a preconceived bias.
i call sanchin a foundational form. like you said it works on structure, lines of force, body mechanics but it also is known to be internal and work on chi flow, chi kung (if you are into that). these things are as you say the foundation for everything else. if someone comes from a style that has this depth you fully understand the importance of this form and how it is to be practiced. on the other hand it has been my experience that there are many other styles and systems that do not have this depth and only think in terms of block, kick, punch and the different ways they can be put together.

 

[ShotoNoob]

At our dojang - for a Dan grading - one of our demo options is creating a form
I created this form for my demo when I tested for 2nd Degree Black Belt in April - the name of the form is 'Dream Authentic'

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What are you trying to accomplish with this form?