Blackbelt clubs, masters clubs; thoughts?

[Daniel Sullivan]

I check out a lot of schools just to see what they're doing and get ideas. I see that a lot of schools have blackbelt clubs and masters clubs. Some require a fee, but all testing fees are waived, others have discounts and such.

So here's the question: Does your school implement such a program and if so, what are the details? I'm currious as to whether or not something like this would be a good fit for our school, and wanted to get some feedback.

Thanks in advance,

Daniel

[Flying Crane]

I'm curious to know what is the reason for such a club? How is it somehow an improvement over attending class and training hard?

[terryl965]

We have no such classes, we treat everyone the same. If they come to class to learn they will and if not then that is there choice.

[bowser666]

Alot of schools use these "clubs" to get students into lengthy contracts. Not all , but most. Unless it is free, I don't see a need for it.

[shihansmurf]

We have no such classes, we treat everyone the same. If they come to class to learn they will and if not then that is there choice.

As it should be.Every student should be treated with respect and with a focus on their learning the same as every other student. BB Clubs and "accelerated" training programs are divisive, and do more to damage a schools atmosphere than they do to enhance the learning environment.

BB clubs are a great way to fleece gullible customers out of their cash. I have never encountered one where that wasn't the intent.For me they are a huge red flag that a school isn't one where I would train.

Mark

[crushing]

Every six weeks my TKD organization has a "Black Belt Workout" where black belts from the various clubs in the organization come together. It helps keep everyone on the same page in regards to the execution of forms and expectations of the different clubs. There is a $25/year "fee" that covers postage for postcard reminders.

The workouts are also excellent opportunities to share and contribute to the organization. The last workout a black belt shared some drills he learned from a Kenpoist that had visited his dojang. Also, blackbelt pre-testing and blackbelt tests fall on blackbelt workout days, twice a year.

Also, attending this class is NOT an indicator of people not training hard.

[bowser666]

Every six weeks my TKD organization has a "Black Belt Workout" where black belts from the various clubs in the organization come together. It helps keep everyone on the same page in regards to the execution of forms and expectations of the different clubs. There is a $25/year "fee" that covers postage for postcard reminders.

The workouts are also excellent opportunities to share and contribute to the organization. The last workout a black belt shared some drills he learned from a Kenpoist that had visited his dojang. Also, blackbelt pre-testing and blackbelt tests fall on blackbelt workout days, twice a year.

Also, attending this class is NOT an indicator of people not training hard.


That is some expensive postage dang !! I am sorry, but I feel benefits like that should be part of regular tuition and available for all students. You shouldn't get special training above a "regular" student because you pay a little extra.

[IcemanSK]

My school doesn't have either, nor will it ever. I see no need to have a separate club for what every student wants to be.

[crushing]

That is some expensive postage dang !! I am sorry, but I feel benefits like that should be part of regular tuition and available for all students. You shouldn't get special training above a "regular" student because you pay a little extra.

First, it's NOT special training. It's a regular part of the training. It's mandatory for ALL blackbelts to participate. It is no more special training than needing to attain a certain rank before being taught Shipjin or Pyongwon.

Perhaps I should have explained better that the organization consists of several clubs that are spread out over a large geographic area. The blackbelt workouts are a way for the individual clubs, and particularly the instructors at those clubs to understand what is expected of them and have some consistency across the organization.

I suppose if you only consider postage, that is expensive, but there is more to sending out an invitation than the $0.27 postage per printed and labelled card. It may cover some other costs too, but I think it's bargain for what I get in return. A blackbelt with difficulties coming up with $25 in a year wouldn't be turned away these workouts.

It's unfortunate your experiences with blackbelt workouts haven't been as positive.

[kidswarrior]

First, it's NOT special training. It's a regular part of the training. It's mandatory for ALL blackbelts to participate. It is no more special training than needing to attain a certain rank before being taught Shipjin or Pyongwon.
I use the BB club concept, too, and it has some similarities to this. It's for everyone who reaches a certain level on the way to black belt.

It's meant to encourage the teens I teach, who've basically failed at every organized activity they've ever tried before. And it's really a black gi *club* in the sense that I use it to try to encourage kids whose parents have often given up on them, and so who have trouble buying uniforms, to find a way to get something to sew their cool new patches on. ;)

Oh, and I've never charged for instruction, or even belts, and don't anticipate that that will ever change. My wife and I make a decent living, so this is not a problem. :)

Anyway, this may not help the discussion too much, because mine is not a commercial application of the concept, but it does use the concept--not for exclusivity, but for inclusivity.

[arnisador]

I haven't liked most implementations of this idea I've seen.

[Deaf Smith]

I have no desire to be in a snobs club.

Any and all belts are welcome to have a beer with me. Any and all are welcome to discuss ideas (you would be supprised how many good ideas come from a freash view point.)

We are all students and will always be students cause man is not prefect, never was and never will be.

Deaf

[Brian S]

As it should be.Every student should be treated with respect and with a focus on their learning the same as every other student. BB Clubs and "accelerated" training programs are divisive, and do more to damage a schools atmosphere than they do to enhance the learning environment.

BB clubs are a great way to fleece gullible customers out of their cash. I have never encountered one where that wasn't the intent.For me they are a huge red flag that a school isn't one where I would train.

Mark

Well said! Just another form of elitism and I don't have any use for elitism.

[thetruth]

These clubs in schools that require extra fees etc are solely for revenue raising. They are the brainchild of organisations such as NAPMA to help schools make money and retain students.

My old school(that I attended not owned) had both of these clubs and other classes that were a total wank. Money money money!!!!!!!

Cheers
Sam:asian:

[crushing]

Judging from the very negative comments regarding blackbelt clubs I realize I must have misunderstood what a blackbelt club was. Obviously, the blackbelt workouts we do must not be the same as the blackbelt clubs and hopefully that was clear from my description.

My apologies for my misunderstanding.

Celtic Tiger, If your organization consists of several individual schools, you may want to consider a blackbelt workout program, but it sounds like you should be leary of forming a club. Hope you find what you are looking for.

[bluekey88]

That is some expensive postage dang !! I am sorry, but I feel benefits like that should be part of regular tuition and available for all students. You shouldn't get special training above a "regular" student because you pay a little extra.


I'm going to lay devil's advocate here and say that's actually not a way to maintain standards in an org that has several schools in the area. Blackbelts are more than likely going ot be instructors, having them get together periodically to make sure everyone is teachign the curriculum appropriately seems to me the responsible things to do. It prevents "technique creep." And, as the person who brought it up mentioned, it's a chance for instrucotrs to possibly bering new ideas to the organization and improve/update the curriculum. It also appears then 25/year fee is pretty modest and only charged to those as blackbelts. This is not an opportuity that woudl benefit those not instructing.

Peace,
Erik

P.S. oops, I see this issue was already addressed.

[bluekey88]

I'm on the fence with this issue. If used as simply a money making tool with little value added, then the various 'clubs' find at some schools are a rip-off. however, if an instructor can create an 'extra' program that is worth the money then what's the harm.

It all seems to come down to price structure. In one scenario, everyone pays the same flat fee and can go to whatever classes they want. This may include extra competition team stuff, and maybe there's a demo team, maybe there's a weapons night. But maybe I don;t want to compete, and I don't demo, and maybe I can't make that weapons class. I'm losing money in a sense because I', not fully able or willing to participate in some of that extra stuff.

So, scenario b has different levels pricing base don what a consumer wants. there could be a basic level where you go to the techniques classes...you will learn the art just like anybody. then maybe you want to do some extra weapons work so you pay an extra fee to do that extra training (in an art like TKD without an inherent weapons componenet this would make sense...less so in something like Budo Taijutsu where weapons work should be part of the curriculum). Maybe I wan tto compete, so I pay a little extar for the extra competition training.

As long as I'm getting value for my money, that's ok. As long as there is no pressure ot join these clubs and it's NOT an elitist thing...jsut vlaue added stuff. Good.

I'm not sure entirely how to pull that off (but since I would like to run a school someday), it's something that bears some thought.

Peace,
Erik

[kidswarrior]

Judging from the very negative comments regarding blackbelt clubs I realize I must have misunderstood what a blackbelt club was. Obviously, the blackbelt workouts we do must not be the same as the blackbelt clubs and hopefully that was clear from my description.
I think this is a problem in this thread, or really anytime this subject comes up. We all have our own preconceptions about what *BB Club* means, often influenced by our own experience. This is not bad, as long as we're open to hearing others out and expanding the possibilities. That's why I gave my own experience, in an attempt to widen the discussion. Blue Key says something similar in musing about just what a BB club is or could be (value added, vs. gimmick), as he readies to begin his own school.

It's a little like hearing 'karate', or 'kung fu', or 'taekwondo', and lumping all the variations of these into the one or two versions we're personally familiar with. For example, the kung fu I practice is not what most people think of when they hear the term.

[Grenadier]

In many cases, those names are simply fancier terms for those who wish to pay more for extra training.

The way I see it, as long as the student is getting what he perceives to be his money's worth, then good for them!

Some schools might offer kobudo training, for example, to only those who pay for the extra training. Since the student is essentially learning a separate martial art, I have no problems with this at all, as long as the instruction the student is receiving decent instruction, and as long as the kobudo training isn't an absolute requirement for someone advancing in the empty hand art.

[Svart]

We dont have a "BB" club, but there is a night where they all get together to train. Its a much heavier work out and they concentrate on more advanced techniques. We have a lot of kids so regular classes this is a bit hard to get done. There are no extra fees of any kind, its just an extra night for the more advanced to take it up a notch without worrying about having the kids get hurt or in the way.

[mela34]

i attend a blackbelt academy that is the same you pay per course as in beginner intermediate up to blackbelt expensive is the word you cant use any safety wear unless bought from the academy so on and so on ,. the list goes on

[Tez3]

i attend a blackbelt academy that is the same you pay per course as in beginner intermediate up to blackbelt expensive is the word you cant use any safety wear unless bought from the academy so on and so on ,. the list goes on

Leave!

[Daniel Sullivan]

Thanks for the input. One of the things that I had seen at a few schools was that signing up for, or signing your kid up for, the blackbelt club meant that all testing fees were waived except the blackbelt test. Given that testing fees can really add up, if it is a one time fee that is significantly less than the sum of the testing fees, then I see it as a good thing.

Frequently, I've seen that such 'clubs' are invitation only; the student must be training hard, sometimes be of at least orange belt, and sometimes be receiving an A grade on all tests they've taken up to that point. There's usually a special uniform and/or patch associated.

I've seen some schools with a 'masters club' that has a special uniform, but I don't know what being in the masters club entails, and the schools I've seen that have it have students of colored belt ranks in it.

I posted the thread because as staff at the dojang I train in (and as one who'd like to own a school), I am looking for ways to enhance the experience of the students and trying to get an idea of what some of these things other schools offer actually are.

My school doesn't have any of these, so if you are familiar with such programs, I'd like to know what they are. If you view them negatively, then thats fine, but just saying that they're elitist or a way to make money doesn't tell me much about the program. On average, what sort of finiancial commitment, if any, is required of the customer? Or is there an average?

I don't personally see a great need to have such programs, but since I don't know too much about them, and since a lot of our competitors seem to have them, I don't want to dismiss them out of hand.

And even if we don't have them, knowing what they are would be nice, particularly if a customer asks if we have such a thing; "my little Johnny was in the black belt club at the old school and now that we're in the area, we'd like to sign him up here and he'd like to be in your blackbelt club. Do you have one?" I'd like to say something other than, 'what's a blackbelt club?' or 'I've heard of those but don't know whats involved', thus the research.

Once again, I do appreciate the input:)

Daniel

[tshadowchaser]

I check out a lot of schools just to see what they're doing and get ideas. I see that a lot of schools have blackbelt clubs and masters clubs. Some require a fee, but all testing fees are waived, others have discounts and such.

So here's the question: Does your school implement such a program and if so, what are the details? I'm currious as to whether or not something like this would be a good fit for our school, and wanted to get some feedback.

First never having been a member of such a thing it is hard for me to know exactly what they involve. My personal thought is that it makes those in such organizations feel like they are special in some way and better than those who do not belong. It seems to be just another way of saying “look at me”.
If by belonging to such a group you pay less dues, pay less or nothing for testing, get better discounts on tournaments/seminars, etc. there might be some benefit for belonging to them but then would that not be an insult to those that had not reached the required rank.

[Twin Fist]

if it gives a value for the cost, it is a good thing.

like additional training
free belt tests
free private lessons
etc

[Daniel Sullivan]

but then would that not be an insult to those that had not reached the required rank.
Well, don't belt rankings in general do that?

Daniel

[Shuto]

I don't see the problems with our BB club that others have rasied. People in the club work side by side with people who don't. All are treated equal by fellow students and instructors alike. I sense no discrimination or elitism.

Our BB club includes the fee for the BB test. Those not in the club pay the fee at test time. No discrimination there.

Our BB club includes sparring gear. Non BB club students pay seperately for their gear. Again, no discrimination.

Our BB club includes free quarterly seminars. These seminars are not part of the regular curriculum and ususally involve some kind of physical fitness training but I've also seen a class playing with Glo-Chucks and one on the legal ramifications around self-defense situation. Non emember can still attend but they pay a fee. Also, BB club members have the first opportunity to sign up before the class is opened up to the others.

The BB members sign a long-term contract for a guaranteed monthly fee. Others pay a monthly fee whose price can increase whenever...

I don't see the issue with this except perhaps the contract. But since those who do not want to commit long term can still participate in everything what's the big deal?

[YoungMan]

Black belt clubs are fine if they motivate people to keep coming. Of course they are elite-they are something you should aspire to.
There is no need for "Master's clubs". We have Masters Associations. Clubs are for black belts and academic achievers.

[stickarts]

We started a Blackbelt club which is for the students that are making the committment to not only learn the standard curriculum, but want to go above and beyond. These are the students that attend all of their normal classes and still want more. I started this program last year and so far it has worked well for us. Its not pushed hard in the school and its not just to make extra revenue. Its simply an extra place that the highly committed students can go to learn even more.

[Kacey]

We have no such classes, we treat everyone the same. If they come to class to learn they will and if not then that is there choice.

That's pretty much my theory too. I have (once) seen a program such as the one Shuto refers to - but for the most part, such clubs are an organized effort to part students from an ever-increasing amount of money. Anyone who shows up will get as much as I can give them.

[Windsinger]

The dojang I train at has a BBC. The BBC is a three year program, the regular setup is a one year. The real difference between the two is how much you can save on the three year program. With the BBC, you pay less per month, you get a 10% discount on any taining gear (boards, new doboks, etc) that you purchase, and there are no training fees. There's no guarantee you'll actually have your black belt at the end of the three years (that's dependant on how diligent you are in your training, pbviously), but it does set a goal for you. Other than those discounts, the only way you could tell who is in the BBC and who isn't is the BBC members have access to two extra classes - training/conditioning and stretching/flexibility (and even then, it's IF they choose to attend those). Other than me and my son, I couldn't tell you who is and who isn't a BBC member at my school.

Personally, I quite like the way our Sabum Nym has the program setup.

[Grenadier]

Leave!

If she's getting her money's worth in terms of quality training, and if the practices aren't unreasonable, is there a particular reason why she should leave?

Just because a particular school forbids students from buying elsewhere, does not equate to their being a bad school. Many schools implement this policy to prevent their students from going to a sporting goods chain, and buying a Century brand paper-thin uniform that will either rip in a short time, or be tossed into the garbage, because of the awful discomfort.

Other times, some will insist that you buy only USA-NKF certified sparring pads, since they don't want you to buy junk that you can't use in competition. Or, maybe they don't want students who don't know any better, buying those cheap pads that have very little padding on them. Getting hit by someone's fist while they're wearing such a glove hurts just as much as if they hit you bare-knuckled.

Before condemning a school for their practices, it's usually better to look at why they do such things. Are they charging a reasonable price, and giving quality merchandise? In those cases, that's a perfectly good answer.

On the other hand, do they only sell utter garbage at exorbitant prices, and insist that their students use such garbage? If so, than that's a rotten situation.

[Tez3]

I said leave because using the word expensive indicated that they weren't happy lol! the tone of the post was such that they didn't sound content there.
My reasoning was that if they were happy there the kit wouldn't be 'expensive' for them, they would have said it was good value even if they had to save up for the kit. Tbh they probably wouldn't have posted if they were happy with the school!

[terryl965]

Look if people like it and they believe the training is worth that extra fee than God bless the school for making some money. My only problem is every single student should recieve the same training either way. This has always been my hang up and those that say I will teach you the death touch for blank amount of cash.

[kidswarrior]

Look if people like it and they believe the training is worth that extra fee than God bless the school for making some money. My only problem is every single student should recieve the same training either way. This has always been my hang up and those that say I will teach you the death touch for blank amount of cash.Hey, I'll teach the secret, no-touch death touch for a secret pile...ahem, small amount of cash. ;)

[Grenadier]

I said leave because using the word expensive indicated that they weren't happy lol! the tone of the post was such that they didn't sound content there.

How do you know for certain, though? There is nothing in the post that says "I'm unhappy." All the poster did was simply answer what her black belt club entailed, nothing more.



My reasoning was that if they were happy there the kit wouldn't be 'expensive' for them, they would have said it was good value even if they had to save up for the kit. Tbh they probably wouldn't have posted if they were happy with the school!

Martial arts is expensive for me. I have to drive a good number of miles to get to my dojo.

If I want to do kobudo training, I have to be enrolled in the advanced program, which costs 20 dollars / month more. The high quality equipment that I end up buying costs a good bit of money. A good set of weapons for kobudo can cost hundreds of dollars. If I want to do iaido training, I need to get a decent iaito or katana, and that can cost even more. My, my... That gets expensive!

From those statement above, though, can you assume that I'm unhappy with my school? Without knowing for sure, how can you tell someone to simply leave their school?

You might be correct. Perhaps she isn't happy, but until you're certain, why light flames of discontent if there aren't any, just because someone mentioned how much something costs?

You can't base someone's happiness on how much (or how little) they're paying. I can talk about how expensive the price of ribeye steaks is getting, yet that doesn't mean that I'm unhappy with eating ribeye steaks. :)

[Darth F.Takeda]

In our art, the "Black belt Club" is those who made it to Shodan and above. (Shodan takes 4 1/2 to 6 years with us).

I hate the idea of balck belt clubs, its part of the "You'll get a BB in 2 years thing, that makes me sick and gives people the idea that they are street legal for combat.

There is an informal group in our school that I consider Elite, but we know who we are and never rubb it in others face, we just let the rest know that to be invited to one of our groups private practices is our way of saying you do and have more going on than the average person and we want you in our group to help us take it to a higher and harder level.

[Tez3]

How do you know for certain, though? There is nothing in the post that says "I'm unhappy." All the poster did was simply answer what her black belt club entailed, nothing more.



Martial arts is expensive for me. I have to drive a good number of miles to get to my dojo.

If I want to do kobudo training, I have to be enrolled in the advanced program, which costs 20 dollars / month more. The high quality equipment that I end up buying costs a good bit of money. A good set of weapons for kobudo can cost hundreds of dollars. If I want to do iaido training, I need to get a decent iaito or katana, and that can cost even more. My, my... That gets expensive!

From those statement above, though, can you assume that I'm unhappy with my school? Without knowing for sure, how can you tell someone to simply leave their school?

You might be correct. Perhaps she isn't happy, but until you're certain, why light flames of discontent if there aren't any, just because someone mentioned how much something costs?

You can't base someone's happiness on how much (or how little) they're paying. I can talk about how expensive the price of ribeye steaks is getting, yet that doesn't mean that I'm unhappy with eating ribeye steaks. :)

Perhaps they'd care to enlighten us rather than everyone guessing. I doubt saying leave is going to light any flames of discontent, if they're happy I think they'd be inclined to laugh. It's the internet who on earth is going to leave where they train because somebody they don't know has posted up lol! That's just silly and making far more of a single word post than it deserves.

[Grenadier]

Perhaps they'd care to enlighten us rather than everyone guessing. I doubt saying leave is going to light any flames of discontent, if they're happy I think they'd be inclined to laugh. It's the internet who on earth is going to leave where they train because somebody they don't know has posted up lol! That's just silly and making far more of a single word post than it deserves.

Yet, you wanted her to leave her dojo, based on your guess? Shouldn't you give a dojo the benefit of the doubt until it's actually proven that the dojo is a bad one?

I would think that it's better to know the situation (or person) before passing judgement on them.

[Daniel Sullivan]

It's the internet who on earth is going to leave where they train because somebody they don't know has posted up lol! That's just silly and making far more of a single word post than it deserves.
What!!! Man!! I quit my dojang after reading that!!

Daniel

(just kidding:P)

[Tez3]

What!!! Man!! I quit my dojang after reading that!!

Daniel

(just kidding:P)

I should think you should leave! go find a nice mcDojo where they'll charge you the earth! LOL!

Ok lets look at the word 'expensive/dear', people use those words ( well in English English anyway) when something is costing more than they think it's worth, if they think it's worth what is being charged they will say it's value for money which they will think it is even if ( I said this before) they have to save for it. Nothing is 'expensive 'if you are willing to pay for it.
I think we have one of these charming English/American translations hiccups here. if we say it's expensive or dear that means we aren't happy with the price and don't think it's worth it.

for example ...expensive (http://www.yourdictionary.com/expensive) implies having a price that is high in relation to others of its kind or that is in excess of the thing's worth.
http://www.yourdictionary.com/expensive

or from http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=expensive&r=66

Dear is commonly applied in England to something that is selling beyond its usual or just price. In the U.S., high-priced is the usual equivalent.

[Daniel Sullivan]

I should think you should leave! go find a nice mcDojo where they'll charge you the earth! LOL!

Thats right! Super size me!

Daniel

[Tez3]

Thats right! Super size me!

Daniel
I'm sure you're perfect just as you are! :ultracool

[Fiendlover]

I check out a lot of schools just to see what they're doing and get ideas. I see that a lot of schools have blackbelt clubs and masters clubs. Some require a fee, but all testing fees are waived, others have discounts and such.

So here's the question: Does your school implement such a program and if so, what are the details? I'm currious as to whether or not something like this would be a good fit for our school, and wanted to get some feedback.

Thanks in advance,

Daniel

In my school we have both.

When you reach master yellow belt, you get invited to be in Black Belt club. You get a letter saying this "We will be watching your progress very closely over the next several weeks, if you continue to train in a Black Belt Manner, and pass your Orange Belt Test you could earn your invitation to join our Black Belt Club."
Basically you get invited if you pass orange belt and it's a club that basically teaches you extra stuff. Stuff that you don't need to pass any test but it gets you higher up in the ranks if you know more, you know? It's also good to learn new katas or weapons to perform in tournaments and demos and such.

You also have to sign a contract promising 7 things and it is called a "Commitment to excellence in the martial arts." basically you're just promising to do your best at all times and go to tournaments and things like that. You also have to write a "Why I want to be in the Black Belt Club" essay and if you're a school aged student you have to give your recent report card because you're supposed to have a B average or higher to be in it.

Master club is basically the same as Black Belt club except slightly more advanced. You get invited once you're a green belt and you have to complete a test and a report to get in.

1st you have a written test and you have to answer these questions.
1. where does judo come from?
2. who is the founder
3. name three basic Judo chokes
4. write the names of 5 judo throws in english and japanese
5. write 5 judo related words and there meanings
6. where does Aikido come from
7. who is the founder
8. name three basic akido techniques.

then you answer 3 questions about the bo, knunchaku, and sai.

2nd you have to write at least a two page report on any two martial arts masters that are given. (i chose bruce lee and jackie chan). the first page has the title and the picture of the master and the second has to have info like the history, styles, and istructors in paragraph form.

3rd you have to define 3 styles, where they came from and who founded it. ex. karate came from Japan and Gichen Funakoshi founded it.
and i had to explain who founded our own studio.

Lastly you have to put all this in "a special presentation folder" and give it to your instructor at a deadline or he will take your belt until you do turn it in or at least that is what was said to me.

Hope this helps. I just fished through my karate notebook at all the information on the clubs that i have. A lot of people want to join masters club so they can go to judo class free. That's the appeal for masters club because once you're in black belt club you don't really need to go to masters club but people do it in order to do judo free. And learning Judo is a requirement to become black belt...i think. Don't quote me on that one. :uhyeah:

[terryl965]

FL any fee's along with it?

[Fiendlover]

FL any fee's along with it?
yes, to pay for the gi you wear but theres many deals you can get with it and you get discounts off new weapons and tournaments and things like that. it's actually a good deal and not that more expensive than normal class.

[jks9199]

In my school we have both.

When you reach master yellow belt, you get invited to be in Black Belt club. You get a letter saying this "We will be watching your progress very closely over the next several weeks, if you continue to train in a Black Belt Manner, and pass your Orange Belt Test you could earn your invitation to join our Black Belt Club."
Basically you get invited if you pass orange belt and it's a club that basically teaches you extra stuff. Stuff that you don't need to pass any test but it gets you higher up in the ranks if you know more, you know? It's also good to learn new katas or weapons to perform in tournaments and demos and such.

You also have to sign a contract promising 7 things and it is called a "Commitment to excellence in the martial arts." basically you're just promising to do your best at all times and go to tournaments and things like that. You also have to write a "Why I want to be in the Black Belt Club" essay and if you're a school aged student you have to give your recent report card because you're supposed to have a B average or higher to be in it.

Master club is basically the same as Black Belt club except slightly more advanced. You get invited once you're a green belt and you have to complete a test and a report to get in.

1st you have a written test and you have to answer these questions.
1. where does judo come from?
2. who is the founder
3. name three basic Judo chokes
4. write the names of 5 judo throws in english and japanese
5. write 5 judo related words and there meanings
6. where does Aikido come from
7. who is the founder
8. name three basic akido techniques.

then you answer 3 questions about the bo, knunchaku, and sai.

2nd you have to write at least a two page report on any two martial arts masters that are given. (i chose bruce lee and jackie chan). the first page has the title and the picture of the master and the second has to have info like the history, styles, and istructors in paragraph form.

3rd you have to define 3 styles, where they came from and who founded it. ex. karate came from Japan and Gichen Funakoshi founded it.
and i had to explain who founded our own studio.

Lastly you have to put all this in "a special presentation folder" and give it to your instructor at a deadline or he will take your belt until you do turn it in or at least that is what was said to me.

Hope this helps. I just fished through my karate notebook at all the information on the clubs that i have. A lot of people want to join masters club so they can go to judo class free. That's the appeal for masters club because once you're in black belt club you don't really need to go to masters club but people do it in order to do judo free. And learning Judo is a requirement to become black belt...i think. Don't quote me on that one. :uhyeah:

Somehow, I suspect that joining each of these "clubs" also entails paying an extra fee... If not directly, through mandatory participation in tournaments, etc.

But, beyond that, why should you have to join these clubs to get the advanced or extra training? I do save restrict some training to students at certain skill levels, or who have shown a certain amount of dedication... but it's a pretty minor and reasonable restriction. You don't learn the more advanced stuff till you have the basics... and you don't learn some of the more dangerous or special skills till you've proven yourself.

[Daniel Sullivan]

But, beyond that, why should you have to join these clubs to get the advanced or extra training?
Perhaps, and I'm only guessing, it keeps the advanced class limited to students who really want to be there and who have shown that they have the aptitude and or attitude to be there, thus making more efficient use of the class time. Just a guess, and probably not the main reason in most schools with such clubs, but it could be used as such.

Daniel

[chinto]

I check out a lot of schools just to see what they're doing and get ideas. I see that a lot of schools have blackbelt clubs and masters clubs. Some require a fee, but all testing fees are waived, others have discounts and such.

So here's the question: Does your school implement such a program and if so, what are the details? I'm currious as to whether or not something like this would be a good fit for our school, and wanted to get some feedback.

Thanks in advance,

Daniel
No we do not use "black belt clubs" or "masters clubs" not at all. as far as I know they are not used in the style I am part of at all.

[TheArtofDave]

I've seen some "BBC's" that aren't worth the value at all. So I don't usually believe in most.

But I guess some of them are ok. Regarding out of state tournaments have you ever considered taking donations that would build up over time to cover air fare, hotel, etc.

I just ask because it seems like it could be a good way to help cover extra expenses. And usually since most of them are a few years off until the next it would give everybody plenty of time to save in their spare time.

Just an idea I though I'd pass along.