Costs of setting up in the UK?

[Oink oink]

Hello people

So if I wanted to hire a couple of instructors, hire a hall a couple nights a week to house 5-10 students what costs would I be looking at? The only costs I'm certain on are hall hire and gloves and pads.

Where do I need to go to find the regulations, licenses and health & safety procedures that I would need to follow to run the classes.

I appreciate any help I can get.

 

[Tez3]

Sorry to answer questions with questions but what sort of hall will you be hiring, who are you teaching, adults only, or children as well. What basis are you hiring the instructors ie will they be self employed or employed by you. Where abouts are you planning on doing this? Sorry as I said but with a bit more info I can help.

 

[Jenna]

What is it specifically you are looking to set up? You are not affiliated to any organisation or particular art? The more specific you are, the more help I imagine you might get..

welcome btw

 

[Oink oink]

Sorry to answer questions with questions but what sort of hall will you be hiring, who are you teaching, adults only, or children as well. What basis are you hiring the instructors ie will they be self employed or employed by you. Where abouts are you planning on doing this? Sorry as I said but with a bit more info I can help.

Yes you're right I should've been more specific.

It will be adults only in a medium sized community hall or anything like that as I assume gym and sports halls cost more.

Regarding the self employed or employed part, which would be more cost effective? I'm assuming I setup as self-employed and employ instructors as self-employed instructors would cost more.

I'm doing this in a large town in Essex

 

[Oink oink]

What is it specifically you are looking to set up? You are not affiliated to any organisation or particular art? The more specific you are, the more help I imagine you might get..

welcome btw

It will be stand up disciplines as I'll be on hard flooring. I'm not affiliated with an organisation, do I need to be?

Where's the place to go to find out about all the rules I need to abide by?

 

[Tez3]

Yes you're right I should've been more specific.

It will be adults only in a medium sized community hall or anything like that as I assume gym and sports halls cost more.

Regarding the self employed or employed part, which would be more cost effective? I'm assuming I setup as self-employed and employ instructors as self-employed instructors would cost more.

I'm doing this in a large town in Essex

If you aren't teaching children you won't need a DBS check though it may depend on what age the youngest is.

No you don't need to affiliated to any organisation, what you will need is insurance, public liability as well as instructor plus your students will need insurance too. There are several martial arts organisations you can get this from, rather than advertise them here lol I can PM you a list.

I'd strongly recommend you have valid first aid certificates for you and your instructors, again if you don't have them there's several places that do the courses.

That's actually all you need to start up, you're obviously aware about needing advertising etc.

If you employ staff you will most likely depending on pay have to pay National Insurance as well as sort out tax, if they are going to earn any significant amount. This tells you how to employ someone Employing staff for the first time - GOV.UK
If you are making it into a business this is useful How To Employ Staff As A Small Business - Expert opinions on UK employment for small businesses

this about whether to employ self employed people or employ them yourself. Should I hire employees or self-employed staff - Real Business


When you get your venue I would do regular risk assessments, check with the staff about fire procedures and any other health and safety issues, it makes you look professional plus saves any issues with students.

One thing you didn't say is why you are doing it, I will warn you there is very little money to be made in just having classes. You may break even and if you sell kit, t shirts, tracksuits etc you may be able to make a small profit.

If you are planning on gradings, the association that does your insurance most likely will do grading books, certificates etc which helps validate them, I'd think about joining a professional organisation, it helps with advertising and again with validity. You may have a problem if you intend to have students compete, this does tend to be by style organisations and hard to get into if you aren't attached to that style's 'ruling' or administrative body unless you have contacts. I'd recommend joining the BCA. The British Combat Association Home of Mixed Practical Martial Arts

 

[Oink oink]

I'll have to be 100% honest as I'm getting a whole host of information some of which is irrelevant to me though I really do appreciate the help.

I'm a Digital Marketer. My job is to get businesses to rank 1 in the local area. As a result of my recent success, I am now looking at starting up small ventures and using my search engine and social media marketing skills to push those ventures forward.

The aim is to play the middleman by bringing the expert to the consumer and making profit on the difference. I understand there's not much money to be made here in martial arts but I wasn't planning on making a living, just a small side income as well as experience in managing small ventures.

Another thing is that the class is going to be a culmination of what I wanted to see during the last 6 years of training in various disciplines. There were some fantastic places, some good places and some not so good places. So I feel I have a good knowledge on what it is the martial arts student is seeking, most people who go to these places are not looking to compete. Therefore the business model is purely self-defence and no competition.

So for me it isn't just a business thing, it's a place I want to go to. Of course the money is more important.

As I open up these ventures I'll be providing part time jobs so there's a satisfaction in that also.

If you could provide me that list I would be grateful. I will look into those links you provided also so thank you for that. I'm going to see if it's better to setup as a company and use it as an umbrella for these ventures so that it's easier to pay tax, insurance, be lawful etc.

 

[Tez3]

Well to be honest I don't think I will provide you will a list, at the time I was dubious because anyone can look up the information I have given. I know it because I've done it but really you seem to be extraordinarily lazy about actually looking to find this information. I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt and see if you are genuinely wanting help but it seems you aren't.

It will be stand up disciplines as I'll be on hard flooring. I'm not affiliated with an organisation, do I need to be?

Where's the place to go to find out about all the rules I need to abide by?

This in reply to Jenna was a very sharp answer, no please or thank you's. then you tell us the information is largely irrelevant to you, well sorry you are on your own mate. If you had 'good knowledge' as you claim you would know everything I posted that was to do with martial arts so unless you are going to pay me or anyone else a consultancy fee I suggest you do your own research.

 

[Oink oink]

Well to be honest I don't think I will provide you will a list, at the time I was dubious because anyone can look up the information I have given. I know it because I've done it but really you seem to be extraordinarily lazy about actually looking to find this information. I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt and see if you are genuinely wanting help but it seems you aren't.



This in reply to Jenna was a very sharp answer, no please or thank you's. then you tell us the information is largely irrelevant to you, well sorry you are on your own mate. If you had 'good knowledge' as you claim you would know everything I posted that was to do with martial arts so unless you are going to pay me or anyone else a consultancy fee I suggest you do your own research.

Never assume. We might miss out on something, as I did.

Having mentioned that I would be grateful for any help in my first post and thanking yourself for the information, I just assumed we would have a common understanding that I appreciate any help I can get. Forums were invented for those who seeked help.

As I assumed people would understand that I was appreciative of the help from the more experienced individuals in society, I didn't feel the need to repeat a please or thank you in every post so forgive me for my ignorance.

I explained why some of the posts were largely irrelevant later on but of course this was my fault for being too vague in the first place. I was surprised to see you get upset at my comment about it being largely irrelevant but again it was my own fault.

I have a particularly unique problem in the sense that there doesn't seem to be a source that talks about what I need in order to pursue this. I think this is because I have spotted a gap in the market. If I was opening up another sports club then it would be easy to find the accreditations needed to teach MMA or Karate, as I had found it easy to get the info.

So after the initial Google browsing I thought it would be a good idea to turn to the niche forums.

You're right I will need to seek professional help for this.

Thank you for your time, but in future you must ensure you are looking at the situation from the other side of the fence rather than assume as I had done.

You have authority in these forums for a very good reason. You're better than the average forum goer.

 

[Tez3]

I don't know what gap in the market you think you have found? There are a lot of martial arts ( just about every style you can think of is being taught out there) being taught out of village, church and community centres all over the country, it's the norm in the UK as leisure and sports centres are expensive to hire. Few have their own buildings. The thing is you don't need any accreditations to teach martial arts here, you can open up anywhere and teach. If people are sensible they will expect to see insurance certificates and something to show you have experience in martial arts but the fact is you could start a class with no knowledge and no insurance. You would however have both of these if you want to run a class successfully.
I was surprised because if you had martial arts experience I would have expected you to know this and it appeared you wanted someone to do your research for you, a not uncommon thing on here, people often want help with school and uni work instead of doing it themselves.
If you look at the BCA site you will see how many instructors are teaching self defence, some of the best in the country are in the BCA, you may want to check no one is teaching around where you plan to. If you contact Dave Turton from there, he has websites, on FB etc, he's easily got hold of he is very generous with advice on things like insurance etc.

for insurance though I'd go with these, we've used them for a long time now with no problems.
HOME - NAKMAS National Governing Body

 

[Oink oink]

I don't know what gap in the market you think you have found? There are a lot of martial arts ( just about every style you can think of is being taught out there) being taught out of village, church and community centres all over the country, it's the norm in the UK as leisure and sports centres are expensive to hire. Few have their own buildings. The thing is you don't need any accreditations to teach martial arts here, you can open up anywhere and teach. If people are sensible they will expect to see insurance certificates and something to show you have experience in martial arts but the fact is you could start a class with no knowledge and no insurance. You would however have both of these if you want to run a class successfully.
I was surprised because if you had martial arts experience I would have expected you to know this and it appeared you wanted someone to do your research for you, a not uncommon thing on here, people often want help with school and uni work instead of doing it themselves.
If you look at the BCA site you will see how many instructors are teaching self defence, some of the best in the country are in the BCA, you may want to check no one is teaching around where you plan to. If you contact Dave Turton from there, he has websites, on FB etc, he's easily got hold of he is very generous with advice on things like insurance etc.

for insurance though I'd go with these, we've used them for a long time now with no problems.
HOME - NAKMAS National Governing Body

When I meant a gap in the market I wasn't referring to a new martial art that hasn't been introduced to the area. I meant a new business module.

I appreciate your help. Thank you.

 

[Tez3]

When I meant a gap in the market I wasn't referring to a new martial art that hasn't been introduced to the area. I meant a new business module.

I appreciate your help. Thank you.

No worries. I didn't think you meant a new martial art but I'd be surprised if you have come up with a new way to do business, martial arts classes have been going here since the late 19th century lol, so good luck.

 

[marques]

@both,
Despite the tone, it was interesting anyway.
And at least in France, Paris(!!) there is actually a gap. The problem is not that is missing some "style", the problem is (in my point of view) the over focus on body and (bad and dangerous) fitness. Then injuries... or fantasies... And what I'm looking for (now) in "Martial Arts" is the mushin... or wu wei... state of mind in a safe, yet realistic and free environment. And who is training in a way that allows it? It was my quest, on&off, last years in Paris...

There are gaps. Or not??

 

[Tez3]

@both,
Despite the tone, it was interesting anyway.
And at least in France, Paris(!!) there is actually a gap. The problem is not that is missing some "style", the problem is (in my point of view) the over focus on body and (bad and dangerous) fitness. Then injuries... or fantasies... And what I'm looking for (now) in "Martial Arts" is the mushin... or wu wei... state of mind in a safe, yet realistic and free environment. And who is training in a way that allows it? It was my quest, part-time and on&off last years in Paris...

There are gaps. Or not??

too far for you but there's this, Mushin Martial Arts - Teaching Karate and Tai Chi in Kingswood Bristol if you look you will find many similar clubs.

The cold wind blowing up Union Street isn't conducive to gentle thoughts I've found

 

[marques]

I think I have not enough freedom in Karate or Tai Chi... first decade, at least. But I will have a look.
I know there are things in Aberdeen. More traditional (TKD, Aikido, Karate...) or MMAs.
I'm closer to MMA, but before the Mushin, I have to accept some sports restrictions, heavy fitness training and take many injuries... :/

And to finish, no mushin in Aberdeen? Gaps.

 

[Jenna]

It will be stand up disciplines as I'll be on hard flooring. I'm not affiliated with an organisation, do I need to be?

Where's the place to go to find out about all the rules I need to abide by?

I think your model sounds interesting.. quirky though. Tez has provided super info, far more than I would know about so I could not add a thing.. I asked about affiliation -you know like each art will have its own governing or umbrella organisation which would possibly save you having to work from the ground up, you could also get info on UK forums relevant to those specific arts or disciplines etc..I just wonder might this have been a simpler route in for you? Just a thought is all

Good luck though.. be interested to know how things develop for you.