Training Regime

[Chu-Chulain]

What kind of training regime do most people have or reccomend?

What sort of breakdown in activity is appropriate between:

Basics (kicks, blocks, strikes, stances, etc.)
Maneouvers / combination moves
Techniques
Forms/ Sets
Sparring
Stretching
Cross Training (weights, aerobics, etc.)
Other??

Personally I am interested in advancing to Black Belt and teaching, which has always interested me.

[Brother John]

I really think that it depends on the level of the person being taught.
Also: is this a question about ones personal time (solo) training OR time in a structured class?
If you clarify this I think I could spew out my thoughts better.
Thanks
Your Brother (waiting to spew:barf: )
John

[Chu-Chulain]

Thanks for the reply, I was begginning to wonder whether anyone was listening!!

This was meant as a general question to get some feedback and discussion going, which clearly didn't work...

I guess I would be interested to see some thoughts on this based upon beginner (white through Green?), intermediate (Brown through 1st Dan?) and advanced (2nd Dan and up?).

Personally I am begginner (based upon classification above) and do about:

Basics (kicks, blocks, strikes, stances, etc.) - 1 hour per week
Maneouvers / combination moves - 1 hour per week
Techniques - 2 hours per week
Forms/ Sets - 1.5 hours per week
Sparring - 0
Stretching/ Yoga - 2 hours per week

The time includes 30 minutes private, 2-4 hours group class and the balance at home practice.

[SingingTiger]

I haven't really broken it down in terms of how many hours per week I do each thing, but here's a brief description of the group classes at my school (all are one hour):

Monday (blue belt and above): about 15 minutes of stretching/warm-ups, the remainder spent on somewhat advanced concepts (the most recent have been fluidity in connecting moves, and speed vs. form). The activity level is highly variable.

Tuesday (all levels, but only solid yellow and above do any actual sparring): 15-20 minutes of stretching/warm-ups, 15-30 minutes of sparring drills in the air, 15-30 minutes of sparring and "semi-sparring" (attacking an opponent who can block but not counter, etc.).

Wednesday (all levels): 10-15 minutes of stretching/warm-ups, the remainder spent on combinations and techniques. Usually geared toward proper form.

Thursday (all levels): 10-15 minutes of stretching/warm-ups, the remainder spent on combinations, techniques, and forms. Usually geared more toward fluidity.

Saturday (all levels): 30 minutes of stretching/warm-ups/calisthenics, the remainder spent on combinations, techniques, and forms. Usually geared more toward proper form.

I usually hit the Monday, Thursday, and Saturday classes. Those, plus a half-hour of private instruction and a few short workouts at home are how I train.

Rich

[Brother John]

That was a quote from the creator of the art Kyukoshinkai Karate-Do. I kinda like it, not really workable in today's pace of life, but wouldn't it be great?

I am a BIG believer in dedicated self-improvement. Like I tell the guys who train with me: "It's in class that you learn and on your own that you get Good." Therefore I think that a person’s progress lies a great deal in his or her own personal dedication to daily hard work. Nothing replaces good hard work.
IF someone does their 'homework' it REALLY shows a great deal!

What I like to do is to cycle my workouts according to different rank level curriculums. Each night begins with going through the forms, and then sets then the yellow belt material followed by the level I’m concentrating on that evening.
1. Forms, sets then Yellow and Orange.
2. Forms, sets then Yellow and Purple.
3. Forms, sets then Yellow and Blue…etc. etc…
By keeping yellow at the beginning of each evening I keep the basics firmly in ‘first place’, as they should be. If time is an issue on a particular day I might cut out the yellow belt material, but I like to keep it in place.

I like this set up. After I get up to my current rank I do two consecutive nights there and then the last night of the cycle I work the material that I am currently learning for the next belt rank.

This cycle would take 10-11 days before it repeats (for a 1st degree black belt that is).
By doing it this way I can go through the entire curriculum 2-3 times each month w/out skipping a thing. Only thing I can’t do are the several drills in the AKKI that require a 2nd person. These I get to with the guys who train with me. At lower ranks a person could go through their entire store of knowledge w/in a week easily… really accelerating their growth.

As far as other supplementary work, I do ride my exercise bike, lift weights and do yoga. But I separate these things from my Kenpo workouts. As I’ve always said: the best way to get better at doing Kenpo is to do more Kenpo. Supplemental work is great; as long as what it is doing is supplementing an already significant amount of work in the basics of your art…otherwise all you are doing is trying to make up for what you should be doing in Kenpo. ((Hope I’m making sense to you, sometimes I’m wordy))

As far as a classroom setting, that’s up to the instructor. How do I conduct my classes that I lead????
Trade secret…

;)
Your Brother
John

[Chu-Chulain]

Thanks to both for the input.

I have found the formal classes I attend lacking in decent stretching, which being mid-30s can be a problem for my tired and inactive muscles. Hence I have instituted a fairly focused stretching program at home.

I like the cyclical training regime, I currently do something a bit similar, but with no real formal cycle. Some nights I practice one belt's material, other nights a different and some nights a cross section. Also I mix up between techniques and basics, doing more techniques than basics. I try and do some forms everyday and intersperse the Yoga with the stretching.

My main focus is Kenpo and having a solid pace of advancement. I think it will have a go at the cyclical training approach.

One thing I question is if I am getting the most out of each technique. The number of times I practise a technique and how focused I am depends on how comfortable I am with it and/or if I like it. I am wondering if I need more quality/time on each aspect, versus trying to get through everything in one session, i.e. instead of doing all Orange techniques 2-3 times over in one night, just do 5 of them maybe 12-15 times?

Any thoughts?

[brianhunter]

Just take your vitamins and say your prayers just like all the good little hulkamaniacs out there!!!!

WHATCHA GONNA DO BROTHER! When hulk hogan and his 24 inch pythons come down on you!!!

[Brother John]

I had forgotten about Hulk's 'good guy' days.


One thing I question is if I am getting the most out of each technique. The number of times I practise a technique and how focused I am depends on how comfortable I am with it and/or if I like it. I am wondering if I need more quality/time on each aspect, versus trying to get through everything in one session, i.e. instead of doing all Orange techniques 2-3 times over in one night, just do 5 of them maybe 12-15 times?

Hmmm... quality.
That's a micro-cycle question. You see, the cyclical plan I presented is the BIG picture (macro-cycle).... then you get into the issue of competency, or as you put it... quality, which is a specific/particular issue (micro-cycle). If there is a particular technique that is giving me problems, I have time set aside to focus on it. I practice it very slowly at first, gradualy building up speed...etc. I do this toward the cardinal directions of the room so that my competency is not dictated by direction. ((Ever get really good at doing a form by facing the north side of your gym, then your instructor makes you face east? I did. Didn't like the results. Now I use every direction.)) If it continues to give you problems analyze the crap out of it and ASK YOUR TEACHERS!!! By teachers I mean more than just your instructor (though you should begin there), but everyone that you learn from and trust.
If you are having a particularly difficult time with several techniques, make a separate workout time just for these techniques.
Just a thought...
Your Brother
John

[Brother John]

If you do the micro-cycle and the macro-cycle and create another cycle...
you will be on your Tricycle....
:boing2:
Your brother
John

[meni]

Originally posted by Brother John

If you do the micro-cycle and the macro-cycle and create another cycle...
you will be on your Tricycle....
:boing2:
Your brother
John
And we will call you tricycle macrocycle microcycle dude

Dr. Seuss

[meni]

Originally posted by Brother John

That was a quote from the creator of the art Kyukoshinkai Karate-Do. I kinda like it, not really workable in today's pace of life, but wouldn't it be great?

I am a BIG believer in dedicated self-improvement. Like I tell the guys who train with me: "It's in class that you learn and on your own that you get Good." Therefore I think that a person’s progress lies a great deal in his or her own personal dedication to daily hard work. Nothing replaces good hard work.
IF someone does their 'homework' it REALLY shows a great deal!

What I like to do is to cycle my workouts according to different rank level curriculums. Each night begins with going through the forms, and then sets then the yellow belt material followed by the level I’m concentrating on that evening.
1. Forms, sets then Yellow and Orange.
2. Forms, sets then Yellow and Purple.
3. Forms, sets then Yellow and Blue…etc. etc…
By keeping yellow at the beginning of each evening I keep the basics firmly in ‘first place’, as they should be. If time is an issue on a particular day I might cut out the yellow belt material, but I like to keep it in place.

I like this set up. After I get up to my current rank I do two consecutive nights there and then the last night of the cycle I work the material that I am currently learning for the next belt rank.

This cycle would take 10-11 days before it repeats (for a 1st degree black belt that is).
By doing it this way I can go through the entire curriculum 2-3 times each month w/out skipping a thing. Only thing I can’t do are the several drills in the AKKI that require a 2nd person. These I get to with the guys who train with me. At lower ranks a person could go through their entire store of knowledge w/in a week easily… really accelerating their growth.

As far as other supplementary work, I do ride my exercise bike, lift weights and do yoga. But I separate these things from my Kenpo workouts. As I’ve always said: the best way to get better at doing Kenpo is to do more Kenpo. Supplemental work is great; as long as what it is doing is supplementing an already significant amount of work in the basics of your art…otherwise all you are doing is trying to make up for what you should be doing in Kenpo. ((Hope I’m making sense to you, sometimes I’m wordy))

As far as a classroom setting, that’s up to the instructor. How do I conduct my classes that I lead????
Trade secret…

;)
Your Brother
John

You convince me I starting this week!

[Chu-Chulain]

I completely agree on the direction issue, especially with the forms. I think the first dozen or so times its a good idea to keep consistent on direction, to help fix the movements in the grey matter, after that its a great idea to face different directions for different sessions.

On techniques I was actually practising quite a bit in one spot at home in front of a large mirror. Space was a bit restrictive for some moves, so I shifted to another area. I have decided that being in front of the mirror doesn't offer as much value as I thought. In fact now I find it easier with attack visualization. Based on your tip, I will also start varying the direction I face.

I guess your point about which way to face could be expressed as to be both uni-directional and multi-directional. It is also key to focus on the motor skills, so now we have a:

Macrocycle
Microcycle
Unicycle
Multicycle
Motorcycle

MMUMMs the Word!

[RCastillo]

Originally posted by brianhunter

Just take your vitamins and say your prayers just like all the good little hulkamaniacs out there!!!!

WHATCHA GONNA DO BROTHER! When hulk hogan and his 24 inch pythons come down on you!!!

Hey, Thanks for the recognition!:samurai:

[Brother John]

Macrocycle
Microcycle
Unicycle
Multicycle
Motorcycle


If you do it over and over again
that would be a
recycle

:lol:
:rolleyes:
:shrug:

...ok, so it wasn't as funny as yours.
No fair!
You took all the good ones.
;)
Your Brother
John

[brianhunter]

Originally posted by Brother John

Macrocycle
Microcycle
Unicycle
Multicycle
Motorcycle


If you do it over and over again
that would be a
recycle

:lol:
:rolleyes:
:shrug:

...ok, so it wasn't as funny as yours.
No fair!
You took all the good ones.
;)
Your Brother
John

so whats the classification of a stationary bike then? Where do you find all these animated gifs brother??

[Brother John]

If you practice various turning/spinning techniques then you are on
SPINcycle...
:D
Better than the last one I guess....



Where do you find all these animated gifs brother??

Evidence of several misspent evenings, surfing the web!

Your Brother
John

[Kirk]

I like it!

[Brother John]

Try these:

[Brother John]

here goes, stand back....

[meni]

Originally posted by Brother John

Try these:
can you give as the web link please?

[Brother John]

These are just images that I've downloaded in the past.
I found them with a search engine by searching for:
Free, Animated, +Gif

should come up with several good sites.
I like searching with these:
www.wisenut.com
www.google.com
www.searchalot.com

let me know how it goes...
happy hunting...
Your Brother
John

[meni]

thanks

[Elfan]

Originally posted by Chu-Chulain

What kind of training regime do most people have or reccomend?

What sort of breakdown in activity is appropriate between:

Basics (kicks, blocks, strikes, stances, etc.)
Maneouvers / combination moves
Techniques
Forms/ Sets
Sparring
Stretching
Cross Training (weights, aerobics, etc.)
Other??

Personally I am interested in advancing to Black Belt and teaching, which has always interested me.

If I may I'm going to change your break down somewhat.

- The stuff you are trying to learn
- The ciricullm (forms, sets, techniques etc.) that you use to practice the stuf you are trying to learn
- other exercies to learn "the stuf"
- other good stuf (stretching, weight lifting etc.)

The point I am trying to make here is that what I feel one should be practicing is not the curriculum per se but rather use the curriculum to help you train whatever it is you want to train. For example, if you wanted to focus on posture you could use short form 1, universal form 1 (AKKS I believe), your own form, a green belt technique line, point sparring, etc. If you wanted to work on your attitude you could do contact sparring, go for a grappling session for 30 minutes with no breaks, practice long form 3 by yourself for X times without taking a break. The curriculum is not the ends but one of many means.

For our "other good stuff" category spend whatever time is appropriate. Their are *many* different philosophies on how much time should be spent strength training and how you should go about doing it, for example. I would prefer that that is left to the individual but stretching before formal classes are popular almost all schools and probably a good idea too.

Did that help with what you were actually asking at all?



Originally posted by Brother John

"train more than you sleep"

That was a quote from the creator of the art Kyukoshinkai Karate-Do. I kinda like it, not really workable in today's pace of life, but wouldn't it be great?

Until you laugh at yourself years later and wonder at how amazingly uninteligent your training was by your standards now. A little moderation mixed in with long term comitment and thinking quality before quanitity will go a long way (no I am not speaking from experience, I don't think their are many people with the motivation to train 16 hours a day, and if their are I'm not one of them).

[Brother John]

ciricullm

huh???
;)
Your Brother
John
PS: though not a proper word, stuff is spelled with 2 Fs.

[Brother John]

quanitity

??????????????????????????

Just kidding.
I mess up more than you do anyway...
have a good one..
Your Brother
John

PS: Why wait years to laugh at myself?
I do it all the time.
"Angels fly because they take themselves lightly."
Robin Williams

[Brother John]

A little moderation mixed in with long term comitment and thinking quality before quanitity will go a long way

That is key! To take your training REGULARLY, but at a pace and amount that fits you and your drive. Personally I try to train about two hours a day... when time permits. But I don't beat myself up if I only get 20 minutes either. The big thing I think is to be consistent and persistant!!! To overdo it is to burn oneself out. Burn out is a very big adversary in the martial arts I think. Been there often. But to keep at it, to train on days that you don't even feel like getting out your belt... those are the days that make the difference between a Kenpo hobbiest and a Kenpoist. Right now I'm dealing with an injury so I must take more time to go through my training, cuz I'm doing Kenpo at Tai-Chi speed right now. But I'm getting a lot done as far as working on fluidity and form. Trick is to turn even our apparent set backs into stepping stones for our future.

OK...I'm preaching.....
later bro..
Your Brother
John

[jeffkyle]

Originally posted by Brother John

That is key! To take your training REGULARLY, but at a pace and amount that fits you and your drive. Personally I try to train about two hours a day... when time permits. But I don't beat myself up if I only get 20 minutes either. The big thing I think is to be consistent and persistant!!! To overdo it is to burn oneself out. Burn out is a very big adversary in the martial arts I think. Been there often. But to keep at it, to train on days that you don't even feel like getting out your belt... those are the days that make the difference between a Kenpo hobbiest and a Kenpoist. Right now I'm dealing with an injury so I must take more time to go through my training, cuz I'm doing Kenpo at Tai-Chi speed right now. But I'm getting a lot done as far as working on fluidity and form. Trick is to turn even our apparent set backs into stepping stones for our future.

OK...I'm preaching.....
later bro..
Your Brother
John


Tai-Chi Kenpo...now there is a combination! I will have to see that one to believe it! :)

[brianhunter]

Originally posted by Brother John

That is key! To take your training REGULARLY, but at a pace and amount that fits you and your drive. Personally I try to train about two hours a day... when time permits. But I don't beat myself up if I only get 20 minutes either. The big thing I think is to be consistent and persistant!!! To overdo it is to burn oneself out. Burn out is a very big adversary in the martial arts I think. Been there often. But to keep at it, to train on days that you don't even feel like getting out your belt... those are the days that make the difference between a Kenpo hobbiest and a Kenpoist. Right now I'm dealing with an injury so I must take more time to go through my training, cuz I'm doing Kenpo at Tai-Chi speed right now. But I'm getting a lot done as far as working on fluidity and form. Trick is to turn even our apparent set backs into stepping stones for our future.

OK...I'm preaching.....
later bro..
Your Brother
John


Hey Brother (I feel like hulk hogan everytime I say that) Im all about the tai chi kenpo HAHAHa we all cant be speedsters like jeff !!!

[Elfan]

Originally posted by Brother John


Originally posted by Elfan

ciricullm

huh???
;)
Your Brother
John
PS: though not a proper word, stuff is spelled with 2 Fs.

I managed to spell it with 4 "i"s once while writing it, spell checker and myself weren’t on the same page on how to fix it apparently.

The moderation thing is something I really had to learn the hard way. I haven’t been a member of a school for over 6 months now. Initially after I left I had some pretty regular training going with friends. However, that tapered off somewhat as people moved/schedules changed. After than I went to a couple of seminars where I would end up training 6+ hours a day for several days straight. However, after getting back I would constantly kick myself for not training enough. It became this cycle where I wasn’t happy when I wasn't training and I wasn't happy when I was training because I wasn't training enough. I think since then I have (hopefully) gotten over that somewhat. I train in little bits (10 minutes here, 10 more there, hit the desk a lot during class until the person in front of me starts complaining) and have been working on memorizing one quote/definition/principle a day. As you might have gathered above I'm not into memorizing lots of techniques but I really wish I had been stricter about knowing what the terminology I was using actually meant.

[jeffkyle]

Originally posted by brianhunter

Hey Brother (I feel like hulk hogan everytime I say that) Im all about the tai chi kenpo HAHAHa we all cant be speedsters like jeff !!!

Why not?