Ranking Systems

[TallAdam85]

Hello

I want to find out what people think about schools that don't have the white, orange, green, red belt system. Do you feel that the tsd that have different belt system is wrong.
And How does your belt system work?

[TallAdam85]

White 10 gup
Yellow 9 gup
Purple 8 gup
Orange 7 gup
Green 6 gup
Green/stripe 5 gup
Blue 4 gup
Brown 3 gup
Brown /Stripe 2nd gup
Brown with 2 stripes 1 gup

[karatekid1975]

When I did TSD, it went like this:

white
orange
green
blue
brown
purple
red (two grades of red)
midnight blue
black

The kids had a different ranking system than adults, but I don't remember what it was. I know we (adults) skipped yellow (in between white and orange). The kids had two or three more belts than the adults.

My school now (which is similar to TSD) goes like this:

white
yellow
orange
green
purple
blue
brown
red
probationary BB (black belt with white stripe through it)
black

The ranks at different schools isn't "wrong" just different. Every school and style do their own thing. I think the WTF (TKD) are the only ones that are pretty much the same.

[TallAdam85]

I am just wondering what does TKD MDK mean I know tae kwon do but what is the mdk and how old are you? Just Wondering

[karatekid1975]

It's Tae Kwon Do Moo Duk Kwan. It is very similar to TSD, as far as techniques go, and training. We also do TSD forms at higher ranks. I'm 28.

i've seen many schools do it different. even schools that break off from a federation do things different. a belt color is just a guide for your training, so i guess you can have as many colors as you want. i feel that they should mean something to the student though.

here are mine.

shotokan:

white, yellow, orange, blue, green, purple, brown, black


1st TSD school:

white, orange, green, brown, red, blue, black


my current TSD school:

white, orange, green, red, midnight blue

some colors have degrees within them before you get to the next colored belt level.

Our ranks go:

White
Yellow
Yellow w/ Green Tips
Green
Green w/ Blue Tips
Blue
Blue w/Brown Tips
Brown
Red w/ White Stripe
Red
Black w/ White Stripe (probationary black)
Black 1st Dan

Old School.

White.
Purple.
Green.
Red.
Midnight Blue.

First....there is no such animal as TKD MDK or MDK TKD.....if you were told that...you were told so in ignorance. MDK is Hwang Kee's school....and he never abdicated, reisgned or was removed as the Kwan Jang...no matter what somone may have told you. He died as the Kwan Jang and passed the school onto his son Hwang Hyung Chul.....and he NEVER was part of TKD.

The MDK colors used in Korea were:

yellow, green, red, midnightblue and midnightblue w/red center.

OH...by the way....there is no more MDK TSD either. In 1995 Hwang Kee formally and officially changed the name of the art taught by the Moo Duk Kwan to Soo Bahk Do.

[karatekid1975]

My GM trained under Kwang Kee in TSD (if you want proof, I'll give it to you ). Somewhere along the lines, he split (might of been when some of the TSD people crossed over). He kept all the TSD forms, till recently. He dropped the pyung forms and added the taegeuk forms (last 20 years or so, I think). I think that's the way it was explained. But we still do the TSD MDK forms after black belt (except the pyung forms).

I don't mean to sound mean, but I'd like to know where you get your info. Just curious. I'm not trying to start a flame war, but I just like to know

Uh...from Hwang Kee himself.....the U.S. Soo Bahk Do Moo Duk Kwan Federation....Dae Han Soo Bahk Do Hoi Moo Duk Kwan....and all the historical records of evidence.

Look....I know there have been lots of TKD people who had a lineage back to the MDK and Hwang Kee....but the truth...not the propoganda....is that Hwang Kee founded the MDK, maintained the MDK, retained the MDK and passed away as the leader of the MDK. He never participated nor authorized anyone to represent the MDK in participation of the Kwon unification or the Tae Kwon Do movement. Those are the facts. I'm not grasping this stuff out of thin air...and I'm not trying to sell anything. I'm not a member of the MDK and haven't been since I left in 1986. But it is time we called things what they really are...and anyone that tells you there is a MDK TKD is just blowing smoke at you trying to authenticate and validate what they are doing on the coat tails of Hwang Kee and the Moo Duk Kwan. It isn't about paying homage to Hwang Kee...and it isn't about honoring their roots....because it was not what Hwang Kee wanted. In 1995 he offered an olive branch to the breakaways that created the so called MDK TKD...but if you do your history....they had to change their name to Moo Duk Hoi back in the 70's. Why? Because Hwang Kee was recognized as the sole owner to the name Moo Duk Kwan....and he didn't give that up...ever. Even in his later years when he wanted to make peace between the TSD and TKD factions....he still did not authorize nor endorse any group of TKD practitioners to use the name Moo Duk Kwan. These are the facts. You can confront your instructors about this if you want to...but I'd venture to guess they will deny, dodge or just get mad and will still not give you a satisfactory response to the information and questions. Why? Because to do so would be to admit they are doing something that isn't quite ethical......borrowing the name of someone's school without authorization.

JH

[mtabone]

I had a feeling when I read "Teacher" and location : Kentucky that it would be you sir.


I was wondering when you would find your way to this board


We even have our freind here Master Clay


Let the party begin.


TANG SOO!! MASTER JH.

M.Tabone

John Hancock and Frank Clay together again.
Two of the Four Horsemen have arrived...

[Mithios]

There is M.D.K. T.K.D. ! Around 1965 the Korean gov. Started certifing black belt's and a majority of M.D.K. instructor's Changed to T.K.D. But kept the M.D.K. Name and tradition's. They still taught M.D.K. T.S.D. The only thing different was the name T.K.D. Some still teach the M.D.K. T.S.D. form's now and some teach a mixture of T.S.D. and T.K.D. forms. But they all consider them selves M.D.K. The M.D.K. T.K.D. group is still headquartered in Korea to this day ( the Moo Duk Hoi ) They were not endorsed by Hwang Kee, but if they actually keep the tradition of the M.D.K. alive and recognize Hwang kee as the M.D.K. founder Then i think they can still say they are M.D.K. ( politic's aside) There are some M.D.K. T.K.D. school's that are more M.D.K. than a lot of the M.D.K. T.S.D. school's. The Moo Duk Hoi founder's had dan bong #'s with in M.D.K. and actually trained under Hwang Kee. I personally think that ought to count for something !!!!!! Peace, MITHIOS

The Moo DUk Hoi is NOT the Moo Duk Kwan. All the sophistry aside....if you leave the Kwan....you are out of the Kwan....and you don't get to use the Kwan name. Look...if you work for IBM and leave to start your own company...you don't get to put IBM on your products even if your company is a carbon copy of IBM and all your information, training and procedures were 'borrowed' from them. Why you martial artists...especially those in Korean arts...insist on laying claim to things that are not legitimately yours...I'll never understand. I'd think you'd have more pride. If you want to stand on your own two feet then do it and stop trying to 'name drop' to ...in some perverted manner....validate yourself. THERE IS NOT MDK TKD. The Heaven's Gate People thought Hale-Bopp was a Star Ship coming to take them home. The fact they used a real event to base their insane ideas on doesn't make them palpatable to intelligent people nor does it in any way validate their ludicrous point of view. The same is true of all these MDK TKD people. Give it up! No such animal really exists! Get some self esteem and stop using the name MDK to boister your sense of self worth!

JH