Another wake up for Chinese Martial Arts

Discussion in 'Beginners Corner' started by JowGaWolf, May 23, 2017.

  1. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    They train to that specific sort of fighting, yes, but the overlap is huge.

    Anyway, if you think any system is going to realistically prepare you for armed/multiple opponents, you should probably rethink that before it gets you hurt or killed. The only solution to those two situations is either gun-fu or run-fu.
     
  2. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    well that's not true either, unless you can actually prove that people who have never had a fight before all way loosecto those that have. I won my very first fight against an experienced fighter, I was 7 and he had beaten up every other kid in the class, before he started on me
     
  3. Midnight-shadow

    Midnight-shadow 3rd Black Belt

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    That's exactly what you were implying when you said that MMA prepares you for "real world" fighting, unless I completely misread what you put.
     
  4. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    All I can say is that if you have beliefs you haven't tested, especially as it regards your personal safety, you also have an exploitable weakness, and perhaps..as 'Master Wong' might say - "Beeg Problem" in the future.
     
  5. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    There are elements that are missed if you don't train full contact though. Energy management is one (although you could swap that for wrestling)

    Learning to punch hard with timing is one.

    The balance changes a bit.

    And some techniques are better full contact. Like head kicks which are pretty useless if you can brush them off with one hand. But pretty good if they put the guy in danger of a broken skull.
     
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  6. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    Mma training prepares you for mma, which is a pretty close aproximation of 1 v 1 fighting, and I dare say prepares you for your multiple/armed scenario as much as anything else will, aside from maybe a firearms course.

    Now this isn't because those systems..mostly mt boxing and BJJ are the only viable systems..because I don't believe that at all. It's because they train for the job they intend to do.
     
  7. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    No. That is an implication made by people who have never been gang bashed.

    There is no training that will make it safe to go up against a bunch of guys.
     
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  8. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    I think this is a pretty solid summation. I appreciate that you acknowledge what MMA is and isn't. What it does teach and where it stops. Both are very important things to know.
     
  9. Midnight-shadow

    Midnight-shadow 3rd Black Belt

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    And this is precisely the problem. A lot of people seem to have to impression that training for MMA ring fights is the same as preparing for "real world" fighting when this is far from the truth. I always find it amusing whenever someone says things like "x isn't real, they should do MMA instead" as if MMA is a true example of "real world" fighting.

    Who's more delusional in all of this? The TMA practitioners who think that waving their arms around constitutes fighting, or the MMA guys who think they can take on the world just because they won a fight 1v1 where there were rules and a referee in place?
     
  10. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    if you were putting forward an argument that a good level mma fighter would beat most other martial artist, you may have a point, but your stance that other martial are useless against attack is something of a mute point, it rather depends who is attacking you, how big strong they are and if they have friends and how drunk anyone is
     
  11. Steve

    Steve Mostly Harmless

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    It's a moment of clarity when folks realize that none of it is "real." It's all different pieces of a giant puzzle working from the edges to the middle. Cops have a piece. Bouncers have a piece. MMAists have a piece. Some pieces are larger than others, but no one has it all. And if someone claims to, run away very quickly.

    It's just as amusing to me when people say they teach real world self defense because it (whatever "it" is) works for cops.
     
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  12. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    Who's stance? I said no such thing. In fact, I explicitly stated that I do not believe that.

    Come again?
     
  13. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    real world fights, really, do you train fighting with broken bottles. Most of my real world fights have involved one or both having an improvised weapon, I like to see you take someone to the floor whilst your having your spine lacerated
     
  14. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    ok arts that don't do live fighting are useless, that is your point isn't it. If not then I have no idea what you are tattling on about
     
  15. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    This isn't a good argument though. Introduce weapons, all things being equal, the guy with viable training still wins.
     
  16. Midnight-shadow

    Midnight-shadow 3rd Black Belt

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    It's amazing how people's perceptions change when faced with the real thing as opposed to training or a simulation. As a lifeguard I have to do monthly training to keep my skills up to scratch, and I train with a lot of other people, many of whom have never had to use their skills in a real situation before. There was 1 person in particular who was very confident in their abilities, and excelled in training. Then 1 day we had a real incident where a young girl swam out of her depth and couldn't stay afloat. The confident lifeguard jumped in to save them, and got smacked in the face for their trouble while trying to save this kid. It was quite the reality check for them let me tell you and from then on they made sure to pay more attention during the training sessions.
     
  17. Martial D

    Martial D Senior Master

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    I said schools, not arts. While not all arts, or styles, are equally viable, more important is how they are trained.
     
  18. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    The guy who actually fought someone. MMA is training for the real world to the level you can realistically expect one person to achieve.

    The fantasy is the expectation that training for the real world includes training to handle 5 guys.

    Why would you think any training should be expected to handle that?
     
  19. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Pretty sure having your spine lacerated is a counter to most defensive techniques up to and including shooting people.
     
  20. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    its a good argument round here, because its like that. Real world fight have weapons,123
     

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