Boxing as a Martial Art

[elder999]

No, no. Marciano in modern times.

Once again....

Unless you're saying that Marciano would be "dubious" in the HW division today?

In which case, I dunno....Joe Frazier?Aaron Pryor?Mike Tyson? Gennady Golovkin???

 

[Laplace_demon]

I am saying you only praise guys like Marciano after the fact. It worked for him. At least that's my contention. His opponents were past their prime or mediocre.

 

[elder999]

I am saying you only praise guys like Marciano after the fact. It worked for him. At least that's my contention. His opponents were past their prime or mediocre.

While it's true that he never faced "quality" opponents, and that he had a wild, primitive swinging style (he missed a lot, and better opponents might have capitalized on it) he went undefeated for 49 fights, was hugely popular, and is one of the greatest heavyweights in history by virtue of those things-not to mention making good fights.

Pure defensive boxing, ala Mayweather, does not make for great fights, as evidenced by....well, all of his fights....

 

[drop bear]

That's my point. TMA is not like that to the same degree.

Tma should be judged on function and not form if fighting is considered not a beauty contest.

 

[Laplace_demon]

While it's true that he never faced "quality" opponents, and that he had a wild, primitive swinging style (he missed a lot, and better opponents might have capitalized on it) he went undefeated for 49 fights, was hugely popular, and is one of the greatest heavyweights in history by virtue of those things-not to mention making good fights.

Pure defensive boxing, ala Mayweather, does not make for great fights, as evidenced by....well, all of his fights....

Mayweather is a master class and does not get hit. Anybody complaining about that needs to seriously think things over. Should he adopt his style and lose, simply for the publics sake??!

Intelligent fighters should be praised.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Tma should be judged on function and not form if fighting is considered not a beauty contest.

That's because you wrongly assume you can't have both function and form at the same time.

 

[elder999]

Mayweather is a master class and does not get hit. Anybody complaining about that needs to seriously think things over. Should he adopt his style and lose, simply for the publics sake??!

Intelligent fighters should be praised.

He's really good at what he does-none better. That said, he should be praised, if you haven't fallen asleep before the 12th round....

 

[Laplace_demon]

He's really good at what he does-none better. That said, he should be praised, if you haven't fallen asleep before the 12th round....

I assume you said the same thing about Machida then? Just asking for a bit of consistency.

 

[drop bear]

That's because you wrongly assume you can't have both function and form at the same time.

I would suggest form is a reflection of function.

 

[drop bear]

I assume you said the same thing about Machida then? Just asking for a bit of consistency.

Mohamed Ali was a counter boxer.

 

[elder999]

I assume you said the same thing about Machida then? Just asking for a bit of consistency.

Don't recall ever saying anything about Machida.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Don't recall ever saying anything about Machida.

I am asking if you did. If not, why? Was he anymore entertaining overall. Some of his fights in his prime were often quite strategical and many people complained. I liked him actually. And I like Mayweather too.

 

[elder999]

I am asking if you did. If not, why? Was he anymore entertaining overall. Some of his fights in his prime were often quite strategical and many people complained. I liked him actually. And I like Mayweather too.

I like Machida. The outcome for a "strategic" MMA fight is more likely to be different from boxing, in that there's more potential for the fight to be finished, rather than going to the judges.

 

[Transk53]

Once again....
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Unless you're saying that Marciano would be "dubious" in the HW division today?

In which case, I dunno....Joe Frazier?Aaron Pryor?Mike Tyson? Gennady Golovkin???

Yes the latter would be dubious, unless he has been on extreme weight gain supplements.

 

[elder999]

Yes the latter would be dubious, unless he has been on extreme weight gain supplements.

Dubious as a "heavyweight," certainly, but his (very exciting and successful) fighting style is very much that of an in-fighter....

 

[Transk53]

Dubious as a "heavyweight," certainly, but his (very exciting and successful) fighting style is very much that of an in-fighter....

Oh yeah for sure. The art of shifting not dead. I would really like see a bout live if he ever fought in the UK.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Muhammad Ali was past his prime when George Foreman got nothing and was tired after what, 2 rounds??? I know he disliked the climate where they fought, but still, he didn't accomplish anything against Ali.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Btw, I go crazy over Alis pressconferences and trash talking. He's hilarious. I like that more about him than his actual fighting.

 

[Buka]

Boxing is a specialized style of fighting. It's training is often not pretty and certainly not user friendly, not even a little bit. It's competitive aspect raises the level even more so. The opinions of boxing, and boxers for that matter, vary, from the casual fan, to the serious fan, to the fighters in other arts, and to the people who actually box. I like to listen to the opinions of people who box. At least when it comes to boxing.

As a guy who grew up as a fan of boxing as a wee lad, and grew up as a karate fighter, I had more than a pretty good idea about boxing - and then I boxed. I think it's like watching someone swim before you learned to swim.....you kind of know how the arm movement goes, and what the legs do.

Then there's that God damn water.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Boxing is a specialized style of fighting. It's training is often not pretty and certainly not user friendly, not even a little bit. It's competitive aspect raises the level even more so. The opinions of boxing, and boxers for that matter, vary, from the casual fan, to the serious fan, to the fighters in other arts, and to the people who actually box. I like to listen to the opinions of people who box. At least when it comes to boxing.

As a guy who grew up as a fan of boxing as a wee lad, and grew up as a karate fighter, I had more than a pretty good idea about boxing - and then I boxed. I think it's like watching someone swim before you learned to swim.....you kind of know how the arm movement goes, and what the legs do.

Then there's that God damn water.

Nice. Are you trying to convey that it made you more humble, when you actually boxed? How is that any different though from a boxer thrown into point fighting Karate?