Martial Arts With out Belts

[ace]

1. J.K.D.
2. Mauy Thai
3. Boxing
4. Wrestling
5. Kick Boxing
6. Shoot Fighting
7. Savate

____________________-------

Did i miss any.

I know the Belt System originated
With Kano's Judo
But how did the others start>??????
:burp:

[7starmantis]

Traditional CMA such as Kung Fu have no belt system either.

[ace]

I thought they war a sash
which is a type of belt???
________________________--------

That is Y i did not list them
But Thanks for the Tip:)

I will keep that in mind

[7starmantis]

Nope, no sash, no belt system at all normally.

7sm

[Matt Stone]

Usually, CMA have no "rank" system per se... just students and instructors. This is changing in the US a little, since people in the US tend to be very goal oriented (as well as the money making aspect for those schools who are less ethical in their instruction format).

In Yiliquan we wear a sash or belt (depends on the uniform and the occasion, both of which have been discussed on other threads). The real reason we wear one is as an aid to breathing training. When the sash or belt is tied snugly around the lower abdomen, it provides instant feedback on whether a student is performing their breathing correctly.

The secondary purpose of the sash or belt is a logistical one geared for the instructors - by having different colors (in Yili, it goes white, yellow, blue, green, brown, black, red), students who are training in particular areas can be more easily determined, separated, and taught more efficiently.

I don't think it is a bad idea, really. I know there are many CMA proponents who reject such a convention - they say that traditionally CMA has never employed such a system, and therefore it is bad. Whatever. I think their bigger concern is the tarnishing of the reputation of CMA on the whole by the unethical instructors, less so the changing of "tradition."

There is no standardization, however, that I am aware of (unlike JMA, where pretty much it is 10 below black, and 10 above black).

Gambarimasu.

[7starmantis]

Originally posted by Yiliquan1
The real reason we wear one is as an aid to breathing training. When the sash or belt is tied snugly around the lower abdomen, it provides instant feedback on whether a student is performing their breathing correctly.

Yes, that is the main reason you hear of CMA wearing a sash of some type.


I don't think it is a bad idea, really. I know there are many CMA proponents who reject such a convention - they say that traditionally CMA has never employed such a system, and therefore it is bad. Whatever. I think their bigger concern is the tarnishing of the reputation of CMA on the whole by the unethical instructors, less so the changing of "tradition."

Yeah, I agree with you on that one. We have a "level" system at our school, we don't wear sashes or belts to show that "rank" but it helps seperate classes and such.

7sm

[Cthulhu]

Most systems of FMA have no belts. Traditional CMA uses no belts, but a 'familial' seniority system.

Cthulhu

[Matt Stone]

The problem with "familial seniority" is that it isn't necessarily reflective of skill... Of course, that can be said for poorly managed belt systems as well.

I know that, at least in my little corner of Yiliquan, the standards are rigorously applied, and if you are at a certain level you are capable of a few things... This is maintained across the board. Sometimes "junior" grades are capable of "senior" performance, but that still doesn't get them "moved up" until they have checked the blocks for knowing the how, why, where and when of everything else...

Tough thing, these martial arts. Tougher still to maintain standards...

Gambarimasu.

[GouRonin]

The Russian Martial Art of Systema has no belts.

[MartialArtist]

Shuai chiao

wing chun doesn't really have belts, but they have a ranking system

[KennethKu]

Shuai chiao is just Chinese for wrestling. :)

[MartialArtist]

Yes, but shuai chiao is different from say, freestyle wrestling, or greco-roman

[Kiz Bell]

Koryu (old style/traditional) iaijutsu, kenjutsu and jodo have no belt/rank system. They use the "menkyo" system, which basically means you are a student until you get your teaching licence. There are a number of grades of teaching licence, and there are dan gradings I beleive, but no kyu grades. I have heard that some schools in America have instituted a kyu/dan grade system, but I have never personally encountered this, and it could be something certain schools do to get extra money. It is not part of the koryu system.

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by ace
1. J.K.D.
2. Mauy Thai
3. Boxing
4. Wrestling
5. Kick Boxing
6. Shoot Fighting
7. Savate

____________________-------

Did i miss any.

I know the Belt System originated
With Kano's Judo
But how did the others start>??????
:burp:


Primo,

Balintawak ( Filipino artial Arts from Cebu PI ) has only two ranks. Those ranks are Teacher and Student.

Rich
:asian:

[ace]

That is realy good stuff:D :D :D

[FruitLoopy]

Russian Martial Arts don't usually have belt systems.

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by FruitLoopy
Russian Martial Arts don't usually have belt systems.

You try and tie a belt up after drinking all that vodka!
:iws:

[ace]

Are there other systems?????
Other than Sombo , Sambo , Cambo?????//////:confused:

[GouRonin]

I think Sombo has belts because of the Judo/Jiujitsu influence. Such as it evolved from jiujitsu as did Judo(Japanese Randori), Brazilian JiuJitsu(Brazilian Randori) so Sombo is somewhat Russian Randori.

Each art developed the aspect they liked most about it. They have a lot of the same techniques but use certain ones more frequently. ie - The Brazilians are not big on the leg locks although they have them intheir arsenal. In fact some Brazilians look down on the holds as being cheap while the Russians don't care. The Japanese prefer to stand up more hence the Judo love of their throws.

In any case, the 3 arts kept the belts it seems but the arts origin are not cultural in Russia and Brazil.

[cali_tkdbruin]

Originally posted by GouRonin
You try and tie a belt up after drinking all that vodka!
:iws:

AH HA!!! I knew there had to be a good reason for not using a belt...:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[SteelShadow]

I dont believe krav maga has belts

[Qasim]

Originally posted by SteelShadow
I dont believe krav maga has belts

Yes. they do

[Pyros]

What Krav Maga organization is that? I know a few from the original organization of the founder and they don't use belts. Hey, they don't even wear any uniform to which they'd use the belts for. They have a ranking system of "levels" but that's it.

[sweeper]

my understanding is that most belt ranking comes from the japanese/judo, it might be easier to ask the question who outside of japan does have belts.. I know alot of south east asian martial arts may or may not have belts, by that I mean one school may use belts where as another of the same style does not..

[Pyros]

Originally posted by sweeper
my understanding is that most belt ranking comes from the japanese/judo

If I remember correctly, it was Jigoro Kano, the founder of Kodokan Judo, who established the kyu-dan belt rank system as we know it.

[Qasim]

Originally posted by Pyros
What Krav Maga organization is that? I know a few from the original organization of the founder and they don't use belts. Hey, they don't even wear any uniform to which they'd use the belts for. They have a ranking system of "levels" but that's it.

Check these links.

http://www.kravmagainc.com/levels.html

On this one you'll see the founder and a high ranking student wearing belts and the authentication letters state rank based on levels associated with belts.

http://kravmaga.com/Home/History/history.html

[Pyros]

Seems so Qasim! I guess the belt system was added quite recently. I haven't been involved with Krav Maga, but the last time I read about it with any depth (sometimes in late 80s or early 90s) they clearly said they don't use traditional belts and had some 10 or so levels.

[Qasim]

I don't know much about it at all, but I just happened to see it mentioned one day after that Jennifer Lopez movie. So I did a search and found those sites.

[SteelShadow]

I stand corrected i myself havnt had any dealing with krav maga since about 95 and the ones i seen then didnt use belts thanks for the info....

[Jay Bell]

Originally posted by Kiz Bell
Koryu (old style/traditional) iaijutsu, kenjutsu and jodo have no belt/rank system. They use the "menkyo" system, which basically means you are a student until you get your teaching licence. There are a number of grades of teaching licence, and there are dan gradings I beleive, but no kyu grades. I have heard that some schools in America have instituted a kyu/dan grade system, but I have never personally encountered this, and it could be something certain schools do to get extra money. It is not part of the koryu system.

This isn't so much the case anymore, Kiz. Some lines of Daito ryu have belt systems, Kukishinden Tenshin Hyoho....even the Tokyo style of Shinto Muso ryu Jo does. Many Koryu bujutsu ryuha have adopted the kyu/dan grading system. Kukishinden Tenshin Hyoho used kyu/dan as well as the menkyo system.