Bj penn UFC 232 (spoilers obviously)

Discussion in 'MMA' started by Headhunter, Dec 30, 2018.

  1. Buka

    Buka Grandmaster

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    FELLAS, let's try and stay polite.

    But a note about that match. I enjoyed Hall's comments afterwards, about wanting to go train with BJ Penn. And about how much he leaned from him watching videos.

    And that was a really nice move.
     
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  2. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    Gordon? Is that you?
     
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  3. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    No one is debating that. Zero relevance to what I said.
     
  4. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    I’ve read it several times without “reacting” to see if I’m missing something.

    Nope. I’m not. You even quoted me quoting you.

    In plain English...

    “...another win for BJJ in MMA.”
    How do you consider this a win for BJJ in MMA? They’re both BJJ guys. It wasn’t karate nor anything else vs BJJ.

    Just because one guy has one flavor of BJJ and the other has another flavor of BJJ doesn’t mean it’s not BJJ vs BJJ. Kyokushin vs Shotokan is still karate vs karate. Penn’s BJJ vs Hall’s BJJ is still BJJ vs BJJ.

    Yup. Another win for BJJ in MMA. You certainly got that right. No one saw a BJJ win coming in this fight. Who would’ve thunk it? I wish I had a time machine so I could go back in time and place a bet on “another win for BJJ in MMA.” I wonder what the Vegas odds were?

    I’m just... I’m just done.
     
  5. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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  6. Headhunter

    Headhunter Senior Master

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    Mayweather just won a boxing match against a kickboxer in Japan.....another win for boxing lol
     
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  7. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    Looks like JR wasn't the only one triggered by my comment.

    Here's another breakdown from Zombieproof;



    Some have noted that Penn messed up by training in the gi over at Nova Uniao and generally focusing on the basics. I tend to agree with that assessment. Also I noticed Firas Zahabi in Ryan Hall's corner. That could explain the variations shown in the Imanari Roll that eventually did Penn in. Coach Zahabi is all about variations and changing things up.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2018
  8. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    Don’t “keep score” of BJJ wins when it’s bjj vs bjj.

    You’re looking for validation that BJJ is the be all end all you make it out to be. A BJJ win against another BJJ guy doesn’t count in your overall stupid BJJ winning stats.

    You didn’t trigger anything. Except the truth.
     
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  9. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    LoL! By all means, find the post where I say that BJJ is the "be all end all".

    Again, you're making arguments that no one made.
     
  10. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    I may be wrong, but I think @Hanzou ’s original comment was more to do with who won and how than who lost. Ryan Hall is a unique talent. I’m not sure his tactics would work against higher level competition, but he brings something different to the table. I can see how that might lead to a comment about it being a win for BJJ. That he beat BJ Penn is relevant only in that Hall caught another high level BJJ guy. If he submitted Penn, it’s not unreasonable to suggest that he would have caught someone less skilled than a guy whose nickname is “the prodigy.”
     
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  11. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    [​IMG]
     
  12. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    It’s impossible to quote nearly every post you’ve ever made.

    You mean I’m the only one who thinks you’re a BJJ fanboy?

    I’m wrong about a lot of $hit. Just ask my wife. But this one’s way too easy, even for a guy like me.
     
  13. Anarax

    Anarax 2nd Black Belt

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    Hall was literally running away or falling to the floor at the first sign of trouble. He wasn't engaging and abandoned any technique he threw at the first sign of being countered.
     
  14. Headhunter

    Headhunter Senior Master

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    Agreed. People say UFC is real as it gets....well throwing yourself on the floor when someone's attacking you is a stupid idea in a real fight...even in Mma it's an awful strategy
     
  15. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    That's not what the stats say:

    Gray Maynard vs. Ryan Hall - The Ultimate Fighter 24 Finale - Fight Statistics - ESPN

    Hall landed more strikes, and more significant strikes, which is how he won the decision. It's not Hall's fault that Maynard didn't want to go to the mat. Since he didn't want to go to the mat, he got kicked instead.
     
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  16. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    Well if that's the case, Maynard shouldn't have bolted in the opposite direction every time Hall butt-scooted towards him.
     
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  17. Anarax

    Anarax 2nd Black Belt

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    It's difficult to land strikes when your opponent is running away and flopping down at the first sign of trouble. I understand Hall wants to win and he exploited the ref for not calling him on flopping/not engaging. However, his plan was one dimensional and silly. Stand up, throw just enough kicks for points(Maynard caught a few of them), flop down when he counters or moves towards me.
     
  18. Anarax

    Anarax 2nd Black Belt

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    If the refs would simply call fighters on that kind of behavior it would make the fights more dynamic.
     
  19. Hanzou

    Hanzou Grandmaster

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    Except falling into guard IS engaging. Not engaging is seeing Hall fall into open guard and backing away like a scared kitten. If I was fighting someone and they fell on their back I would jump on them and bash their face in.

    Unless I was afraid.
     
  20. Anarax

    Anarax 2nd Black Belt

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    No it's not. Hall getting a takedown then utilizing his jujitsu is engaging, getting taken down then utilizing his jujitsu is engaging. Flopping to the ground and running out the clock after scoring a few points isn't engaging.

    Not even close. Maynard was moving in and pressing forward, Hall decided to flop and wait for the round to be over. Maynard was kicking Hall on the ground, hardly the act of a "scared kitten".

    We differ on that approach

    Overall, MMA/UFC has changed many of the rules and some of the Refs are more lenient with non-engagement than others. They need to re-evaluate the rules/octagon culture when the rules are exploited and entire strategies are developed that give way for lackluster performances.
     

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