How do you stop Over Thinking?

[Big Don]

I test for my Second Brown in Kenpo two weeks from tomorrow and my biggest problem is I think too much. My Sifu tells me to stop thinking and just do it, whether "it" is a Kata or a technique or sparring. I don't know how to turn it off. I think and second guess myself and it kills my reaction time and the speed at which I do techniques. My Sifu and his assistants, tell me to "do something, even if it isn't right, motion looks better than standing frozen"
I try to but, my body doesn't cooperate with my mind and my mind overrules. How do I fix this? Any ideas?

[Andrew Green]

Lots of shadow boxing, focusing not on what you are throwing, but the rythym that you are throwing it. Get your footwork involved, don't plant your feet at all, just move and throw combinations, and make sure you are moving while throwing.

It's hard to know exactly what is going on, but my guess is you are pausing before throwing, planting yourself before throwing, or possibly not throwing combinations that are fluent, but rather a set of individual techniques, one after the other.

Sort of like playing a chord by hitting one note, then the next, then the next. All the notes need to be hit in one fluid motion, or it doesn't sound right.

But shadowboxing, lots of it, make things flow together and keep moving, your whole body is involved in every strike you throw. Combine that with a lot of focus mit work, and with someone that knows how to hold mits well (it's a often overlooked skill)

But a good mitt holder is someone that keeps you moving, moves around in a semi-realistic way and has active hands. They are swinging back at you, varying target position slightly, etc.

Next piece is isolating what you get stuck up on and making a drill to overcome it. If you have a hard time responding after someone attacks you, create a drill around counter punching. Keep it simple at first, they come in and attack, defend and chase them back with a cross everytime. Then get them throwing combinations, come back with a cross (or a kick or whatever) immediately. If this is where the problem is you would end up having to adjust the way you defend as you would likely be backing up and setting your weight, which makes it hard to drive forward without reseting your weight.

If the problem is being unable to attack with a combination, often due to caution of a counter attack then take the same idea but flip it around. Go in with a combination, have your opponent throw a straight punch at you everytime, as you come in. Your goal is to get in and land without getting hit. He's throwing straight everytime, so you are forced to attack on angles, which makes it very hard to predict where you will be and hit you as you enter. As you get comfortable coming in and being off that line let him add other counter strikes.

Barring all that being a possible issue, and it is simply a "Brain won't let body go" train until exhaustion, when your brain just gives up and says "**** it, you do this, I'm taking a nap" then keep training and let your body fight solo for a while ;)

[Josh Oakley]

Get on the bag and hit the thing. A lot, and often, not trying to do more than hit it.

[terryl965]

Like other have said Shadow Boxing will help but also you mention that your mind is thinking. Does this mean you are not re-acting to ones action but rather you are trying to process what is going on? If so then try and remember not to be thinking while you are training and just focus on re-acting to every movement. Best of Luck.

[exile]

Tough one, BD. The problem is that you can't just 'stop thinking'; it's like telling yourself, after lying awake worrying for a couple of hours in the middle of the night, 'I am going to fall asleep now'. Or the old gag, 'Don't think of an elephant!!'

When I ski-raced we used to do a lot of very intense visualization. You had to learn the course first, and then you played and replayed it in your mind, at 'combat speed'. The more you did that, the more intensely, the more you wound up focusing and responding to the immediate environment of the course, in an almost instinctive way, when it was finally your turn through the gates. I think that that's part of what' involved in the shadow-boxing that people have been recommending: training yourself for total focus on the immediate physical situation, not allowing your mind to get 'outside' yourself and second-guess what you're doing. It's not an easy state to get into, but professional athletes seem to learn how to do it almost at will. Just as with sleep, you kind of have to let yourself slip into that frame of mind; you can't will yourself into it.

This is a hard lesson for those of us who tend to rely on force of will to overcome obstacles, so I understand completely what you're talking about.

[yak sao]

Repitition!!!!!!

After you learn a technique (or form or sequence, whatever) you should practice it no less than 1000 times. The quicker you can get through those 1000 reps the sooner it will become muscle memory, ie. reflex.
With a technique such as a kick, you may hit the 1000 rep mark in a couple of workouts. If it's a form, especially a long one, it may take you months to reach 1000.
Don't speed throught the repitition. Go slow and smooth and this will translate into speed over time.
Doing this will get it out of your head and into your body where it belongs.
Good luck with your test........breathe, it'll help you to loosen up.

[MJS]

I test for my Second Brown in Kenpo two weeks from tomorrow and my biggest problem is I think too much. My Sifu tells me to stop thinking and just do it, whether "it" is a Kata or a technique or sparring. I don't know how to turn it off. I think and second guess myself and it kills my reaction time and the speed at which I do techniques. My Sifu and his assistants, tell me to "do something, even if it isn't right, motion looks better than standing frozen"
I try to but, my body doesn't cooperate with my mind and my mind overrules. How do I fix this? Any ideas?

Well, first off, good luck to you on your test. Please let us know how it goes. :)

As for your question....I used to do techinque lines and throw out attacks that I knew the students probably wouldn't know a defense for. They wouldn't have a 'textbook' tech. to do and I'd say the same thing your insts. are saying to you...just do something. :)

My suggestion for fixing this is to start off by having a partner throw some random attacks slowly. You know how to block, punch, kick and move, so I wouldn't worry about pulling off one of the textbook techs. but instead, just react to whats being thrown. :)

[JadecloudAlchemist]

Hey Don

To stop over thinking is to let things come and let them go.


By letting things be natural and not being attached to them you can react freely.


If you are in a hurry to achieve this a few beers always helps you from over thinking.:cheers:

[Imua Kuntao]

The problem is pretty much like the advanced student who never competed in any tournements, when for the first time they do kata in front of a crowd/judges they have brain farts and cant remember what to do next. Like those who freeze when speaking publicly, practice doing these things in front of your teacher and advanced students or other teachers outside your school, maybe that will help.

[Kacey]

Practice. Don't allow yourself to stop, no matter what mistakes you think you've made. This is a practice effect, and one that can be very hard to achieve. You have trained yourself to stop and correct errors as you've make them - now you have to train yourself to continue through the errors as they occur.

Two things to think about with this:

1) A senior BB (VI Dan at the time) once point out to me, while we were judging patterns, that his method of judging was to choose the student who made the fewest mistakes - and that the fewest mistakes he had ever seen in a pattern was 27.

2) If you are in a real fight, where you are defending your own life or the lives of others, you won't get to go back and start over - so you'd best be practicing how to work through your mistakes as they happen.

It's hard to continue when you realize you've made a mistake - good luck!

[celtic_crippler]

Kenpoist tend to be thinkers....it's our curse. LOL

It does get in the way sometimes....as you apparently know.

My advice: focus on relaxing. When the test comes it's time to stop thinking...yeah....that's what I said. When the test comes it's time to stop thinking and start doing. It's time to show you can apply what you've learned.

If you've practiced enough, then the material should be embedded in your subconcious to the point where you should not have to think about "it." Trust your instructors to know when you've reached that point.

Thinking about the material is appropriate during training, but by the time you get to testing....you should "empty your cup."

I think the most important thing you can do is relax, and trust your training. Over thinking leads to hesitation. As Yoda said, "Do or do not...there is no try." When test day arrives, practice relaxation techninques and trust your training to kick in. Overthink it, and you could sabatage yourself!

[Big Don]

Kenpoist tend to be thinkers....it's our curse. LOL

It does get in the way sometimes....as you apparently know.

My advice: focus on relaxing. That, to me, at least is like "Don't Look DOWN!" OR "Don't YAWN."
When the test comes it's time to stop thinking...yeah....that's what I said. I don't know how to stop thinking, and based on past tests, what I am thinking during is basically "Oh **** oh **** oh ****"
When the test comes it's time to stop thinking and start doing. It's time to show you can apply what you've learned.

If you've practiced enough, then the material should be embedded in your subconcious to the point where you should not have to think about "it." Trust your instructors to know when you've reached that point.

Thinking about the material is appropriate during training, but by the time you get to testing....you should "empty your cup."

I think the most important thing you can do is relax, and trust your training. Over thinking leads to hesitation. As Yoda said, "Do or do not...there is no try." When test day arrives, practice relaxation techninques and trust your training to kick in. Overthink it, and you could sabatage yourself!

[IcemanSK]

When I was training in Western boxing & full contact rules kickboxing, I used to be accused of "thinking too much" by my trainer. It would often keep me from reacting quickly. I spoke to a pro fighter for some advice. He told me something that, at the time, was no help at all. When I asked how one overcomes it, he said, "you just keep fighting...all the time."

It took a while to realize what he meant. Training is the only way one can overcome the anxiety of training. In my case, I didn't want to open myself up & risk getting hit. In sparring, we will get hit. Once I stopped worrying about "not" getting hit, I started being comfortable reacting to the openings I'd see in my oponent.

Fear of embarrasment? Being wrong? Getting hit? Tripping over your feet? Whatever it is, the best way I've found to get past it is to keep training.

All my best. You're not alone.

[Rich Parsons]

I test for my Second Brown in Kenpo two weeks from tomorrow and my biggest problem is I think too much. My Sifu tells me to stop thinking and just do it, whether "it" is a Kata or a technique or sparring. I don't know how to turn it off. I think and second guess myself and it kills my reaction time and the speed at which I do techniques. My Sifu and his assistants, tell me to "do something, even if it isn't right, motion looks better than standing frozen"
I try to but, my body doesn't cooperate with my mind and my mind overrules. How do I fix this? Any ideas?


Don,


This will sound funny but please give it a try.

I assume you are a big guy buy your TAG here. I am a big guy and this looks funny / weird when you begin.

Go out on the mats or in your living room and just put a tune in your head or have music playing. Now do your techniques to the music. It does not matter what techniques. just move from one to another. Just keep "Dancing" but your dance moves are only your techniques you are working on or practicing or what you know. Elbows/knees and hand strikes with kicks even rolls. I am not talking about going out and creating an XMA routine. I am talking about closing your eyes and just moving. Even if the technique is not completed or perfect. You balance could be off. You might get an extra strike or drop one as it does not fit the beat, but just move.

As you get more comfortable with this, you can ignore the beat and get your balance and techniques in line. But by then you are used to moving and not thinking, just moving.

Good Luck

[Brian King]

Big Don
Congratulations and good luck on your upcoming testing.
I do not practice Kenpo so my advice might not apply. Take it for what it is worth.
As others have said practice and continuation of training will eventually overcome this habit. However I do not see that as helping your immediate need in two weeks. Perhaps Big Don I can tell you about a trick that I and many of my students have repeatedly found helpful at different times of our training. The trick is also a very useful training drill and tool. Simply give the mind something else to think about. We have had success by focusing on breathing or posture only while doing applications work (we do not do Kata’s so cannot say how it will work with those) This is helpful as many times when stressed people forget about their breathing and so end up totally fatigued during the testing. Big Don try this out during one of your training sessions. Pick a drill and do it but totally focus you mind on inhaling and exhaling. IT is not easy but gets easier. We have had success by having the students make a cell call and keep a conversation going with the person on the other end of the call hopefully not being able to tell that the student is not only talking to them but is also dealing with multiple attacker drills. Another that we have had success with (but many of the students do not like) is calling out mathematic problems and having the students solves them while working drills. LOL the concentrating on breathing seems easiest for most to start with and most beneficial in the long run. Perhaps there is some Kenpo thing or something personal that you can focus on to force the brain to think about what you want it to rather than it getting stuck in some random part of the OODA loop. Let us know how it (the testing)goes.

Again good luck sir
Warmest Regards
Brian King

[7starmarc]

For Kata/Forms, I would say repetition and rehearsal. Not just on the mat, but in your mind. Same for techniques. One of the keys to visualization of forms and techniques is not just what you are doing, but what your opponent would be doing as well.
I see forms as a vehicle for the exact training that you need.

That brings me to the most important things (IMO) -- focus not on what you are doing, but what your opponent is doing. As you know, in sparring, your mind gets in the way very often. If you've trained mindfully, your techniques will flow from your opponent's actions and positioning combined with those skills that you have drilled repeatedly.

In the Last Samurai, a young samurai gave the advice of "too many minds" to the Tom Cruise's character. You might also ask yourself exactly what you are thinking of when you start to "over think". In my experience, I start to over think when I struggle with a form. I usually struggle with a form when I am not actually focused on the form at hand. Often it is when I become aware of someone else watching me when I didn't expect it. It is at that point that I start to force the form, and I lose flow and start to "over think".

[jks9199]

For your forms -- repetition is the key. Do 'em over and over and over and over... Focus on visualizing your adversary and what they're doing, and let that drive your move.

For fighting... Don't think. Movement is movement; action is action. Don't worry about what the opponent might do -- focus on what they ARE doing. A couple of tricks to short circuit your brain: Rhythm; count (like for music or dance) or hum a song or whatever it takes to put some rhythm in your movement. Or recite a poem; it'll focus your thought and free your body. (Maybe...)

[morph4me]

You're at the point now where your tecniques have been igrained into your muscle memory, your mind is getting in the way. You've been given alot of good advice and a number of ways to get out of your own way. I find that the easiest way not to think of something is to think of something else. Don't think about your technique, think about your breathing, or your shoes, something that doesn't require alot of thought, but keeps you out of your way. Good luck on the test.

[Nolerama]

When I spar, I try to relax my mind as much as I try to relax my breathing. That allows me to focus on on opportunity. I don't stop thinking. I start thinking about the things that matter at the time: finding an opening and capitalizing on it in the best way I can.

I don't think you need to stop over thinking. I think you need to focus that on trying to overcome your opponent. I'll let my coach critique my technique later and really LISTEN to him when the sparring session is over. Then train to overcome that flaw.

Fighting is like a chess game in many ways. Is it possible to play chess, and win, by not overthinking? How about thinking ahead instead of your technique?

[Mimir]

I would have to agree with what Brian said above. Concentrate on your breathing which will give you somthing to occupy your mind, and will give you the benefit of helping your stamina. I know that it helped me a whole lot while doing forms for my black belt test. It is funny how when we feel stress the first thing our body wants to do is start holding our breath. Not sure why this is, but it does happen. The way my instructor taught me to do this was to try to breath in for at least two moves of the form and then breath out for two or so moves. Good luck on your test and please let us know how it turns out!

[Andrew Green]

I would have to agree with what Brian said above. Concentrate on your breathing which will give you somthing to occupy your mind, and will give you the benefit of helping your stamina. I know that it helped me a whole lot while doing forms for my black belt test. It is funny how when we feel stress the first thing our body wants to do is start holding our breath. Not sure why this is, but it does happen. The way my instructor taught me to do this was to try to breath in for at least two moves of the form and then breath out for two or so moves. Good luck on your test and please let us know how it turns out!


I'm going to disagree on focusing on breathing. For forms maybe, but not for sparring. Breathing needs to be instinctual, switching the focus to breathing is a bad idea in increases the chance of getting hurt.

In.... Out..... In.... Out... I *thud* gasp..gasp..wheeze..gasp..wheeze...

[Big Don]

I'm going to disagree on focusing on breathing. For forms maybe, but not for sparring. Breathing needs to be instinctual, switching the focus to breathing is a bad idea in increases the chance of getting hurt.

In.... Out..... In.... Out... I *thud* gasp..gasp..wheeze..gasp..wheeze...
Depending on who I am sparring it is more like In...out...smack...ow...damn...smack....crap...out ...in...out...smack...
:uhyeah:

[Imua Kuntao]

Everyone says to practice this way and that, maybe taking a couple of days off will do.

[7starmarc]

Another thought about sparring. I think some people over think in sparring because they want to "keep it interesting" for either their opponent or a spectator. I know I have at times. What this means is that you try to vary techniques for the sake of variety, not for the sake of effectiveness. If you're doing this, then you start to get wrapped up in coming up with new ways to strike your opponent when you don't have to. Vary techniques when you need to, or when you're trying something new on someone (in this case, you should know you're trying something different ahead of time), but you don't have to do this in sparring when it matters -- stick to what you know best.

Sometimes, I think this is also a result of adding too many techniques to your repetoire before you have integrated your previous techniques into your fighting. If you find yourself doing this, refine your "play list". Practice with a more limited set of techniques (your favorites) and start adding new ones in one at a time.

The same can be said for forms. If you're still thinking your way through a form, it probably means you haven't practiced it enough before adding more material. I realize this can be a problem in some curriculae, where you finish one set and then move onto the next, but see if you can focus on your current sets before moving too far ahead. Failing that, commit to continued practice of past sets even while learning the newer one -- I know many student in our school who have had to relearn significant parts of the curriculum because they fail to practice past sets regularly.

[hpulley]

First of all, practice, practice, practice. When you know a form really well you'll run through it perfectly and at the end you won't be sure if you did it right or even if you didt it at all because you will be running through it on muscle memory, on 'autopilot' if you will. If you have to think about it to do it then it will disappear on you both in a grading and in a fight you will be hit before you can think of a defense. You may know what you should have done...

I think breathing is good but not concentrating on the breathing; that too must be trained for the proper method so you do it automatically. Doing some brief breathing meditation before a form is good (that's what the mokuso is there for, use it!) but before a fight this isn't practical unless it is arranged in which case you must ask yourself (if it isn't a pro match), why are you fighting again?

Finally, I find warming up really well helps. Get yourself warmed up to the point of exhaustion or do some immersion training for hours and hours in the same day and you'll find near the end that you are just doing things rather than thinking about them because you won't have the energy to do both. Perhaps rather than taking some days off you need to train more intensely to get your mind out of it.

[Nomad]

Great advice on this so far.

For kata, focusing on the breathing will help, as will many many repetitions. It may be helpful as well to do some light meditation (outside of class) to practice quieting your mind (concentrate on the slow breathing to start). 5 minutes a day is not a bad way to begin (if you use a timer, it stops you from breaking the meditation to see how much time is left!)

For sparring, one of the biggest pieces of advice I have (and one of the hardest to implement, I must admit) is to relax. If you can take away the fear, anxiety and ego from the match, it actually makes it much easier to react to your opponent's attacks and openings. It also makes your attacks much faster because you don't have to overcome the muscles that oppose your action if they're relaxed instead of stiff.

Good luck!

[Mimir]

For sparring you might try thinking about what combinations you want to throw next. I think Nomad's advice to relax while sparring is very good too. One of the things my instructors always had us do is to close our eyes and see ourselves with that next belt. This has the double effect of boosting you confidence and also reducing your anxiety.

[tko4u]

mostly just get comfortable with your martial arts. let it flow through you, not you flowing through it (whoa, that sounded deep)

practice until its natural

[tshadowchaser]

Practicing against two or more opponents at the same time dose not allow you time to think and will increase your reaction time. Make sure they are constantly attacking.
As for not thinking in forms that is something that comes from doing the form literally thousands of times

[hogstooth]

This is common and it is mainly nerves and the will to try to impress.
If you are going for your brown belt then you have experience and should know the material you will be tested for. Clear your mind of worries and do what you have been trained to do. Have confidence in your self and trust that your instructor would not test you if he didn't think you were ready.
Try not thinking about being tested and try trick your mind into thinking it is just another day in class. I would bet you don't get stuck during regular classes. It's that you have put undo stress on your self because of the test.
As an instructor I tell my students not to worry about it because I have seen them do the same thing every day of practice and this will be no different than a class. Of coarse part of the test is the stress and if you can put yourself in a state of mind that "it is what it is" and "whatever happens happens" you will find that you can go through it and your body will just take over. Don't over think it. It is just a test. If you know the material and your instructor has told you that you are ready, why second guess that?
I know easier said than done. I guess the thing is to have confidence in your abilities and your instructors judgement and stop worrying about it. Just let it happen. Mushin = no mind. Let your training take over and don't second guess yourself.

[girlbug2]

Lots and lotsof caffeine before the event. You can't think when you're really wired. Your reaction time will certainly improve!

Heh, I'm a yellow belt, take that for what it's worth:D