Being Fit

[seansnyder]

Snippy, are we? FYI, there are many of us that have been reading this thread. My thoughts are the same as Rutherford's regarding already enjoying these benefits.

Dave,

Show me where I stated the above.

Sean Snyder


P.S. Only "snippy" at people who misquote me.

 

[rutherford]

P.S. Only "snippy" at people who misquote me.

Since the quotes are exactly as you type them, I fail to see how you've been misquoted.

Feel free to explain.

 

[lalom]

I'm sorry, but I've tried to read this thread since the beginning and I am having trouble figuring out what is the actual question being discussed. Can anyone paraphrase here?

 

[Don Roley]

My thoughts are the same as Rutherford's regarding already enjoying these benefits.

If you do a lot of correct practice. So I would rather do more taijutsu practice than go to the gym. That will keep me in a shape able to practice taijutsu.

 

[Cryozombie]

I'm sorry, but I've tried to read this thread since the beginning and I am having trouble figuring out what is the actual question being discussed. Can anyone paraphrase here?

I believe that the question is: Is it beneficial to our art to be in shape.

Somehow its turned into a debate between "Strength or No Strength" however.

 

[lalom]

My two cents are that there is a difference in endurance strength and muscular strength. I think that with taijutsu we obviously need endurance strenghtening. Weight training doesn't necessarily produce bulk if that is not what one is trying to do. It all depends on the type of weight training being done.

I don't see how merely doing taijutsu would increase endurance conditioning. And to propogate the notion that no endurance training is necessary or it is of no value is being naive. I think we need a balance of it all. Technique, endurance strenthening, and muscular strengthening (not bulk, ripped abs, protruding muscles like some might misinterpret it to be.)

 

[seansnyder]

My two cents are that there is a difference in endurance strength and muscular strength. I think that with taijutsu we obviously need endurance strenghtening. Weight training doesn't necessarily produce bulk if that is not what one is trying to do. It all depends on the type of weight training being done.

I don't see how merely doing taijutsu would increase endurance conditioning. And to propogate the notion that no endurance training is necessary or it is of no value is being naive. I think we need a balance of it all. Technique, endurance strenthening, and muscular strengthening (not bulk, ripped abs, protruding muscles like some might misinterpret it to be.)

Before I run off at the mouth, let me say where I am coming from:
I have 17 yrs in fitness training, with that said...I have the following under my belt,

1.)Certified personal trainer
2.)amatuer bodybuilder
3.)competative weightlifter
4.)competative powerlifter
5.)budo taijutsu for 11 yrs

so my question, what IS the difference between endurance strengthening and muscular strengthening? Just curious......

Sean Snyder

P.S. I agree with you on weight training doesn't necessarily produce bulk. You are very correct on WHAT type of training, not neccessarily WEIGHT training. I can do yoga and gain strength without bulk.

 

[seansnyder]

If you do a lot of correct practice. So I would rather do more taijutsu practice than go to the gym. That will keep me in a shape able to practice taijutsu.

So taijutsu has become somewhat of a "Billy Blanks" Tai Boxing????
I do not believe our art will keep you in shape. I have seen and trained with many that ARE NOT in shape. (Please keep in mind, I have not stated all shihan or budo practitioners are out of shape.)

So Don, are the people out there out of shape doing it wrong. They are not doing "correct practice". Just curious.....


-sean

 

[Don Roley]

I don't see how merely doing taijutsu would increase endurance conditioning.

Do lots of it and in low stances. Also, long walks is what Hatsumi has reccomended. For me, that also includes going up mountains from time to time.

I also do things like never using the car to go to work- only my bike unless it is typhoon season.

 

[Don Roley]

So Don, are the people out there out shape doing it wrong. They are not doing "correct practice". Just curious.....

If they are fat, it is proabably a simple matter of too much calories in and not enough using of the body.

 

[seansnyder]

How important is it for a martial artist to be in shape? Just Curious.

So back to the original question, if the only thing you can create is kukan around a cheeseburger......then you have problems!!!!:cheers:

You have to be in somewhat shape just to survive in today's world. I come into contact with alot of people everyday from every walk of life. And some of them haven't "walked a day in their life". So to answer your question, you need to be in shape. If you are taking this art to take care of yourself, you need to TAKE CARE of yourself prior to taking this art. Make sense? May all your decisions be good ones........


-sean

P.S. By in shape, I don't mean just a beer gut.(So all of you out there with the "keg" hanging off ya, don't be offended) If you have problems existing in everyday life due to your current condition(out of breath walking to the bathroom), you will have problems in our art. (IMO)

 

[Don Roley]

So back to the original question, if the only thing you can create is kukan around a cheeseburger......then you have problems!!!!:cheers:

You know, I really dislike the way people like you seem to always try to make the other side sound like we are fat slobs that only want to eat cheeseburgers and watch tv.

People need to be healthy. They can be in standard health to practice and get good at this art. The idea of this art is to live long enough to die in bed. There are comments from Hatsumi that you should eat and live healthy.

There is no great need to be anything other than of standard health to practice this art. There are many people in Japan of advanced age that are not paragons of health and strength and yet are feared for their skills.

 

[Seattletcj]

Yes I have been reading the posts. I will not shoot back any rudeness at you in turn. But I will point out something you wrote as recently as post #87.

What part of asking for a direct anwser is rude?
Back to the topic....



I will repeat one of my questions because it got lost somewhere in the conversation. Do you believe that having an above minimal fitness level (where minimal is defined as being able to stand upright and move the legs and arms.) can have a positive effect on ones Budo Taijutsu ?
If the anwser is yes, then what is the problem with creating a positive effect in ones Budo Taijutsu? (It is also assumed that an above minimal fitness level does not = increased muscle mass)


Listed below are some interesting articles based on objective research. ....FYI these are just a handful of articles on the subject, there are THOUSANDS more...

http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/0701.htm

http://www.alinenewton.com/pdf-articles/core.htm

http://www.fitplan.com/report/corestabathleticperf.html

http://umanitoba.fitdv.com/new/articles/article.html?artid=128

http://www.ascentphysicaltherapy.com/stretch.htm

 

[Don Roley]

I will repeat one of my questions because it got lost somewhere in the conversation. Do you believe that having an above minimal fitness level (where minimal is defined as being able to stand upright and move the legs and arms.) can have a positive effect on ones Budo Taijutsu ?
If the anwser is yes, then what is the problem with creating a positive effect in ones Budo Taijutsu? (It is also assumed that an above minimal fitness level does not = increased muscle mass)

As I said before, the real question is whether concentrating on conditioning would be more of a hindrence than a help should be the first question.

Really, I would rather have more money to help raise my kids. But to drop that into a debate about taking a job that would keep me away from my kids for years is roughly the same type of thing I am seeing here. The primary thing we should be concentrating on is getting better at taijutsu. If we had found that no one at any time has ever gotten into the trap of relying on strength rather than developing good skills then the next question should be the ones you ask above.

 

[Seattletcj]

I guess if someone spent more time conditioning then training then I would have to agree with you. The truth is, it does not really take that much time to do some simple conditioning exercises. And you dont even have to go to the gym. You just need to be motivated to do it, and fit it in to your day a few times a week. The motivation usually comes from education/understanding.

I have spent alot (too much) of time here TALKING about martial arts and conditioning, when I could have been DOING them. Here is that time I was just talking about. In the time I spent typing and straining my neck, I could have been doing some exercises.
It just boils down to what your priorities are, how much you wish to improve yourself, and how much you are willing to invest in that improvement.

Good luck and thanks for the conversation.

 

[Cryozombie]

I
I have spent alot (too much) of time here TALKING about martial arts and conditioning, when I could have been DOING them. Here is that time I was just talking about. In the time I spent typing and straining my neck, I could have been doing some exercises.

I'm gonna say "bah" to that as well, because it implies that 24 hours a day should be spent working out. At some point I would say enough is enough.

Today, for example, in addition to the physical aspects of my job (I climb buildings, ladders and towers) I ran 1/2 a mile, (and I dont mean Jogged) Did a 20 minute powerwalk, and pushups, squats, and curls with handweights.

So I should be working out more now instead of drinking a beer with friends and hanging out online? No thanks...

BTW... and this is gonna sound SOOOO bad... but I mean it in a serious way...

what do you all think of sex as excercise? Is it, or isnt it, a good cardio activity?

 

[lalom]

so my question, what IS the difference between endurance strengthening and muscular strengthening? Just curious......

If you've seen me in person (heh heh), you will obviously conclude that I do not have the qualifications you do so please excuse me for being ignorant. I only meant to share my opinion. What I mean by muscular strengthening, I guess, might be more adequately termed toning? I'm not sure of the proper terminology so forgive me. I can see where toning is gaining some element of strength without bulk. Endurance, on the other hand, to me, would be more being more able to persevere by keeping one's wits, not breathing hard, and basically having longevity. Maybe it's all the same and I'm sure you can clear that up.

I guess what I'm saying is I don't think taking an occasional walk will build that endurance. Endurance is something that I feel has to always be "stretched" and "pushed" at greater lengths to be improved. Swimming is another way to build endurance. Yet come to think of it that would also make one more toned... Boy! Now I'm confused! I do see your point in that some are misconstruing strength for having a body like the governator Arnold. Strength isn't solely bulk. I'll stop here cuz I'm rambling!

 

[Cryozombie]

So you mean the difference between Strength Training, and Endurance training, not building endurance strength...

 

[lalom]

Yes? Endurance training does build endurance strength doesn't it? With my lack of proper terminology in all this fitness talk, one might guess I'm one of those lazy, cheeseburger eating, football watching couch potatoes Don Roley seems to be mentioning! LOL Actually I am overweight, but I'm not that bad... I think...

 

[Blotan Hunka]

1 hour a day 3 days a week, that can get you in excellent shape...most of us can probably trim that off our internet time and have a place for exercise. Time is no excuse.