Assault Weapons Ban

[AnimEdge]

The Assualt Weapons Ban is gone or will be gone in the next few days what is everyones view on this?

I think people are greatly over reacting on the AWB becouse they do not understand it, im tired of people on the news saying that people can now buy AK-47 at there local wal-mart(joke) and the police are afraid of the ban being lifitd, they use the 47 as a example becouse it is one of the most widly use automatic weapon used around the world, but they dont tell you the ones normally being used(mind you Assualt weapon crimes are way in the minority)
in the states the ones that are being sold are Semi-Automatic, they are not fully automatic(the ones you can legally buy) there is a law agenst automatic(aka machine guns) sence the 1930s that law states that no one can own a weapon that shoots more than 3 rounds a pull of the trigger. And people are freaking out that people can by a semi-automatic(notice that sence this whole talks about AWB i only heard one person state that these are the Semi on the news) ak-47

The AWB is only about the add-ons you can get on a gun, the ban never stoped anyone from geting a ak-47 during the ban, just teh extra stuff you can put on it, like certain grips for a shotgun, foldable stocks, flash compressors, and longer clips. there is no never was a ban on the guns just the accessorys that go to it.

The weapons even fully "Assualted Out" work the same as they did before, they are the same weapon just with "Assualt" Add-ons, like for a shot gun before you could only by one with a sholder stock, now you can buy them with a pistol grip, the only diffrence? its the same weapon but now it can be concealed easyer and is more moble, the ak-47 with there assult ad-ons? the flash compressor? all that does is make the flash of the mussle not so bright to make you not so flash blinded at night and to make you less noticable, pistols? you can now get them with longer clips, the foldable stocks that can now be bought? they just allow for the weapon to be conseled easly, tehre is nothing about the actual weapon is changed.

Now about the actuall ban being lifted, i personaly dont care if its lifted or reinstated, i dont care about having a flash compressor or a pistol grip for my shotgun, the only thing the lift in teh ban helps are the collectors and gun owners who want this and the bad guys who also want them, doesnt really help teh cops any to not have this ban, and will probly be more helpfull to the cops to have it reinstated, so if i had to vote on weather or not to have the ban reinstated, i would vote for it, the add-obns have nothing to do but for cosmetic and concelment, this makes it easyer for crimnals and others to hind a shotgun or whatever with them and so for the law inforcments sake i think it shoudl be reinstated, but dont expect me to protest for it cuz over all i dont care weather or not its banned

Im just tired of the news saying that soon people will start running around the streets with automatic weapons(though they never call it automatic they use the term assualt whitch confuses people i mean if some one came up to you and yell "He has a assualt rifle!" wouldnt you think a fully automatic machine gun? or a normal rifle with a flash compressor? this is why i dislike the media)
ugh

 

[DeLamar.J]

Its funny how they ban full auto, that way criminals are forced to shoot more accurately and conserve ammo instead of spraying out all of it :mp5: :boing2:

 

[OULobo]

doesnt really help teh cops any to not have this ban, and will probly be more helpfull to the cops to have it reinstated, so if i had to vote on weather or not to have the ban reinstated, i would vote for it, the add-obns have nothing to do but for cosmetic and concelment, this makes it easyer for crimnals and others to hind a shotgun or whatever with them and so for the law inforcments sake i think it shoudl be reinstated, but dont expect me to protest for it cuz over all i dont care weather or not its banned

Just a comment, but shouldn't we take the average law enforcement officer's opinion to make the decision on whether it is helpful to them or not. The majority of LEOs state that the ban had no effect on making their jobs easier, the only desenting opinons came from polititians in uniform.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

My understanding is that it only banned a few parts, and it's continued existance isn't a help.

Most items covered by it were already covered under other laws, so it was little more than a political redundancy.

 

[loki09789]

My understanding is that it only banned a few parts, and it's continued existance isn't a help.

Most items covered by it were already covered under other laws, so it was little more than a political redundancy.

The general firearms community saw it as political 'feel good' legislative action that people could point to and claim that they were doing something about the 'gun problem' in America.

It was cosmetic, and as Bob mentioned it was redundancy.

Generally speaking, I think the issue should be real application of the legal process instead of lip service. If you actual enforce the laws in place, things would be better than they are now. Not perfect by any means but better.

My thing is that whether the gun 'looks' mean or not, it can kill. AW's aren't the problem as they stay at civilian/manufacture specs. The control issue should be on the after manufacturer tweeks that are possible because the parts and engineering isn't watched nearly as closely as that cruel looking M16 on the shelf.

Control and regulate and ENFORCE ammo capacity, manufacturer parts that can make a legal gun illegal and things would be better.

In the end though most of the 'illegal' activity that involve firearms are not being done with sophisticated or expensive market weapons. It is generally done with cheap throw away small caliber hand guns.

The California "Heat Hit" isn't the norm.

 

[dearnis.com]

As an LEO I don't see any benefit to legislation that restricts the personal liberty of decent people. As a citizen I am disgusted by legislation that erodes basic rights.

 

[Tgace]

As an LEO I don't see any benefit to legislation that restricts the personal liberty of decent people. As a citizen I am disgusted by legislation that erodes basic rights.

Some folks are worried about LEO's expressing this. Check....
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17257

What do you think about the issue of the Brass saying one thing and the Patrolmen saying another??

 

[Cruentus]

As an LEO I don't see any benefit to legislation that restricts the personal liberty of decent people. As a citizen I am disgusted by legislation that erodes basic rights.

*whistles*

A-men Chad...

Paul

 

[dearnis.com]

Where to begin....
I stopped even trying to discuss 2nd Ammedment issues here. Some of our more "anti" members leave me at a loss that supposedly thinking folks can arrive at such disturbingly wrong positions.
The national FOP has endorsed Bush; The IACP and other organizations are basically stooge groups for the Brady/Shumer/Feinstein/Clinton crew. I cant really comment on the politics where I am; suffice it to say that the positions and actions of some hereabouts have led me to cut a few extra checks to the NRA this month.
My room mate is an academy classmate of mine; like many cops she did not shoot prior to the academy, and is not very well informed on the issue. To her credit, she was able to admit this and actually ask what the ban was about. She got it when I demonstrated that my Garand has several ban features that my post-ban (soon to be a post-sunset :mp5: ) bushmaster lacks.
The big mistake was claiming that the ban was do-nothing feel-good legislation. It was not. It was a stepping stone. The very term semi-automatic assault weapon is a lie. Note: not a misnomer; a lie. If anyone seriously believes that the die-hard gun ban advocates will stop short of creating the same weapons-free paradise that exists in the UK and in Australia think again.
The Brass play politics; they have to. If you look at the NRA F-rated elected officials of my home state you can guess what the local politics are like.

 

[Tgace]

Yeah, your right about the "stepping stone" point. A little emotional blather on my part there . It just upsets me that people will call us "Jackboots" for enforcing laws they dont like, and accuse us of being "the enemy" if we complain about laws they do like.

 

[GAB]

Hi,
This Ban had little to do, or nothing to do, in regards to the state of California.

I was talking about it the other day, not getting much input from anyone here in the land of Gun Control, and any other type of control you can think of, with not much of it working very well at that.

Actually California is really a separate country in regards to the rest of the US.
With the New Gov, I can see us trying to get something on the ballot, to have CA. named a different country. With the Gov being the King. Very convoluted at this point in time.

The Republicans are trying to kill our economy and we have very little respect for the rest of the US, especially when it comes to citizens rights, we are way ahead of the rest of the country. We are truly socialist, or trying to be. IMO.

I am not saying that is what I want or don't want, it is just an observation.

Sort of like British Columbia in Canada.

Regards, Gary

 

[dearnis.com]

It just upsets me that people will call us "Jackboots" for enforcing laws they dont like, and accuse us of being "the enemy" if we complain about laws they do like.

Frustrating at times. Few people are ever happy to see us, that is for sure. Well, my consolation prizes this week: 1) AWB sunset (that gets shared with all my friends 2) My office back (the TDY people are gone!!!) 3) 6 years completed, only 14 to go and 4) Award from the state for doing the most on my department to improve highway saftey in the last year.
I may by a new upper to celebrate!

 

[Cruentus]

Frustrating at times. Few people are ever happy to see us, that is for sure. Well, my consolation prizes this week: 1) AWB sunset (that gets shared with all my friends 2) My office back (the TDY people are gone!!!) 3) 6 years completed, only 14 to go and 4) Award from the state for doing the most on my department to improve highway saftey in the last year.
I may by a new upper to celebrate!

Oh Chad...that's not just a bannana in my pocket...I am always happy to see you! :rofl:

 

[GarethB]

If anyone seriously believes that the die-hard gun ban advocates will stop short of creating the same weapons-free paradise that exists in the UK and in Australia think again.
The Brass play politics; they have to. If you look at the NRA F-rated elected officials of my home state you can guess what the local politics are like.

Just a clarification. Australia is not the "weapons-free" paradise you're thinking of. Yes, firearms are highly regulated and restricted, but it's still possible to legally buy and use shotguns, rifles and handguns here, although the list of allowable firearms has been shrinking. Maybe we'll become another weapons-free nation like the UK and Japan, but I genuinely hope not.

 

[Gaidheal]

Neither Japan nor the UK are "weapons-free" ;¬)

Please at least be accurate if you want to rant! I rant occasionally about our (UK) restrictions on firearm ownership too, but if you want to, get it right.

For the record.. it is perfectly possible to own and use shotguns, but you better not try it for self-defence (vide: Tony Martin). Pistols are no longer legal in civilian hands unless de-activated, to all intensive purposes. I believe there are a few small exceptions, but not for J Random Punter. Ownership of even de-activated firearms is CLOSELY monitored, although inevitably stuff gets by the system and it starts a whole new media storm every so often. Rifles are basically also illegal in civilian hands. No .303 hunting rifles here, pretty much. Again, I think it is possible to be excepted, but not as a J Random Punter. Automatic weapons of any kind are outlawed and shotguns may not be able to hold more than 3 rounds at once. No more 10-round pump-action sports shooters...

In short, you can apply for a shotgun licence, pay your money, a check will be run on you and so long as you don't have a history of mental illness, violent/serious crime you will be granted it. At that point you can purchase a shotgun which will either be a 2-round sports type or a 3-round pump-action. They do have minimum barrel lengths and no folding stocks / pistol grips and there are restrictions on how you store the gun and ammunition - i.e. it must be securely stored and not kept loaded, etc, etc.

It used to be pretty much the same drill for pistols, but Dunblane changed that once and for all. Hungerford had already led to severe changes, e.g. the shotgun limitations, increased restrictions on pistol calibres and banning of rifles and all automatics, as I recall...

But UK is far from "weapons-free" people are just much less scared of each other and thus the number of incidents involving any kind of weapon at all is far lower than in the USA. This is true of Canada too, though, which still has easy access to pretty much all the same guns the USA does...

Japan has civilian gun ownership as well, but I don't claim to be an expert on the ins and outs so I shall leave that one alone.

John

 

[Tgace]

I think Canada has strictly limited weapon ownership lately. Flatlander can expand on that better than I.

 

[Flatlander]

Indeed, I can.....


From the Canadian Firearms Act:

7. (1) An individual is eligible to hold a licence only if the individual

(a) successfully completes the Canadian Firearms Safety Course, as given by an instructor who is designated by a chief firearms officer, and passes the tests, as administered by an instructor who is designated by a chief firearms officer, that form part of that Course;

(b) except in the case of an individual who is less than eighteen years old, passes the tests, as administered by an instructor who is designated by a chief firearms officer, that form part of that Course;

(c) successfully completed, before January 1, 1995, a course that the attorney general of the province in which the course was given had, during the period beginning on January 1, 1993 and ending on December 31, 1994, approved for the purposes of section 106 of the former Act; or

(d) passed, before January 1, 1995, a test that the attorney general of the province in which the test was administered had, during the period beginning on January 1, 1993 and ending on December 31, 1994, approved for the purposes of section 106 of the former Act.

From Canadian Criminal Code

"prohibited firearm" means

(a) a handgun that

(i) has a barrel equal to or less than 105 mm in length, or

(ii) is designed or adapted to discharge a 25 or 32 calibre cartridge,

but does not include any such handgun that is prescribed, where the handgun is for use in international sporting competitions governed by the rules of the International Shooting Union,

(b) a firearm that is adapted from a rifle or shotgun, whether by sawing, cutting or any other alteration, and that, as so adapted,

(i) is less than 660 mm in length, or

(ii) is 660 mm or greater in length and has a barrel less than 457 mm in length,

(c) an automatic firearm, whether or not it has been altered to discharge only one projectile with one pressure of the trigger, or

(d) any firearm that is prescribed to be a prohibited firearm;

This doesn't really give the whole story.....

Essentially, in order to procure and possess a weapon, you must first obtain a firearms aquisition certificate. This will involve getting a criminal record check done, and the process takes a loooong time (government beaurocracy ).

In order to own a handgun, one must be a member of a "gun club" (sport shooter's club). There are heavy restrictions on storage and transportation, everything's got to be broken down and locked up, ammo separate, etc.

Only ON DUTY police may carry.

The only time your rifle may be in public is when you are actively hunting with it - once again heavy restrictions on transportation and storage.

It's all rather strict.

 

[dearnis.com]

But UK is far from "weapons-free" people are just much less scared of each other and thus the number of incidents involving any kind of weapon at all is far lower than in the USA. This is true of Canada too, though, which still has easy access to pretty much all the same guns the USA does...

It is my understanding that firearms-related crime in the UK has risen steeply in recent years...accurate??

On the topic I have been having a little "post-AWB" celebration here for the last 2 weeks; I'll post a few pics when I have time.

 

[Flatlander]

This is true of Canada too, though, which still has easy access to pretty much all the same guns the USA does...

Nope, sorry. This is just plain wrong. A Canadian essentially needs to be able to prove they won't commit a weapons offence before they will be granted an FAC. Handguns may only be owned for sporting purposes, and this must be demonstrated before you get a permit.

Fully automatic weapons are comprehensively illegal, as are modified shotguns (sawed off).

Of course, what you can get on the street is another story, but my understanding is that we are discussing that which lies within the realm of legal acquisition.

 

[Gaidheal]

I said nothing to the contrary ;¬)

Seems I may (erring on the generous side) have been ambiguous.....

In any case, the comment refers to the per capita deaths by weapons, especially guns.

John