Etiquette

[Mickey]

Hi all,

I was curious about etiquette in general.
I know that people have bows and salutes, and say sir, yet
is this taught the first class, or on going over the first few classes or monthes?


Mick

[7starmantis]

Originally posted by Mickey

Hi all,

I was curious about etiquette in general.
I know that people have bows and salutes, and say sir, yet
is this taught the first class, or on going over the first few classes or monthes?


Mick

My school is very laid back when it comes to that aspect. My Sifu will never tell you to your face to bow when entering the building, or bow to him, or what not. Our bows are more earned out of respect than anything. Our senior students lead by example and everyone pretty much picks it up. When someone else bows to you, you are pretty disrespectful not to bow back, then you pick up on bowing yourself.
Just my schools take on it.

7sm

[Skarbromantis]

Our school we dont do any of that, but in other schools I have heard:

Bow in and bow out when entering the school

Never place hands on hips, keep them at side or crossed behind the back

Dont speek when Sifu is speeking

anyone have any others

Skard1

[cdhall]

Originally posted by Mickey

Hi all,

I was curious about etiquette in general.
I know that people have bows and salutes, and say sir, yet
is this taught the first class, or on going over the first few classes or monthes?


Mick

We teach all the etiquette in the intro lessons.
:asian:

[tshadowchaser]

Much of the etiquette is taught the first day.
Some of it must be learned as time goes by.
SImple courtesy is perhaps the most important to me

[Skarbromantis]

Yeah but what is taught?

What are the common ones for most schools?

Not that I really care , just a little courious.

Skard1

[Master of Blades]

We are just taught to respect those of a higher grade then us and to be polite and courteouse.

[GouRonin]

The best way to meet new schools is to walk right in wearing a hockey helment and yell, "I'm a super ninja and I can kick y'all's butts! Who's first for the ride of pain?"

School owners and head instructors like that sort of thing.
:rolleyes:

[Master of Blades]

Gou.....what did I tell you bout spamming!

[Aegis]

In Jujitsu we gradually introduce novices to the idea of etiquette. We teach to bow as you enter the dojo, wait by the side of the mat to be bowed on by the senior grade present, bow before training with a partner, bow after training with a partner, bow to the sensei/sempai after they demonstrate a technique on you, bow to the sensei when demonstrating a technique......

The list goes on for a while. And includes weapon etiqutte at the higher levels....

PS: Just noticed.... I'm the same grade on Martial talk as I am in my current style of Jujitsu..... how cool!

[GouRonin]

Nothing I say is spam! My words are to be written down on stone tablets like the gospel they are foolish one!
:eek:

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by Aegis
Blah blah blah...I wasn't listening really..

I love Aegis' avatar. It looks like me in the morning.
:rofl:

[Idaten]

I think the main problem with modern martial arts is this "laid back" attitude. Etiquette is so very important. One cannot truly appreciate the art without it. Not bowing to sensei/sempai is unthinkable. As is not bowing when entering or exiting the dojo, not training in a traditional Gi, etc.

[Skarbromantis]

bow as you enter the dojo

bowed on by the senior grade present

bow after training with a partner

bow to the sensei/sempai

The list goes on for a while

I train PM we have none of that, thank god, all that bowing, make your head spin :D


Here's how it happens in my school:

"Hay Sifu how are you?"

Senior student- Hay Skard, lets touch hands (no belt ranks) no bowing.

After Sifu show's a move, "Thank You Sifu"

Walk in and out as you like, no bow

Class is between 1-4, show up when you like, leave when you like.

[Skarbromantis]

Originally posted by Idaten

I think the main problem with modern martial arts is this "laid back" attitude. Etiquette is so very important. One cannot truly appreciate the art without it. Not bowing to sensei/sempai is unthinkable. As is not bowing when entering or exiting the dojo, not training in a traditional Gi, etc.

Maybe for Karate, but with CMA, its very diffrent, we dont have to wear any uniform, will that make my Kung Fu any better? I do agree on bowing when meeting others outside of the club, like at a seminar, or school meet, or if I meet a fellow MA on the street or in passing then I bow, but in class never.

Not that is a bad thing, just diffrent by style.

Skard1

[muayThaiPerson]

at my gym, we are forced to by gunpoint!! jk

no, at out gym, we all bow together when the class starts and ends

[karatekid1975]

We are taught some etiquette in intro classes. It's mainly the "norm". Bow in and out, to the instructors, fellow students, saying yes/no sir'ma'am, no cursing, no chewing gum, wear a clean proper uniform when training, ect ect ect. It's prolly the same in most dojangs (that I know of).

[DWright]

I started in a very traditional karate school. Bow in bow out, bow to rank, address the instructor as sensei etc.

In my school we do bow in and out, and bow to each training partner, but the rest of class is fairly informal. I am requiring my students to use a much more traditional respect at seminars that we attend as a group, or ones that we are hosting.

I have been a guest at a taekwondo school, and felt very lucky to have the traditional training. They follow the same rigid formalities that I started with. The only etiquette that I was not familiar with was to turn away from the flag and senior ranks when straightening the uniform.

[H@pkid0ist]

The whole bowing and attitude thing is part of the whole character building aspect of our training. We try and impliment everything on day one but are not strick about it for a while. Respect is earned but sometimes how is learned. Character building is as big a part of the training as anything else.

[Mickey]

THank you everyone.

I went to a class on Sunday and the Senior Students knew the respect and said 'Sir', yet all the newbies, not even in uniform were yeah/ nahw and huh? No yes/no sirs and very little bowing only when they all lined up at the end.

I was jsut curious

Mick

[chufeng]

The first lesson taught and the last lesson learned is HOW to bow.

It's not a religious thing...
It is about respect, to some degree, but more about humility and emptying the vessel to allow room for fresh waters.

It is a relatively easy lesson as a beginner...but a more complex lesson as a senior in any system...

When seniors from other systems come to train with me, it is very hard for them to empty their cups...hard for me to share when the lesson is met with resistance.

I went through this myself...and am a little ashamed at my being FULL when entering another's training hall...I learned many lessons, but, unfortunately, after I left because I didn't think there was anything of value to be gained byt training with the "other" group.

External disciplines applied by a school are a start...but the student must internalize that lesson...must not let any advanced rank from getting in the way of learning...

my thoughts...worth little.

:asian:
chufeng

[7starmantis]

Originally posted by Skarbromantis

Maybe for Karate, but with CMA, its very diffrent, we dont have to wear any uniform, will that make my Kung Fu any better? I do agree on bowing when meeting others outside of the club, like at a seminar, or school meet, or if I meet a fellow MA on the street or in passing then I bow, but in class never.

Not that is a bad thing, just diffrent by style.

Skard1

Yes it is very different with most PM schools I think. Its allways fun to see a new student that comes from karate or somehting come in and start bowing to everyone and everything! Kinda funny actually. We call our instructor Sifu, but I have never heard him say anything about calling him Sifu, we just allways do. Some bow when entering or leaving the school, but its usually a small bow. I think thats about it. IT all just depends on the student. Most of us shake hands rather than bowing to each other, some of our students hug, its really up to the student. I usually don't see many people act disrespectful to my Sifu, he is just so nice and respectful, most people just feel normal being respectful back.

7sm

[karatekid1975]

DWright wrote:

"The only etiquette that I was not familiar with was to turn away from the flag and senior ranks when straightening the uniform. "

Really? I thought this was normal. Any dojang that I visited/trained at all did this.

One thing that makes feel like a little kid is that we are not even allowed to "flinch" during the student oath. I donno why, but every time we say the student oath, my nose itches LOL.

[Despairbear]

To thoughs who do not belive in the importance of bowing in the dojo. Bowing is the start of discipline, which is one of the foundations of MA training (in my mind). Without discipline we are not martial artists we are thugs and bullies. I feel that it is grossly iresponceable to train some one in the arts of combat and not teach them the discipline to know when to use that training, I feel that bowing and etiquette are the start.


Despair Bear

[chufeng]

Excellent post DespairBear

chufeng

[Master of Blades]

I agree..........

[karatekid1975]

Me three. I agree also.

[Damian Mavis]

Ya even an art like Muay Thai is big on bowing and respect. In fact I can't think of any art I do that doesnt have some sort of bowing or sign of respect. Pencak Silta, Kali, TKD, Muay Thai, BJJ.... it's almost universal.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

[cdhall]

Well said Despair Bear.
Reminds me of point #7:
"A warrior without honor is a thug"
http://www.nckka.org/philosophy.htm

I love that quote.
:asian:

[7starmantis]

I think if a little more of this "etiquette" you guys have all mentioned showed through more in everyday life and on this forum, it would make things quite a bit better.


7sm