Has anyone read the new Sumo book (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1880656280/qid=1012178653/sr=2-3/ref=sr_2_43_3/102-4447365-8711356) (also see this (http://www.stonebridge.com/SUMO/sumo.html) link)? I understand it started as a WWW project (http://www.sumoweb.com/) that became a book.

(I don't know what to make of this (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00005LPZR/qid=1012178653/sr=10-1/102-4447365-8711356) PG-13 link.)

Sumo Vixens is a PG-13 erotica bit. Kei Mizutani is a leading j-porn star. Basic premise is a bunch of gals, in psudo-sumo thongs wiggle around. Good for some T&A, try ESPN if you want real wrestling though.

Or, so I hear. :D

Yes, my sister got me Mina Hall's _The Big Book of Sumo_ for Christmas. It's pretty good. I can give you a better summary, say a table of contents sort of thing, later if you want one. It appears to cover just about everything. What I can think of offhand -- history and background, the rituals performed during matches and such with meanings behind them, the ranking system, moving up, privleges of higher ranks, a few popular winning techniques are described and pictured, info on hairdressing, making a yokozuna's formal belt, translations of fighting names (they normally don't use their real names), info about the referees and some other people, and there are even a couple of recipes for chanko and a section about seeing sumo live (like local stores and good places to stand to watch the wrestlers enter the stadium). And the line drawings of wrestlers are kind of cute, too. :) There's not a whole lot about any individual wrestlers except four (I think) who are originally from Hawaii. I suppose it is on the basic side, but it's a good general book on sumo. I found lots of interesting bits of information in it.

Oh, Kaith is right about ESPN (or ESPN2). Every now and then they have a program I think they call Sumo Digest which shows a couple of matches from each day of a tournament. If you want more than that, I can give you a link to a web site that contains movies of the matches from most of the tournaments over the last two years. The January 2002 basho just finished -- Tochiazuma won the tournament in his debut as an Ozeki (2nd highest rank). He went 13-2 and won a playoff against Chioytaikai for the championship.

Dronak,

Please post that link! I've been getting my sumo info from Mainichi Daily News's English site, which doesn't contain any videos that I know of. ESPN covers sumo, but their scheduling for sports such as sumo an MA-related stuff is flaky at best.

Cthulhu

Sure. Here it is: http://www.oz.net/~drc/sumomovies/movies.html

The person who puts up these movies does so semi-anonymously I think, so the site isn't exactly well known. A quote from the page: "These are provided for the personal, non-commercial use of fans unable to watch sumo in a timely manner by other means." (Yes, it's bold and underlined on the site.) I watch and save the movies from here supplement it with a bit of info from the official sumo site, http://www.sumo.or.jp/eng/index.php and/or rec.sport.sumo. Another site with some nice written reports and a few photos is the Sumo Now! section of http://www.sumoweb.com/ My web page has links to a few other sites I like, but I don't use them all that much. I'll provide them if you want them though.

I've been following sumo more closely since I found stuff available on the web, but always kind of enjoyed it. I'm certainly glad I found the site with movies because otherwise I'd be stuck with only what ESPN shows which generally isn't a lot. This site also has some interesting non-match videos, like some rituals and early movies of Akebono (since he retired). Since I'm new to practicing martial arts, I'm glad I can pass along some spectator info for sumo. :)

Thanks Dronak! I looked at the pages at Amazon's web site but was hoping for a better informed opinion. Can I take it that you recommend this book, then? I have nothing on my shelf that covers Sumo and am looking to fill that gap.

Because I tend to float around the board when I'm here, I saw your comment, arnisador, after I posted my other message but while I was still here, so I'll reply now. :) Yes, I'd recommend the book. Looking at Amazon again, I see that they have a few sample pages including the table of contents so you can get a decent idea of what's in the book. That TOC pretty much covers everything in there. I don't know how many English language books on sumo are available. This is one of the few I know of that's easily obtainable. As noted, I think it is on the basic side, but that seems to be the point -- a nice, general introduction to the sport. I think it would be a good book to start with, but that's just my opinion. Everyone thinks differently, so take this for what it's worth to you.

Thanks Dronak. You've seen the whole book so your recommendation is worthwhile!

Many thanks, Dronak! Yet another URL to clutter my bookmark list :)

Another book on sumo I enjoyed: Rikishi. Probably not as in depth as others, but I liked it, so what the hell :D

Cthulhu

No problem, Cthulhu. Actually, part of the reason I created my own web pages was to have a place to keep my favorite sites without having an excessively long bookmark list on my browser. :) I do still keep some bookmarks, but they're things I either use less frequently or just didn't want to give a section to on my web page (e.g. simple pages made for my personal use). Enjoy the sumo movies, there's some good stuff there.

One that sticks out in my memory is a match between Kaio and Musashimaru where Kaio beat the yokozuna via ippon-zeoi, an over the shoulder throw. OK, he didn't really throw him over, but that's the closest kimarite to what he did. Doing a quick look-up, that was from day 14 of the 2000 Kyushu basho. Another interesting kimarite match is up there, from day 4 of this 2002 Hatsu basho that just finished. It's from the sandanme divison (the 4th major division IIRC) and shows the tasukizori kimarite, something that resembles getting the opponent into a fireman's carry and then leaning back to dump him on the ground. I'm sure you'll find plenty of interesting things there as you go through the site.

I know what you mean, arnisador. It can be hard to tell what a book is like from a few sample pages. It does help to have the opinion of someone who has read the whole thing. You can still get differing opinions on the same book just because different people like different things. I'm glad to be of help though.

[Approaching 60 posts and an Orange Belt. :) ]

Have Sumo techniques influenced jujitsu, judo, or other arts' techniques?

I think I've read something somewhere about sumo's influence on other arts (or maybe the other way around). Unfortunately I can't remember any real details. I took a quick skim of a book I have that's sort of a descriptive info of lots of martial arts and Mina Hall's sumo book. The only thing that I could find was a note in Hall's book about early sumo being a combination of wrestling, boxing, and judo. Oops, wait a second, it also says that many of the wrestling techniques were used to force and enemy to the ground and from this jujitsu developed. I guess that's what I remember seeing. It's not much, but that's all I could find on hand right now.

I stumbled across an odd story (http://news6.thdo.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/asia-pacific/newsid_83000/83728.stm) about Sumo today.

Yeah, it does seem a little strange. I think I've seen something about it on TV once. The first time I skimmed through the articla, I nearly missed the reason and thought it didn't explain why this ritual was done. BTW, if you don't feel like looking at the article (which is short), basically parents let sumo wrestlers shake their babies until they cry because "in Japan, tradition has it that the loudest, most tearful baby, will grow up strong and healthy." Well, you know, every country has its own set of traditions that probably seem odd to everyone else in the world. :)

In another thread (http://www.martialtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=832) I asked: What do people think of the possibility that Sumo will become an Olympic sport (http://www.shinmai.co.jp/oly-eng/19980204/98020416.htm)?

I know the thread has been basically dead for about a month, but since there's at least some interest in sumo here, I figured I'd go ahead and post this. The next basho will be starting in less than two weeks, March 10-24. You can get some more details such as rikishi's rankings from the Nihon Sumo Kyoki page at http://www.sumo.or.jp/eng/index.php (that's the English language page). Unfortunately, if history is any indicator, the Sumo Movies web page link I provided earlier won't have the March tournament. Still I'm sure you can get some text reports and such if you're interested in following the event.

Thanks for the heads up, Dronak! I don't have the link on me, but Mainichi Daily News's English site should run day-by-day summaries of the action.

Do you know if Takanohana is going to be in this Basho?

Cthulhu

Any news of ESPN or ESPN2 covering parts of it?

Regarding Takanohana, I don't think they've come to a final decision yet, but from what I've heard it appears that he's probably going to miss this one, too. I think that would make 5 consecutive basho and I believe that would be a new record. Apparently it's taking longer to recover from the injury he has/had (I forget what) than expected. As far as ESPN(2) covering this basho, I don't know if they will or not. Since the Sumo Digest program is a sort of highlights show, they wouldn't be able to make it until after the basho has ended. If they do make those shows shortly after the basho ends, my guess would be that it wouldn't be on TV until early April at the earliest. But I really don't know how ESPN(2) works their sumo coverage.

According to an article in The Japan Times, http://www.japantimes.com/cgi-bin/getsp.pl5?ss20020308a1.htm Takanohana will be sitting out the March basho. He will now set a new record of 5 consecutive missed basho as a yokozuna. Not a good thing to have, but hopefully he will recover from his knee injury and be able to return soon.

The basho doesn't actually end until tomorrow, but after day 14 Musashimaru has locked up the tournament victory for his 10th yusho. A few of the other highly ranked rikishi have apparently lost their chances for promotion in the next few months with less than stellar performances this month.

Originally posted by Dronak

The basho doesn't actually end until tomorrow, but after day 14 Musashimaru has locked up the tournament victory for his 10th yusho. A few of the other highly ranked rikishi have apparently lost their chances for promotion in the next few months with less than stellar performances this month.

Thanks for the update, Dronak! How did Kaio fair?

Cthulhu

As of day 14, Kaio's record is 11-3. The comment about lost promotion chances was based on a message I got on the sumo mailing list. Unfortunately, I didn't keep it and it hasn't appeared on the web site archive to check. I could be wrong, but I think the primary rikishi who were hoping to get considered for promotion were two of the other ozekis Tochiazuma (9-5 now) and Chiyotaikai (7-7 now) and sekiwake Kotomitsuki (8-6 now). For reference, the other ozeki Musoyama is now 9-5 and the other sekiwake Asashoryu is 10-4 (he's been rising fast as I recall).

I don't think Kaio is under consideration for promotion to yokozuna because he's not consistently pulling great records and staying in the hunt for the yusho. Back in Jan. he went 9-6, in Nov. he went 10-5, and in Sept. he went 0-4-11 (that's 11 days away from the ring, not drawn bouts :) ). He did win a yusho in July with a 13-2 record, but as you can see, he hasn't done great since. Usually for promotion to yokozuna, I think the committe wants to see something like at least 38 wins over 3 basho (38-7 combined record) plus two yusho, preferably consecutive ones. Yokozunas are the best of the best and expected to contend for the yusho every tournament. Kaio's not really there yet it seems.

Thanks for the info! I figured Kaio won't be up for promotion for some time...he's just TOO inconsistent. When he's good, he's very good. When he's bad, he risks demotion.

Cthulhu

does anyone know the history of sumo? it is nothing i would get into, but it is very interesting to watch. i was always curious.

thanx in advance.

Let's see if I can do a short summary of the history given in Mina Hall's book _The Big Book of Sumo_. She has about 7 pages total on the subject. Apparently it dates back around 1500 years and has its origins in Shinto religious rituals. "Early sumo was a combination of wrestling, boxing, and judo", violent, and with few rules. It became part of the military training, mainly the wrestling techniques from which Jujitsu developed (according to the book). The ring was eventually added as a boundary. When the civil wars ended, some of the samurai turned to martial arts like sumo to "vent their aggression" and something Hall refers to as "street sumo" was popular. That was later banned because it was so violent. The rest of the dohyo came into being -- rice bags for a barrier, poles supporting a roof marking the official fighting area. "Sumo stables were organized, rules were laid out, and professional sumo emerged." That's about the basics of it, it seems. If you want some more I can review the rest of it, but it isn't written as a real timeline, so dates for events aren't always obvious.

thanx for the summary :)

sumo is always interesting to watch. i just never knew how it developed.

thanx!
:yinyang:

The May basho begins on Sunday the 12th for anyone interested. I'm sure there are a number of sites that will post up results and such, but the Nihon Sumo Kyokai (http://www.sumo.or.jp/eng/index.php) site is the official one. That points to the English main page, BTW. I've been hearing that Takanohana is training again and doing fairly well in training matches against higher level rikishi. I don't think any official decision has been made yet as to whether or not he will participate in this basho. I think they're going to let him keep training and see how he feels closer to the start. It seems like they want him to be in top form before making his return, so it's possible that he'll skip this one in order to be completely ready for a return in July. We'll see, I guess.

I've heard that it's now offical, Takanohana will be missing the May basho. This will be his sixth consecutive missed tournament, a record. From what I read, he really did want to get back and compete despite not having many training matches with high level rikishi. His trainer finally convinced him to wait until he was back at 100%. Talk now is that the Yokozuna Promotion Council (I think that's right) may have to make some recommendation to Takanohana. I think they have three main choices, but stupid me can't remember them exactly now. I think it's encourage him to return, support his choice to wait until he's fully ready, or suggest retirement. If people are interested in knowing more, I'll try to pay more attention to what I read so I can remember it to post here.

I'm definitely interested! Please keep us informed. I was always impressed with Takanohana, especially considering his size amongst the other Yokozuna. It'd be a shame if he had to retire.

Cthulhu

Any word about when/where highlights will be televised?

I haven't heard anything about when the current basho may appear on TV. ESPN(2) does show Sumo Digest now and then. I think that it takes a while to produce the show though, so I wouldn't expect to see it very soon. I've never kept track of how long it takes, but if they're showing something in about 2 months when the next basho takes place, it could be this one. If you want to see matches now, try that link to a sumo movies page I posted near the top (first page) of this thread. That's where I watch most of my sumo.

Thanks, I'll check the link.

I dont do Sumo, im Not fat. i cant do Sumo, im sire im going to lose. I dont like SumoWrestling.

I dont have any Info about SumoWrestlers. or what they do!

:EG:

I'll go check that site!!!

:EG:

Thanks.. I need to check out something about SumoWrestlers!

Well, a couple of news articles were posted to the sumo mailing list saying Takanohana will be staying out of the upcoming July basho. This will be his seventh consecutive missed tournament. The talk is that if he doesn't return in September, chances are it will be recommended that he retire. I'm not sure what will happen if he does show up, but doesn't perform very well. As a yokozuna, he's expected to retire when he loses his form and can't compete at the very top level anymore. If he returns and performs poorly for a yokozuna, I suppose they might suggest retirement then, too. *shrug* I'll try to remember to pass along more information as I hear about it if you're interested.

Sumo was on ESPN2 for an hour last night but I was unable to watch more than 30 seconds of it (family visiting). ISKA is on ESPN2 for 4 hours starting at 2AM tonight (technically, tomorrow morning).

Thanks for the update, Dronak! I think it'd be a shame if Takanohana was forced to retire. I always thought he was a good wrestler; attaining the rank of Yokozuna along with the giant that was Akebono is quite a feat, I'd say.

Cthulhu

Yes, Takanohana is excellent and I always enjoy watching his matches. I'm not sure exactly what's going to happen. I read things on the mailing list and there are some very knowledgeable people there, but not everything is facts or news. Some of it is just rumors of what's supposed to be being talked about. I don't think anything official has been said about asking Takanohana to retire. I think the rumor is that if he doesn't show up in September, he may be asked to retire. I don't think that's definite though.

Someone did post a copy of an interview with a former yokozuna, I believe, who kind of said the best way for Takanohana to come back is to do one of the off-month tournaments that don't count for standings before doing the real thing. But since there won't be one in August, he'd have to skip the September basho to start with the off-month one in October and then try for the full comeback in November. I think that's what the person interviewed was suggesting he do, take the time needed to heal and come back a little more slowly.

Apparently Takanohana is really carrying the popularity of sumo right now, too, and many people want to see him -- a message said that the announcement about him missing this tournament was delayed as much as possible so that ticket sales wouldn't be adversely affected. I guess Musashimaru just isn't as popular as Takanohana. *shrug* But if Takanohana tries to come back too early, he risks not only reinjuring his knee if it's not fully healed, but a poor showing and essentially forced retirement by not living up to the standards of a yokozuna. Well, I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens. The current basho just started, so there's two full months before the next one starts. Perhaps he will be ready to come back then.

Originally posted by Dronak

Yes, Takanohana is excellent and I always enjoy watching his matches.

Takanohana & Akebone-head (Akebono) are one reason I stopped watching Sumo.
I found Taka to be an arrogant bastard that slid into the rank of Yokozuna because his family is connected "big time" in the Sumo world.
His father is an Oyakata, so is his uncle who is also Sumo "elder" as was his Grandfather. Nepotism is rampant in Sumo.
The conditions under which he got his rank are rather dubious. (Long story which I don't feel like typing out, let's just say there are things that would make you think "oh how convenient" )

He was dating and engaged to Miyazawa Rie an actress that is half Japanese and half Dutch not to mention very well liked.
Seems Taka's "mommy" and the Sumo Elders didn't like her for some reason (rumor has it because she wasn't "pure" Japanese and having a "1/2" for a wife wouldn't sit well with the "Sumo Elders") so at the drop of a hat he dumps her cold. When asked why on national TV he said point blankly "I don't love her anymore". To which the media dubs Takanohana as "Takai-no hana" meaning "high nose" or snob.
After which Miyazawa goes into deep depression and tries to commit suicide on several occasions and isn't seen for a couple of years.
(Sumo wrestler's wives are supposed to be very "conservative ladies of high society".........oddly enough several have married stewardess'.......go figure.)

The other reason is I read an interview with 2 former high ranking wrestlers that told how many bouts in Sumo are fixed so wrestlers can either advance to higher ranks (as in the extremely fast promotions of Takanohana) or keep their present ranks.
(Evidently Taka's Grandfather, who was a Sumo Elder, wanted to see him promoted before his death, which happened oddly enough)
After watching and actually doing Sumo for many years I can say that I have seen more than a few "dives" in professional Sumo.

The July basho ended yesterday and Chiyotaikai won the championship, his second, with a record of 14-1. Asashoryu was the runner-up with a 12-3 record. There's some talk on the sumo mailing list as to whether or not he'll get promoted to ozeki. One post said he should because he's made the minimum numbers they want and not to promote him would imply their standards have gotten even harder which will likely cause problems later on. It sounds like he has a good chance, but we'll have to wait and see, I guess. Musashimaru finished at 10-5, not a very good showing for the yokozuna. This tournament had an awful lot of rikishi withdraw, I think setting a new record with something like 13 out, including 4 of the 6 in the top two ranks.

As far as Takanohana goes, I just got a message on the sumo mailing list summarizing a meeting of the Yokozuna Review Committee. Seven of eight members were present and they all agreed to advise Takanohana to aim for at least 12 weins in September. Apparently they won't accept him being completely absent again or withdrawing after a few days -- it's finish the basho or retire.

As always, thanks for the update, Dronak!

ESPN2 showed a tournament recently, but it wasn't the one you posted about. It was a 2002 tournament won by Musashimaru, with Kaio one win behind.

Cthulhu

Yes, I watched some of that when it was on, too. They're always a bit behind. I assume the reason is just because it takes time to produce a show from all the video they made of the basho. I'm pretty sure they do their own commentary, too. I think I turned on the program a little late and missed the date of the event, but I think that it was the March basho.

A little something else about Asashoryu -- it seems that he will get the promotion to ozeki. I was reading some saved messages from a few days ago where they have short interviews with the rikishi and get their comments about things. I deleted the message already, but I think it said something like the judges requested that some committee meet after the basho was over and that this was an indication that Asashoryu was virtually guaranteed promotion. As I recall, the official announcement would be made in a couple of days, assuming it happens, so I'm sure you'll be able to find something on the Grand Sumo Homepage then. BTW, the sumo mailing list archives are kept at http://www.banzuke.com/ should you want to look up anything. It seems to update like once a week though, so I can't find the "rikishi talk" post with the stuff about Asashoryu.

There's a short sumo sequence in Austin Powers in Goldmember, played for humour of course. Not very interesting.

I watched one day of Sumo on Japanese TV in March. They viewed all the different things I saw during when I was in Japan 42 year ago and went to a big sumo "tournament." Our TV cuts out all the false starts and ceremony. Anyway, I enjoyed it and would have watched sumo for several days but was visiting my son and we were busy coming and going.

Yes, that's true. What we tend to see here, at least on ESPN(2), is normally just the matches without any of the false starts and little of the pre-match rituals. They do show a little bit of different rituals like when coming back from commercial breaks, but they don't show the whole thing which is kind of a shame.

Update for those interested -- the September basho started this week on Sunday and Takanohana is back competing again. He's got a good start at 3-1 after 4 days (WLWW). He'll face the highest ranked opponents towards the end of the tournament, of course, so he's not in the clear yet. But I've heard that the first like five days will be very important, too, and he's doing OK there. If he gets another win tomorrow, he'll be 4-1 over five days; if he only loses one match from each five, he'll end up at 12-3 which isn't bad at all, especially since he hasn't competed in well over a year. I'll try to remember to post some more info later into the basho and/or at the end.

Back when I was stationed on Okinawa and when we were in Japan several of us would go to the sumo early in the morning and stay until a couple matches were over. It was quite the thing to watch all the activities. It is great that Takanohana is back. I missed his last basho and by the next televised event he was just gone leaving big Mash as top dog. Of course, my favorite will probably not return – Nakabono (spelling is worng).

Taka tumbles again

Takanohana suffered a setback in his comeback from injury as the yokozuna went down to his second defeat against a rank-and-filer at the Autumn Grand Sumo Tournament on Thursday.
Takanohana lost to Kotoryu in the day's penultimate bout at Tokyo's Ryogoku Kokugikan to fall two wins behind early leader Asashoryu, who remained unbeaten with a win over Tosanoumi.

Takanohana (3-2) had withdrawn from a record seven consecutive tourneys after securing his 22nd Emperor's Cup in May last year as he bids to recover from a career-threatening knee injury, but he looked a shadow of his former dominating self against Kotoryu (1-4).

The No. 3 maegashira, who headed into the bout without a victory at the meet, went on the offensive immediately at the charge and pushed the yokozuna to the straw bales before slapping him down in the dirt.

Newly promoted ozeki Asashoryu kept up his spotless record by downing sekiwake Tosanoumi (3-2) to move into the sole lead, but had to get out of jail for a second straight day.

Tosanoumi gained the upper hand from the face-off and looked to be heading for victory as he headed the Mongolian toward the edge of the ring, only to be felled by an underarm throw on the ropes.

Meanwhile, grand champion Musashimaru (4-1) powered his way out of a tight spot in his bout against komusubi Takamisakari (0-5) to head a list of 10 wrestlers one off the lead.

Joining the log-jam of fighters at 4-1 were ozeki trio Kaio, Chiyotaikai and Musoyama.

Kaio, needing eight victories to remain at sumo's second-highest rank, moved halfway to the mark after steamrollering over top-ranked maegashira Tochinonada (0-5).

The Japan Times: Sept. 13, 2002
(C) All rights reserved

True, RyuShiKan, but he's still holding in there fine -- he's up to 6-2 now after day 8. A few interesting things have been posted to the sumo mailing list recently regarding Takanohana. I posted a link to their archives earlier (banzuke.com, I think, I don't use it much) where you can look up more if you're interested. I read them then summarize the general ideas here; you can go there to read what I did. One is that sumo seems to be tremendously more popular with Takanohana present. There was a number of points brought up in support -- TV ratings are spiking around the time his bouts come up, lots of people gather around TVs (I'm guessing this means like in public) to watch his matches, he's getting tremendous cheers from the crowd, the first day of this tournament (the Sept. one) sold out for the first time in 5 years, sports pages of papers that focused on other sports are putting Takanohana on the front pages, maybe a few other points. Apparently even the other rikishi have commented that Takanohana brings a certain aura with him and no one else can replicate that. Things are different with him around.

The other point is that the Yokozuna Selection Committee (of whatever, I forget) has apparently gone back on their previous statement that Takanohana should win 12 matches or retire. I forget exactly what their reasons were -- we never claimed he had to win 12 or retire or that they did but they're changing their minds now. In any event, the statements indicated that they'd prefer that Takanohana make his own decision as to whether or not to retire. I'm sure they're hoping that he'll get a winning record, at least 8 wins, and he's 2 away from doing so. But there were remarks like quality is more important than quantity and if he does fairly well and feels he can continue, then he should do so and they shouldn't force him to retire. I suspect part of this is because a lot of sumo's popularity seems to surround Takanohana and no one else commands the sport quite like he does, so they don't want to be seen as forcing him to retire before his time is really up.

Anyway, I thought I'd pass that along. If I see something else interesting come up, I'll post that, too. Time for me to make breakfast (late, yes, but I wake up as late as possible on Sundays :) ).

Thanks for the info. everyone! I keep looking for it on ESPN*.

Originally posted by Dronak

True, RyuShiKan, but he's still holding in there fine -- ..............


If you look at the bottom of my post you will notice that was an article from the Japan Times and not written by me.

Yes, I know. I think that article was posted to the sumo mailing list before. It looked familiar. Since you were quoting it, I kind of figured your opinions were similar to the ones in the article. Plus I wasn't about to address a reply to The Japan Times. :) Anyway, Takanohana is up to 7-2 now, one win away from a guaranteed winning record. Being Takanohana's return basho, I suspect this should air on ESPN(2) at some point, but I wouldn't expect it until at least a month or two after it's over, arnisador. That's a sort of highlights show so they have to have all the footage first, then put it together into a show. I think about two months after the basho is about the earliest you'll see it on TV (unless you get satellite or something from Japan to see it as it happens). BTW, if you want to see some matches now, there's a site with sumo movies on it. I think it moved since I posted the URL in here earlier; it's now at http://www.banzuke.com/sumomovies/movies.html and http://dohyo.com/sumo/movies.html (they mirror each other). I've downloaded a bunch of them from this basho to save, but I haven't watched them yet. I should make time to watch them. :)

Takanohana is still performing pretty well for his first tournament in over a year spent recovering from a bad knee injury. He is up to 10-2 now and recently defeated Asashoryu and Musoyama, two of the four ozekis competing this basho. His last three bouts should be against Chioytaikai, Kaio, and Musashimaru, I think in that order.

It's still a close race for the championship -- Musashimaru is the current leader with 1 loss, Takanohana, Chiyotaikai, and Kaio are next with 2 losses each, and Asashoryu, Kotomitsuki, and Tamakasuga follow with 3 losses each. Since we're into the last few days where most of the top ranked guys are facing each other, it should be a good finish.

Hoepfully they'll eventually televise some of it.

Maru overpowers Taka to take title

By CLYDE NEWTON
Special to The Japan Times

Yokozuna Musashimaru overpowered fellow-yokozuna Takanohana on the final day of the Aki Basho to win his 12th title with a 13-2 record. It was the 31-year-old Hawaiian-born yokozuna's third yusho this year; he also triumphed in March and May.
Musashimaru rallied despite a first-day upset to komusubi Takanonami, a former ozeki. His only other loss was to ozeki Kaio on the 13th day. Whereas in most recent basho Musashimaru has tended to fall apart at the end, the opposite was true this time.

Musashimaru was competing at his highest weight to date -- 237 kg, also the greatest weight for a yokozuna in centuries of recorded sumo history. Nevertheless, the veteran yokozuna was quite mobile and considerably more powerful than he was in July, when his record slipped to a mediocre 10-5 mark.

Since none of the five ozeki appear to be within striking range of yokozuna promotion at this point, Musashimaru is likely to continue to be the dominant figure in sumo for the immediate future, despite his advancing age.

The highlight of the Aki Basho was Takanohana's attempt at a comeback after being absent since the final day of the May 2001 tournament. Takanohana had done very little training in the last few months, facing three aging veterans in his Futagoyama stable on the rare days when he trained with other rikishi.

The consensus of opinion prior to the Aki Basho was that the 30-year-old yokozuna was doomed. There were even those (including this writer) who felt that he'd drop out winless after the first few days and retire.

Takanohana's Rip Van Winkle-like return generated a level of excitement which has been missing from sumo in the last few years. Taka got off to a rocky start, losing to little-heralded No. 4 maegashira Kyokutenho on the second day and to No. 3 maegashira Kotoryu, who was also returning from an injury, on the fifth day.

Taka appeared to be only a loss or two away from retirement after his second defeat, but from that point on he rallied dramatically and, almost unbelievably, became the favorite to take the yusho in the last few days of the tournament.

Obviously rusty, somewhat flabby, and at times desperate, Takanohana was not the nearly invincible yokozuna of several years ago. He was criticized for sidestepping ozeki Chiyotaikai on the 13th day, the first time he had done so in a bout since July 1999, but nevertheless Takanohana's comeback was nothing short of incredible. Had he defeated fellow-yokozuna Musashimaru on the final day, and thereby taken his 23rd title, his comeback would undoubtedly have gone down as one of the most remarkable in history.

Takanohana maneuvered deftly in the first seconds of his clash with Musashimaru, but once Maru found an opening and pushed forward, Takanohana was quickly overpowered.

If he can avoid getting injured again, and provided he does more training, there is no reason to believe that Takanohana will not take the yusho again; indeed he will be one of the favorites at Fukuoka in November.

However, having reached makuuchi at 17, Takanohana is battleworn and a very old 30. He is covering declining strength with his experience and technique, but given his strong fighting spirit on the dohyo, he could last another year or so.

With the exception of Kaio, who shared runnerup honors with Takanohana with a 12-3 record, the performance of the ozeki this time was disappointing, especially in the final days. New ozeki Asashoryu roared off to an 8-0 start, only to fall apart in his bouts with the other top-rankers, finishing with a 10-5 record.

Musoyama barely eked out an 8-7 record, while Chiyotaikai, who would have been promoted to yokozuna if he had won the tournament, dropped to 10-5, which means that he must start again from scratch in his quest for yokozuna promotion. The fifth ozeki, Tochiazuma, was absent, and must win eight or more bouts in November to avoid demotion.

Of the sekiwake and komusubi, only sekiwake Wakanosato achieved kachikoshi, with an 8-7 record. He will retain his rank, but has lost his foothold toward promotion to ozeki. Tosanoumi fell to a 6-9 record after his fine 10-5 comeback in July, while new komusubi Takamisakari had a poor 4-11 mark.

Komusubi Takanonami defeated yokozuna Musashimaru and two ozeki, but failed with a 7-8 record. The 30-year-old former ozeki tends to be very erratic, but he is still capable of upsetting the yokozuna and ozeki and should be around for a while yet.

With Tosanoumi, Takamisakari and Takanonami falling from sanyaku, Takanowaka, Kyokutenho and Kotomitsuki are likely to rise from the maegashira ranks to take their place. Takanowaka will probably be ranked at sekiwake and the other two rikishi at komusubi.

Two popular old veterans lost their battle for survival in September. Thirty-nine-year-old former sekiwake Terao, probably the second most popular rikishi in sumo after Takanohana, announced his retirement on the final day, with a 5-8-2 record at No. 11 juryo. Terao's fighting spirit was apparent to the very end; he won the final bout of his career against Oginishiki on Sunday, to thunderous applause.

The lanky, ever-youthful Terao was the last rikishi with a career stretching all the way back to the 1970s -- he made his debut in July 1979. One of three brothers who had sumo careers, he long outlasted his siblings Kakureizan and Sakahoko.

Terao was promoted to juryo in May 1984 and was thus a sekitori (ranked in the two top divisions) for a remarkable 18 years. He was the last survivor of the Hana no Sanpachi Gumi (rikishi born in 1963), which included yokozuna Futahaguro and Hokutoumi and ozeki Konishiki.

Something of a living legend and one of a kind, Terao will be greatly missed. He will remain in sumo as Shikoroyama Oyakata.

Former sekiwake Takatoriki withdrew with a 3-10 record on the 13th day, after losing to Terao, and announced his retirement. He will remain in the sumo world as Odake Oyakata and will eventually take over Taiho Beya, which is operated by his father-in-law, the great former yokozuna Taiho.

Takatoriki, who is nearly 35, won the makuuchi yusho in March 2000 and was a strong sekiwake in the early to mid 1990s. The aging veteran seemed to lose heart in the last few tournaments, and he announced his retirement after his demotion to makushita became a certainty. There is no precedent for a former makuuchi championship winner to fall below juryo.

Former No. 3 maegashira Minatofuji also retired in makushita and has become the new Tatsutagawa Oyakata.

The juryo championship was won by Tamarikido with an 11-4 record. The makushita title went to Shishio, the sandanme to Nadatsukasa, the jonidan to Russian Roho and the jonokuchi to Tokitenku, all with 7-0 records.

The Outstanding Performance and Technique Prizes were not awarded this basho, with No. 7 maegashira Kotomitsuki (11-4) taking the Kantosho, or Fighting Spirit Prize.

The Japan Times: Sept. 23, 2002
(C) All rights reserved

Winners Losers
Tochinohana 8-7 Akinoshima 7-8
Otsukasa 5-10 Oikari 4-11
Daizen 4-11 Takanotsuru 8-7
Iwakiyama 10-5 Kasuganishiki 5-10
Gojoro 8-7 Asanowaka 7-8
Ushiomaru 9-6 Aminishiki 7-8
Hokutoriki 9-6 Wakanoyama 8-7
Kyokushuzan 9-6 Buyuzan 5-10
Tokitsuumi 7-8 Toki 4-11
Shimotori 5-10 Tochisakae 2-9-4
Kyokutenho 8-7 Tochinonada 4-11
Miyabiyama 7-8 Tamakasuga 10-5
Takanonami 7-8 Takanowaka 8-7
Kotoryu 5-10 Takamisakari 4-11
Tamanoshima 8-7 Tosanoumi 6-9
Kotomitsuki 12-3 Wakanosato 8-7
Asashoryu 10-5 Musoyama 9-6
Kaio 12-3 Chiyotaikai 10-5
Musashimaru 13-2 Takanohana 12-3


By CLYDE NEWTON
Special to The Japan Times

Yokozuna Musashimaru overpowered fellow-yokozuna Takanohana on the final day of the Aki Basho to win his 12th title with a 13-2 record. It was the 31-year-old Hawaiian-born yokozuna's third yusho this year; he also triumphed in March and May.
Musashimaru rallied despite a first-day upset to komusubi Takanonami, a former ozeki. His only other loss was to ozeki Kaio on the 13th day. Whereas in most recent basho Musashimaru has tended to fall apart at the end, the opposite was true this time.

Musashimaru was competing at his highest weight to date -- 237 kg, also the greatest weight for a yokozuna in centuries of recorded sumo history. Nevertheless, the veteran yokozuna was quite mobile and considerably more powerful than he was in July, when his record slipped to a mediocre 10-5 mark.

Since none of the five ozeki appear to be within striking range of yokozuna promotion at this point, Musashimaru is likely to continue to be the dominant figure in sumo for the immediate future, despite his advancing age.

The highlight of the Aki Basho was Takanohana's attempt at a comeback after being absent since the final day of the May 2001 tournament. Takanohana had done very little training in the last few months, facing three aging veterans in his Futagoyama stable on the rare days when he trained with other rikishi.

The consensus of opinion prior to the Aki Basho was that the 30-year-old yokozuna was doomed. There were even those (including this writer) who felt that he'd drop out winless after the first few days and retire.

Takanohana's Rip Van Winkle-like return generated a level of excitement which has been missing from sumo in the last few years. Taka got off to a rocky start, losing to little-heralded No. 4 maegashira Kyokutenho on the second day and to No. 3 maegashira Kotoryu, who was also returning from an injury, on the fifth day.

Taka appeared to be only a loss or two away from retirement after his second defeat, but from that point on he rallied dramatically and, almost unbelievably, became the favorite to take the yusho in the last few days of the tournament.

Obviously rusty, somewhat flabby, and at times desperate, Takanohana was not the nearly invincible yokozuna of several years ago. He was criticized for sidestepping ozeki Chiyotaikai on the 13th day, the first time he had done so in a bout since July 1999, but nevertheless Takanohana's comeback was nothing short of incredible. Had he defeated fellow-yokozuna Musashimaru on the final day, and thereby taken his 23rd title, his comeback would undoubtedly have gone down as one of the most remarkable in history.

Takanohana maneuvered deftly in the first seconds of his clash with Musashimaru, but once Maru found an opening and pushed forward, Takanohana was quickly overpowered.

If he can avoid getting injured again, and provided he does more training, there is no reason to believe that Takanohana will not take the yusho again; indeed he will be one of the favorites at Fukuoka in November.

However, having reached makuuchi at 17, Takanohana is battleworn and a very old 30. He is covering declining strength with his experience and technique, but given his strong fighting spirit on the dohyo, he could last another year or so.

With the exception of Kaio, who shared runnerup honors with Takanohana with a 12-3 record, the performance of the ozeki this time was disappointing, especially in the final days. New ozeki Asashoryu roared off to an 8-0 start, only to fall apart in his bouts with the other top-rankers, finishing with a 10-5 record.

Musoyama barely eked out an 8-7 record, while Chiyotaikai, who would have been promoted to yokozuna if he had won the tournament, dropped to 10-5, which means that he must start again from scratch in his quest for yokozuna promotion. The fifth ozeki, Tochiazuma, was absent, and must win eight or more bouts in November to avoid demotion.

Of the sekiwake and komusubi, only sekiwake Wakanosato achieved kachikoshi, with an 8-7 record. He will retain his rank, but has lost his foothold toward promotion to ozeki. Tosanoumi fell to a 6-9 record after his fine 10-5 comeback in July, while new komusubi Takamisakari had a poor 4-11 mark.

Komusubi Takanonami defeated yokozuna Musashimaru and two ozeki, but failed with a 7-8 record. The 30-year-old former ozeki tends to be very erratic, but he is still capable of upsetting the yokozuna and ozeki and should be around for a while yet.

With Tosanoumi, Takamisakari and Takanonami falling from sanyaku, Takanowaka, Kyokutenho and Kotomitsuki are likely to rise from the maegashira ranks to take their place. Takanowaka will probably be ranked at sekiwake and the other two rikishi at komusubi.

Two popular old veterans lost their battle for survival in September. Thirty-nine-year-old former sekiwake Terao, probably the second most popular rikishi in sumo after Takanohana, announced his retirement on the final day, with a 5-8-2 record at No. 11 juryo. Terao's fighting spirit was apparent to the very end; he won the final bout of his career against Oginishiki on Sunday, to thunderous applause.

The lanky, ever-youthful Terao was the last rikishi with a career stretching all the way back to the 1970s -- he made his debut in July 1979. One of three brothers who had sumo careers, he long outlasted his siblings Kakureizan and Sakahoko.

Terao was promoted to juryo in May 1984 and was thus a sekitori (ranked in the two top divisions) for a remarkable 18 years. He was the last survivor of the Hana no Sanpachi Gumi (rikishi born in 1963), which included yokozuna Futahaguro and Hokutoumi and ozeki Konishiki.

Something of a living legend and one of a kind, Terao will be greatly missed. He will remain in sumo as Shikoroyama Oyakata.

Former sekiwake Takatoriki withdrew with a 3-10 record on the 13th day, after losing to Terao, and announced his retirement. He will remain in the sumo world as Odake Oyakata and will eventually take over Taiho Beya, which is operated by his father-in-law, the great former yokozuna Taiho.

Takatoriki, who is nearly 35, won the makuuchi yusho in March 2000 and was a strong sekiwake in the early to mid 1990s. The aging veteran seemed to lose heart in the last few tournaments, and he announced his retirement after his demotion to makushita became a certainty. There is no precedent for a former makuuchi championship winner to fall below juryo.

Former No. 3 maegashira Minatofuji also retired in makushita and has become the new Tatsutagawa Oyakata.

The juryo championship was won by Tamarikido with an 11-4 record. The makushita title went to Shishio, the sandanme to Nadatsukasa, the jonidan to Russian Roho and the jonokuchi to Tokitenku, all with 7-0 records.

The Outstanding Performance and Technique Prizes were not awarded this basho, with No. 7 maegashira Kotomitsuki (11-4) taking the Kantosho, or Fighting Spirit Prize.

The Japan Times: Sept. 23, 2002
(C) All rights reserved

An AP photo in Friday paper shows Konishiki next to Barry Bonds as they chat during the American-Japanese All-Stars series. I never quite realized how BIG he really was! He's wearing an American-style (flannel?) button-up shirt that must be huge.

Yes, Konishiki is very big. As I recall, he's the biggest rikishi ever. I looked at my sumo links and the first page I went to has a list of the heaviest rikishi -- Konishiki tops the list at 285kg (about 628 lbs) in March 1996.

For those interested, the November Kyushu basho just began. Takanohana is sitting out again after his knee swelled up. There are probably some news articles you can find with more info; I didn't really try to remember the details. Maybe after his performance last basho whatever committee forced him back then will be a little more lenient on him now and let his knee really recover before telling him to return or retire. *shrug* I've heard Musashimaru is the opening favorite to win this tournament. If you're interested in following the tournament, check out newsgroups and/or web sites; it lasts for two weeks (15 days actually).

A short update on the withdrawls from the current basho. As previously noted, Takanohana sat out from the start due to his knee injury. However, other top ranked rikishi are also out now. I'm a little uncertain of the exact reasons; I probably read them but didn't attempt to keep them in conscious memory. Kaio withdrew on day 4, I think because of back problems, Musashimaru pulled out on day 6, left? wrist was bothering him, and Chiyotaikai left on day 9, don't think I've heard why yet. What this means is that the four highest ranked rikishi are all gone from the basho now. At the time I'm posting this, Asashoryu is the current sole leader at 8-0 with only Akinoshima (M14) at 1 loss and maybe 5 or 6 rikishi with 2 losses. Asashoryu is doing pretty well and as the highest ranked rikishi left in the basho, he's probably now the favorite to win it. We'll see how things unfold over the second week though.

Drat, 60 minute time limit on editing posts. I got an e-mail from the sumo mailing list today that mentioned Chiyotaikai withdrew because of a triceps injury that he suffered in his win the day before. Just thought I'd mention it.

For any of you who are following along, Asashoryu just clinched his first tournament win on day 13. He's now three wins ahead of everyone else and there are only two days left, so he's guaranteed to get the victory.

As for the following January basho, Musashimaru is supposed to be out because he's going to need time for his hand to heal (I think he's having surgery) and who knows about Takanohana. So both yokozuna could be out. I think Chiyotaikai was granted a public injury status meaning he can miss the next basho without penalty, so he's probably going to sit out next time, too. Not sure about the rest. But it would appear that Asashoryu will have a pretty good chance at placing very highly again next time, possibly getting a second yusho. Two in a row is often an unofficial requirement for promotion to yokozuna, so we'd have to wait and see what happens at that point.

In case anyone's interested, a couple major events happened at this month's sumo basho. On the bad side, yokozuna Takanohana retired about halfway through. Apparently he's just not able to compete like he used to anymore and when that happens to a yokozuna, he's expected to retire. On the good side, Asashoryu won the tournament with a 14-1 record. That was his second yusho overall and his second in a row. I believe that he ended up at 14-1 last basho as well. His performance was high enough quality that he was recommended and accepted for promotion to yokozuna. So we have a new yokozuna. He's yokozuna number 68 as I recall and the third foreign born rikishi to attain the rank (Akebono and Musashimaru being the other two). Hopefully he'll keep performing well and will have a long career ahead of him.

It's a good sign I think--how do the Japanese feel about foreigners in the art?

Takanohana retired?

Wow.



:eek:

Cthulhu

Originally posted by arnisador
It's a good sign I think--how do the Japanese feel about foreigners in the art?


There is an increasing number of foreign Sumo wrestlers these days, many coming from Korea and Mongolia and even some from Czech, and Greece.
In fact the prizes award this basho for Jr. ranks were all taken by foreign wrestlers.
Sumo is still somewhat popular as a spectator sport in Japan but the amount of you people joining Sumo seems to be dropping.

It’s difficult to say how Japanese view foreigners in Sumo since it is sometimes hard to figure out what they feel about so many things.

However, when Akebono, the first foreign Yokozuna, retired there was not as much fanfare, but when Takanohana retired it was a big deal, in fact it’s still in the news almost daily.
Akebono might not have gotten the amount of attention when he retired for a few reasons.
One being his “koenkai” support group quit in mass a few years ago…….a first ever in Sumo, and nothing to be proud of.
The other reason being, he was engaged to a “honey” named Aihara Yu, but dumped her because he had “knocked up” some ugly cow of a woman that is half Japanese and had a "shotgun wedding".
This was also one of many reasons why his koenkai quit.
The good news is my firend that knows Akaebono and his wife says the wife rules with an iron fist and keeps “Akedumbo” in line.

(The koenkai is a wrestlers support group not unlike a fan club but much more since they basically give financial support too. No support group= no salary)

Asashoryu is from Mongolia. As for how the Japanese feel about having foreigners in sumo, I couldn't say for sure. There is a limit on how many non-Japanese can be in each stable and I think it's two. I don't think they totally object to having non-Japanese in sumo, but they might not really like the fact that there is now no Japanese rikishi in the highest rank. *shrug* I think a message got posted to the sumo mailing list that was basically a person on the street interview kind of thing. I didn't read the whole thing (it was a tad long for me), but from what I read it sounded like people were generally OK with having foreigners in sumo. But then again, you never can tell if that sort of thing gives you a fair sample of the population or if the publisher only printed interviews from one side. So who knows for sure?

From the information i gathered, Sumo never pretended to be an Martial Art, it was just an entertainment for the Japanese Emperor, and to show the strongest guy ( what they really are, isnt?), but i think it did not influenced any martial art in technique, just in philosophy.
But, being serious, its gonna be a hard time if i have to fight some Sumotori, they are large man! How can i choke that neck?lol, can you give an armlock on that arm?haha, man should be fun!

Originally posted by Infight
From the information i gathered, Sumo never pretended to be an Martial Art, it was just an entertainment for the Japanese Emperor, and to show the strongest guy ( what they really are, isnt?), but i think it did not influenced any martial art in technique, just in philosophy.
But, being serious, its gonna be a hard time if i have to fight some Sumotori, they are large man! How can i choke that neck?lol, can you give an armlock on that arm?haha, man should be fun!


Long ago they were the first line of defense in most armies………so they were actually soldiers.

Originally posted by Infight
but i think it [sumo] did not influenced any martial art in technique, just in philosophy.

Well, here's an excerpt from Mina Hall's book _The Big Book of Sumo_:

Early sumo was a combination of wrestling, boxing, and judo. Matches were quite violent and had few rules. During the Kamakura period (1185-1334), a military dictatorship or shogunate was established and bloody wars were fought throughout Japan. It was at this time that sumo was implemented as part of the military's training program. Many of the wrestling techniques practiced were used to force an enemy down to the ground where he could easly be apprehended. Jujitsu developed from this.

As I understand, she's done her research so I wouldn't dismiss this out of hand. Jujitsu may have very well developed out of sumo's felling techniques. There may be other things like this in the book, but this was the first one I found on a quick skim. So it would appear that one could make a case for sumo influencing other martial arts in technique and not just philosophy. I'm not really going to discuss it because I don't know much about it. I'm just pointing out a publication with something that counters your quote above.

Anyone have any more Sumo news?

A story in today's Indianapolis Star says that Yoshitake Maeda, a 15 year old, 308 lb. sumo wrestler, died of cardiomyopathy. He's the first active wrestler to die in three years, it says.

Another sumo story:
http://www.indystar.com/print/articles/5/057342-3145-036.html

http://mdn.mainichi.co.jp/sports/sumo/index.html

http://www12.mainichi.co.jp/news/mdn/search-news/888567/sumo-0-.html

http://www12.mainichi.co.jp/sports/sumo/index.html

http://dohyo.com/

Try this one out for up to date video clips on the latest basho. This was really my first exposure to sumo and now I'm hooked.

As a fan only, or have you ever tried it yourself?

I'm 6'2" and weigh in at a whopping 150lbs! I don't think sumo would be something I'd ever actually try:rofl: I'm hooked as a fan only but hooked none the less.

See:
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11536

Heavyweights panic as woman dives for sumo ring (http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070920/od_nm/sumo_woman1_dc)

A woman invaded a sumo ring -- a sacred arena from which females are banned -- in Tokyo during a major tournament, domestic media said on Thursday, then was pulled down by a referee and one of the sport's huge wrestlers.