Chin Na

[scottcatchot]

I was wondering if anyone had any info concerning Chin Na? I have heard it called White tiger or White Dragon. I have even been told it was a founding factor in Aikido. I am curious and any info would be appreciated.

Scott

[clfsean]

Qin Na (Kum La) is found in almost every CMA out there. It's integral in CMA fighting theory & methodology.

What CMA are you practicing?

[scottcatchot]

I am looking into starting Shaolin Kempo, The instructer made references to Chin Na and I wanted to look more into what it was.

[clfsean]

Oh... ok...

Bottom line is that Qin Na is found in all TCMA.

Much more than that & I'm just avoiding a flame fest.

[arnisador]

Chin Na is indeed found in many, and indeed I would say in most, styles of Kung Fu. It is not common to see it practiced independent of some more general art. Loosely speaking, it can be compared to jujutsu--mostly standing grappling based on joint locks. (Of course, this is an oversimplification.) You'll find books on it at your local bookstore.

[Flying Crane]

I'll give it a go.

My understanding of Chin-Na is that it focuses on joint manipulation techniques, rather than kicking and punching techniques (altho these techniques may be combined with Chin-Na in application). So the finger-locks, wrist-locks, arm-bars, shoulder locks, etc. that are found in Chinese arts are part of the body of Chin-na. Most Chinese arts have these techniques to some degree or other. Some focus on these techs alot, others not so much.

I have heard it said that Chinese Chin-Na is the foundation and origin of arts in Japan that use similar techniques, like Jujitsu and Aikido. This may be true but I am not advocating one way or the other.

Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming has numerous books on Chinese martial arts, including a couple on Chin-Na, I believe with a tai chi chuan focus. I have seen his books at Borders, or Amazon would certainly have them. These books would be a good source of information, but if you don't already have a solid background in these arts you will probably have a hard time actually learning the techniques from them.

[scottcatchot]

Thanks., That is what I "assumed" it was, but wanted other input. If it isn't taught independently, then is the fact that It is referenced as 'White tiger CHin Na" a reference to the style it is being drawn from?

[Flying Crane]

Originally Posted by scottcatchot

Thanks., That is what I "assumed" it was, but wanted other input. If it isn't taught independently, then is the fact that It is referenced as 'White tiger CHin Na" a reference to the style it is being drawn from?

I would have no idea about that. Never heard of "White Tiger (or Dragon) Chin Na."

[Flying Crane]

Originally Posted by scottcatchot

Thanks., That is what I "assumed" it was, but wanted other input. If it isn't taught independently, then is the fact that It is referenced as 'White tiger CHin Na" a reference to the style it is being drawn from?

Ask the instructor, and let us know what he says. Now you have a little background info. This should help you if you need to sniff out a dead fish...

[clfsean]

Actually... a dead fish isn't what I was thinking...

[Flying Crane]

Originally Posted by clfsean

Actually... a dead fish isn't what I was thinking...

Do tell

[Brother John]

Originally Posted by scottcatchot

Thanks., That is what I "assumed" it was, but wanted other input. If it isn't taught independently, then is the fact that It is referenced as 'White tiger CHin Na" a reference to the style it is being drawn from?

Some, or perhaps...several, DO teach Chin-Na independant of another system. But this, I think, is a relatively new way to teach it. The grand majority of it IS imbedded within other styles.
IF there is a "White Tiger Chin-Na" then it's no doubt an independant style of Gung-Fu (that I've never heard of, but that's not saying all that much) and the Chin-Na is being emphasized and set aside as a specific study W/in that style.
For instance: there are many that teach "Chin-Na" as "White Crane Chin-Na" which would be the grabbing/seizing arts found w/in the context of the White Crane System. OR...there's "Taijiquan Chin-Na"....again simply the grabbing/seizing system from the Taijiquan context.
SO: If I had a style, we'll call it "PDQ" then the system of PDQ would have it's own techniques, sets, forms, weapons, special exercises...etc., but ONE particular aspect of PDQ may be "Chin-Na". This aspect would be taught as "PDQ Chin-Na".
Does that make sense?
Hope so.

Your Brother
John

[Brother John]

Originally Posted by Flying Crane

I would have no idea about that. Never heard of "White Tiger (or Dragon) Chin Na."

Yeah.... same here. BUT: That's not saying it's not a good style/system. Nor is it saying that they aren't crummy. Just that neither of us have heard of it.
Sometimes in the past (distant and recent past) people have taken a martial art and called it something unique after they've put their own touches on it. Different people see this different ways. ME? I don't care....can they benefit the average student?? That's what I care about.

There are many offshoots of the "Tiger" or "Dragon" systems of Gung-Fu. I only know of a small handfull of them.

Your Brother
John

[clfsean]

Originally Posted by Flying Crane

Do tell

Check your PM's later...

[Jade Tigress]

Originally Posted by arnisador

Chin Na is indeed found in many, and indeed I would say in most, styles of Kung Fu. It is not common to see it practiced independent of some more general art. Loosely speaking, it can be compared to jujutsu--mostly standing grappling based on joint locks. (Of course, this is an oversimplification.) You'll find books on it at your local bookstore.

Yes, I agree with this. Chin na is part of our kung fu training - I would characterize it (oversimplifiedI) the same way - grappling based on joint locks...