What to do

[terryl965]

What do you do when a complete ass walks into your school and makes fun of the class and he just refuse to leave.
I know call the police but by the time they come he is gone what do you do in the meantime.

Parents are watching students are watching so you just can't lay the guy out so what then?

[Brandon Fisher]

Have someone call the police while you keep him distracted. Otherwise react to the situation.

[terryl965]

What oher alternatives are there would you go ahead and laugh at there jokes and tell them to come try a class or would you be mnore insulted that they are doing this in front of your students.

[Andrew Green]

Hand him a waiver and give him a time to come back when there are no kids around, either step up or get out?

If he's making fun of your class, asking him to join is not likely going to dissuade him, you're gonna likely have to either open the door for him to try and "prove it" or call the cops and let them deal with him.

[MJS]

What do you do when a complete ass walks into your school and makes fun of the class and he just refuse to leave.
I know call the police but by the time they come he is gone what do you do in the meantime.

Parents are watching students are watching so you just can't lay the guy out so what then?

Is this an adult or child that is doing this? Seeing that they're making fun of the class, asking them to join would probably not be an option. I know that there are always discussions of challenge matches, but I'm not sure that would be a good idea either. I'm sure the Gracies welcome challenges, but I'm sure they don't do them without the proper paperwork being filled out. IMHO, the best option would be to call the police. As much as you may be tempted to physically remove them yourself, it'd probably be best to refrain from that.

Mike

[Touch Of Death]

I hear stories about what used to happen all the time. LOL, but you have a responsibility to protect your students. Even now, the instructors get up close and personal. My teacher's first instructor had actualy had people come in and discharge fire-arms.
Sean

[Kacey]

Hmm... I've never had quite that situation arise, but I have had people come to (and in a couple of cases, join) my class who were attitudinal/behavior problems. My situation - teaching in a Y - is a little different, as there are plenty of people around. Here's what I've done, however: for the first occurence, students were requested to ignore the person (works great in most cases - but only if you can tell the students this when the idiot can't hear you - otherwise it become a challenge) OR have a senior student take the person aside or take the class so I can take the person aside, so s/he quits disrupting the class. In one memorable instance, when my assistant was out sick and only kids were present, I moved the class... which did a great job of alerting the Y that there was a problem, while preventing a direct confrontation. For repeated problems, or suspected repetitions (depends on circumstances) I have taken senior students (always adults) aside and given them the history of why the person is a problem or suspected problem, and enlisted their assistance, to either help contain the person or be responsible for getting assistance. I also have this system in place in general, for emergencies - if someone should be injured or suddenly become a problem; for example, I have several students with emotional disabilities, including a couple with anger management problems - it's never been a problem in class, but I have systems in place just in case.

[Rich Parsons]

What do you do when a complete ass walks into your school and makes fun of the class and he just refuse to leave.
I know call the police but by the time they come he is gone what do you do in the meantime.

Parents are watching students are watching so you just can't lay the guy out so what then?


I give them what they want.

I stop class make them the center of attention.

I talk to them and here is what I have said before.

"You have won. I have lost.

If I fight you verbally you get what you want and I look silly.

If I fight you physically and you win then everyone here will wonder why I lost to someone like you.

If I fight you and win, then I go to jail as you will press charges.


So like I said you win and I loose.

Now please leave."

You may have to explain the studnets and parents afterwards that you have used your brain and verbal self defense to avoid the physical conflict. How you as the instructor put yourself in his way so he could not hurt the students if he decided to do something silly or stupid. This is a good way to follow up that class or the next with the self defense ideas and how it is not just fighting but being aware and thinking.


I agree not all can do this. I find no problem with it. I have been called every name in the book. So looking weak by not getting physical is not an issue with me. I know who I am. In the end I win if he leaves. (* Funny, but it has never been a she *)

If he does not leave, you can signal a senior student or someone paying attention to call the police as others have stated.

Good Luck

[bushidomartialarts]

agree with the above. have somebody call the police. also, give him your back. without apparently reacting to him, position yourself so you have your back to the interloper. continue to teach class normally.

no attention to the attention seeker, at least not until the police show up.

[Sukerkin]

Mr Parson's response is an excellent one and voices the attitude I've held all my life to violent/potentially violent confrontations. I am secure in my image of myself and, if it is what is needed to defuse a situation, it does not damage my sense of self to allow someone to feel that they have been 'the strong man'.

However, conversation and negotiation can achieve a lot more than you might think, over and above 'submission', especially when backed up by the obvious prescence of martial skill.

I know that in the States the laws are now so bass akward that the use of even the threat of force to diffuse a situation is liable to end in a day in court. Nontheless, unless you are dealing with a person who is maladjusted in some fashion, going over and asking them to leave will surely have some effect? After all, from their point of view, they are being talked to, by someone qualified enough to teach martial arts, who is unhappy with their prescence.

If they want to escalate the matter, it should be easy enough to oblige them in a fashion that ejects them without overly harming them, hopefully into the arms of the police that have been called whilst you've been talking.

I am speaking from a position of ignornace on this tho' as I've witnessed 'unruly' intrusions only twice in my life ... both recently, which tells me my sense of a decline in society is not fiction. The first time, a 'mouthy' 'teen rushed in and started to make fun only to be faced with a class of people all wielding katana ... the speed with which he departed was amusing in and of itself. The second time was a bunch of Indian lads intruding where they should not be and 'filming' us on their mobile phones. It wasn't hard to understand the object of their attentions (we have three pretty blond ladies in our class) but sensei handled it wonderfully by going over and talking to them whilst we continued to practice - after ten minutes or so they left and were in an agreeable mood as they did so.

One final point and practical question for terry. Is it not possible to lock the door after a certain agreed entry 'window'?

[jdinca]

Rich Parsons had the perfect answer.

We're a big enough school that several instructors would immediately place themselves between the individual and the students while someone called the police and somebody else reasoned with him to leave.

Were it in the morning, where I'm often by myself, I would give the class an assignment to work on while I tried to reason with the individual to leave. If he refuses, then I would call the police. Were he to make even the slightest hostile move, he would be on the ground in a hold while I had a student call the police.

Hecklers are not allowed. :)

[terryl965]

I give them what they want.

I stop class make them the center of attention.

I talk to them and here is what I have said before.

"You have won. I have lost.

If I fight you verbally you get what you want and I look silly.

If I fight you physically and you win then everyone here will wonder why I lost to someone like you.

If I fight you and win, then I go to jail as you will press charges.


So like I said you win and I loose.

Now please leave."

You may have to explain the studnets and parents afterwards that you have used your brain and verbal self defense to avoid the physical conflict. How you as the instructor put yourself in his way so he could not hurt the students if he decided to do something silly or stupid. This is a good way to follow up that class or the next with the self defense ideas and how it is not just fighting but being aware and thinking.


I agree not all can do this. I find no problem with it. I have been called every name in the book. So looking weak by not getting physical is not an issue with me. I know who I am. In the end I win if he leaves. (* Funny, but it has never been a she *)

If he does not leave, you can signal a senior student or someone paying attention to call the police as others have stated.

Good Luck


Thank you great comment

[terryl965]

Is this an adult or child that is doing this? Seeing that they're making fun of the class, asking them to join would probably not be an option. I know that there are always discussions of challenge matches, but I'm not sure that would be a good idea either. I'm sure the Gracies welcome challenges, but I'm sure they don't do them without the proper paperwork being filled out. IMHO, the best option would be to call the police. As much as you may be tempted to physically remove them yourself, it'd probably be best to refrain from that.

Mike

Mike he is an adult works in the mall has a shop that sells clothing he comes by about every other day.

[Andrew Green]

So go to his shop and start louding commenting on how ugly the clothes are and "Who would be caught in public wearing these things?" :D

[stickarts]

Only once I had a situation close to that.
I stayed very calm and professionally but firmly invited them into my office. I wanted to remove the person from the students and spectators view.
Once alone, I looked them in the eye and respectfully but firmly explained the expectations for behavior in my school.

That resolved the issue immediately.

Getting them away from the spectators and avoiding causing a scene is the first step for me.

[Lisa]

Terry,

If this is an ongoing problem then I would ready your students and parents for the next invasion. I would simply tell them that you are needing to deal with this individual and do something permanent to ensure that he no longer disrupts your class. Have a parent ready to stand up and call the police if he walks in as you speak with him in a firm manner asking him to please leave your establishment. Hopefully the police will be on their way and the parents/students won't be left in the dark.

[Andrew Green]

And document it. What time, how long, what did he say.

Even if you don't call the police do that. Then if you have to in the future you got it for them.

[kidswarrior]

Only once I had a situation close to that.
I stayed very calm and professionally but firmly invited them into my office. I wanted to remove the person from the students and spectators view.
Once alone, I looked them in the eye and respectfully but firmly explained the expectations for behavior in my school.

That resolved the issue immediately.

Getting them away from the spectators and avoiding causing a scene is the first step for me.

I like this idea a lot. :)

Also, here's a handout I use with students:
_________________________________
Occasionally someone who is not a Kempo Kung Fu student--seeking to humilate me or a student and so 'prove' our art 'doesn't work' in the real world--will challenge one of us to 'spar' or 'fight'. I always decline, and ask my students to do the same. The reasons are:


If I don't hurt him,
The fool will think me weak.

If I block or strike with power,
the fool will be hurt.

If I unleash my full Kung Fu,
the fool will be crippled or killed.


__________________________________

We talk about the negative outcomes associated with each of these possibilities: The first, it may gnaw at me forever; the second, I will feel badly, and may end up in court; the third, I'm going to prison for my 'golden years'. We also talk about how if something happens to me or the school, their study is over, too. So, we're all vested in a non-violent outcome.

At the same time, however, if challenged in front of the class, I don't back up, and I don't explain beyond this statement: We don't fight for fun. Now if they want to attack me or one of the students, that's their choice, and I would then have to take action. But so far no one has decided to do that. When they get no more reaction than that one statement, and everyone in class is calm, they leave.

Just the way I do it. But many good ideas in this thread. :ultracool

[jks9199]

Mike he is an adult works in the mall has a shop that sells clothing he comes by about every other day.
If your shop is in the mall, you might have a recourse through the mall management. Many malls don't want the different businesses actively disrupting each other's business; that's bad for everyone. (Competition is not the same as actively disrupting!)

Contact the management office with the name (if possible) of the jerk, and the business he works for. Tell them you want him banned from YOUR store/school, and if necessary, banned from the mall.

[Brian R. VanCise]

I give them what they want.

I stop class make them the center of attention.

I talk to them and here is what I have said before.

"You have won. I have lost.

If I fight you verbally you get what you want and I look silly.

If I fight you physically and you win then everyone here will wonder why I lost to someone like you.

If I fight you and win, then I go to jail as you will press charges.


So like I said you win and I loose.

Now please leave."

You may have to explain the studnets and parents afterwards that you have used your brain and verbal self defense to avoid the physical conflict. How you as the instructor put yourself in his way so he could not hurt the students if he decided to do something silly or stupid. This is a good way to follow up that class or the next with the self defense ideas and how it is not just fighting but being aware and thinking.


I agree not all can do this. I find no problem with it. I have been called every name in the book. So looking weak by not getting physical is not an issue with me. I know who I am. In the end I win if he leaves. (* Funny, but it has never been a she *)

If he does not leave, you can signal a senior student or someone paying attention to call the police as others have stated.

Good Luck

This is a very nice way to handle a situation like this. Unfortunately there are jerks in this world and sometimes they just have to act very, very stupid. If this happened Terry I am sorry that it did but I am sure you handled it well. Personally after class starts at my Training Hall the door is locked and entry is admitted only to late arriving students.

[pstarr]

Ask him if his grandmother picked out the clothes he's wearing...

[terryl965]

This is a very nice way to handle a situation like this. Unfortunately there are jerks in this world and sometimes they just have to act very, very stupid. If this happened Terry I am sorry that it did but I am sure you handled it well. Personally after class starts at my Training Hall the door is locked and entry is admitted only to late arriving students.

Thanks everybody we had a converstation today and he apologies and said he was only kidding. He says he would like to apologies to my students as well and he also signed up for classes. I guess he was just joking all the time.

[Lisa]

Thanks everybody we had a converstation today and he apologies and said he was only kidding. He says he would like to apologies to my students as well and he also signed up for classes. I guess he was just joking all the time.

Well that turned out well then.

When he comes for a class...make him the Uke :D

[Sukerkin]

I'm very pleased that you managed to sort it out, Terry and that the 'conversation and negotiation' stance (as opposed to 'aggression and confrontation') gets another tick in the 'that works' box :) :tup:.

[Touch Of Death]

Thanks everybody we had a converstation today and he apologies and said he was only kidding. He says he would like to apologies to my students as well and he also signed up for classes. I guess he was just joking all the time.Some people just feel the need to be put in thier place before they act respectable
Sean

[jdinca]

Glad it worked out. Sounds like he didn't get until you talked to him. And now, very possibly due to your talk, you have a new student!

[Brandon Fisher]

Good news came from bad in this situation. Glad it all worked out.

[kuntawguro]

The fight you have to fight you lose- as stated before- I like the definition of a verbal block- that is the first action when you cannot leave a situation. Kudos Terry for maintaining yourself and being level headed.

[Skip Cooper]

Great ending to this thread...and for a quote from one of my favorite movies:

"Fighting always last answer to problem."
The Karate Kid