Gracie's are frauds!!!

[hand2handCombat]

i honostly dont believe this *****. but take a look for yourself
http://www.countdante.com/countdante.html for defend.net( http://www.defend.net/deluxeforums/showthread.php?threadid=5669 )

[J-kid]

Counte dante i could have kicked that clowns ass. What a dumbass thinking that the gracies and bruce lee copyed him. He dosnt even do BJJ . WHAT A LOAD OF ****. Sorta funny

[MartialArtist]

You don't have to do BJJ to be a great fighter, and BJJ is no better or worse than any of the arts he has taken, BJJ from what a lot of people see on TV is a different BJJ geared toward the UFC rather than the all-out BJJ.

Seriously, nobody copied him. They might have gotten some principles from him, but if he was as all that he was up to be, then he would be better known.

And the title of being the "Deadliest Man Alive" - hahahahahahahahahahahaha, what a joke, the deadliest guy alive IMO was an old guy from Asia a couple hundred years ago, but you can't match him up.

Bruce Lee copied him? So all his extra training and extra studying and his library containg something thousand books were just a hoax?

The Gracies copied him? The Gracies learned jujitsu from a Japanese immigrant if I remember and they changed the training regime a bit to their liking and added a couple of techniques.

[hand2handCombat]

i agree that ufc bjj is different from traditional. just like many other arts. for example, MT has lots different techniques include grappling but ppl are so much into "The Ring" that they forget it.

back to the subject now.

id like to see this guy tell that to a gracies face. ooooooooooohhh:armed:. and if mr bruce lee was here :uzi: ouch

[Angus]

The MT grappling does happen in the ring. It's just neck wrestling, I don't think they have any groundfighting in traditional Muay Thai. I don't know how much actual ring time YOU'VE had, but I don't think I want to do any neck wrestling with any guys who are pure grapplers, because I'm going to get beaten. In non-MMA fights, I see it all the time. In MMA though, you do the techniques that will work best against the specific opponent, and since most these days are submission wrestlers/grapplers of some sort, and MT guy isn't going to want to neck wrestle because it will go to the ground very quickly, giving the opponent the advantage.

I'd never believe a bio this outrageous when it's from the persons personal website. It just makes it harder to believe. It's BS. Don't get so worked up about it.

[7starmantis]

Count Dante was never defeated, tied or even injured in any of the full contact, no holds barred matches he had had against some of the world's top experts, and masters of Street fighting, Judo, Karate, Kung Fu, Boxing, Wrestling, Savate, Tai Chi Chuan, Aikido, Jiu-Jitsu, Dim Mak or other forms of self defense or fighting arts.


:rofl: :rofl:
Wow, what do we define as injured? A bloddy nose? That would be hard to believe!


7sm

[MartialArtist]

Very unreliable source.

[Shinzu]

just another prime example of.. you cant believe everything you read.

sound like alot of web trash to me!

[RyuShiKan]

People like him are the reason I tell me students to stay off drugs.;)

[Shinzu]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan

People like him are the reason I tell me students to stay off drugs.;)

LOL....that is too funny:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[tonbo]

Hahahahahahahaha.......

Please......stop.....yer killin' me.....

Count DANTE'? OMG.....wasn't he the role model for the Ninja Turtles???

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA......


Hoooooo......boy......yeah....he was the best, I'm sure....:rolleyes:

He and Frank Dux should "duke" it out sometime.....I think the Count would do pretty well, even though he's dead.....

Okay, back to reality....these guys need to get a clue. AND a life. Count Dante' was a showman, like many others. He may have been a decent martial artist, I dunno. But his hype makes him look like the biggest goon this side of Ashida Kim.

That bio is still a royal hoot, though......I'm gonna be chuckling all day long, now....;)

I wonder if the Black Dragon Society still advertises in the superhero comic books......

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


Peace--

[Bod]

BJJ is Judo. Different rules, different teaching method, exactly the same techniques.

It has much to offer if you want to learn that type of ground fighting, mostly because of their teaching approach, and the way they break down the art.

The Gracies neither invented the techniques or stole them. Better still they didn't steal Count Dante's name, or they would just look silly. Better *still* they didn't invent Count Dante's name, or they would look even sillier.

[donald]

Is'nt he(Dante)dead? I thought he passed away some time ago, during, or around the time of the so called "dojo wars" ? I remember the old "Black Dragon Society" ads in my old comic books. He sure sounded deadly, and if I coulda spared the dough I probably would have joined, and learned the deadliest art known to man...

Salute in Christ,
:D

[Kenpo_student]

I mean come on, he advertises in comic books.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[ace]

Is there any film or video on this guy.
Or are these stories passed down
from 1 person to the next.

Do U guy's think he could
hang with a Shamrock,Sakuraba, Ruas or any other top fighter????

I have heard stories like this many of times
And usaly there is no evadece to back it up.:confused:
:asian:
Primo

[Zoran]

Originally posted by donald

Is'nt he(Dante)dead? I thought he passed away some time ago, during, or around the time of the so called "dojo wars" ? I remember the old "Black Dragon Society" ads in my old comic books. He sure sounded deadly, and if I coulda spared the dough I probably would have joined, and learned the deadliest art known to man...

Salute in Christ,
:D

That's what I thought. I'll ask my instructor to make sure. He was around during those "dojo wars".

[shotmanuk]

The actual Count Dante appears to have been a good fighter. he just got carried away with the image

[Nightingale]

lol...

are you guys sure we shouldn't move this to the "humor" forum??

:rofl:

[Brenwulv]

Originally posted by ace
Is there any film or video on this guy.
Or are these stories passed down
from 1 person to the next.

There is a montage video under the archives section of the countdante.com site. :shrug:

I've watched it and laughed. Mostly the cutting watermelons with swords on people, smashing blocks on the chest with a sledge hammer, and other parlor trick type things.

The self-defense sections are.... uh.... interesting.....

And at the very end is a short clip of Dante himself, but you can tell it's been sped up....

Eh, just watch and judge for yourself. At least get a good laugh or two. :rofl:

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by Brenwulv
There is a montage video under the archives section of the countdante.com site. :shrug:

I've watched it and laughed. Mostly the cutting watermelons with swords on people, smashing blocks on the chest with a sledge hammer, and other parlor trick type things.

The self-defense sections are.... uh.... interesting.....

And at the very end is a short clip of Dante himself, but you can tell it's been sped up....

Eh, just watch and judge for yourself. At least get a good laugh or two. :rofl:

Wow...that was pretty good! :rofl:

[liangzhicheng]

I thought this was satire when I read it! Seriously...this site is a joke, right? Take for instance, this picture. (http://countdante.com/archives/count-informer.jpg)
or this "article" (http://countdante.com/archives/Article2.gif)

If you ask me, this site has some real scans, and some made-up "scans" to make fun of Count Dante, the world's deadliest fighting master, and Supreme grand-past master of the Black Dragon fighting society. If this isn't a joke...:eek:

[pknox]

For those people who go back a ways, this guy is basically an old story...

"Count Dante", who's real name was John Keehan, first started training with Robert Trias in his "United States Karate Association" and actually helped it expand in the beginning. He then left the organization (there is some controversy over if it was by choice), and set up his own system, which emphasized dirty fighting, and secret strikes that would maim or kill an opponent. The big difference, according to Dante, was one of mindset. While the asian systems strived for a calm, tranquil mind, he wanted his students to be "psyched up" and fight with pure aggression. He promoted some of the first full contact tournaments in the U.S. back in 1967, and was perhaps most famous for his "World's Deadliest Fighting Secrets" booklet (that's probably what you saw back in the comics, donald). He liked to be referred to as "The Clown Prince of Death." He was basically regarded as an outcast in his time. He died in 1975.

http://www.urbin.net/EWW/MA/dante.html

[MJS]

Is this guy for real?? Definately a 1st class fake

Supreme Grandmaster---Yeah, ok
:rofl: :rofl:

Mike

[OULobo]

I caught a few referances to this guy online a while ago. I did the usual web searches and saw what I could see. Sounds to me like the guy parleyed a couple of street techniques that have been around forever, some old traditional martial arts and a few brawls into a marketing machine based on comic book ads and publicity stunts. The weird part is that he seems to have gotten so mixed up that he started to believe his own BS. I did do a little research on the Chi-town "dojo wars" and it sounds like a colmination of a lot of stupid ego trips that ended in one sad death. This guy sounds like a white Sho-nuff without the golden glow and with no real style. Somebody should've went Leroy Brown on this bizzle.

[OULobo]

I know its a little off subject, but did anyone else catch the postings mixed in with the Count Dante stuff on Bullshido about how Emin Botzepe supposedly went to the Gracie school and thrashed Rickson. It doesn't sound too kosher to me. Anyone have the whole scoop.

[pknox]

Originally posted by OULobo
I know its a little off subject, but did anyone else catch the postings mixed in with the Count Dante stuff on Bullshido about how Emin Botzepe supposedly went to the Gracie school and thrashed Rickson. It doesn't sound too kosher to me. Anyone have the whole scoop.

I've never heard this before, but think about it, if Boztepe actually "thrashed" Rickson, wouldn't he have put himself on the cover of Black Belt by now? That sounds like a story they would just LOVE to take. It's not like the guy is publicity shy or anything. :rolleyes:

[OULobo]

Originally posted by pknox
I've never heard this before, but think about it, if Boztepe actually "thrashed" Rickson, wouldn't he have put himself on the cover of Black Belt by now? That sounds like a story they would just LOVE to take. It's not like the guy is publicity shy or anything. :rolleyes:

I figured it couldn't be true because it would have ripped through the internet by now.

[MJS]

Originally posted by OULobo
I know its a little off subject, but did anyone else catch the postings mixed in with the Count Dante stuff on Bullshido about how Emin Botzepe supposedly went to the Gracie school and thrashed Rickson. It doesn't sound too kosher to me. Anyone have the whole scoop.

Emin thrashed Rickson??? I didnt read the entire article, but I havent heard that Emin had ever fought Gracie, and if he did, I really would find it hard to believe that Emin would win.

Mike

[OULobo]

Well, lets not let this get out of proportion. If you follow the link earlier on this thread, it goes to a thread on another forum that discusses this. The guy making the statment sounds like the usual "my system is the best" zealot. He states that there is a movie of the fight complete with filming of the schools outside for proof. I haven't been able to find this film so I take the whole thing with a very big grain of salt. Like I said earlier, if it was true it would be all over the net by now.

[MJS]

Originally posted by OULobo
Well, lets not let this get out of proportion. If you follow the link earlier on this thread, it goes to a thread on another forum that discusses this. The guy making the statment sounds like the usual "my system is the best" zealot. He states that there is a movie of the fight complete with filming of the schools outside for proof. I haven't been able to find this film so I take the whole thing with a very big grain of salt. Like I said earlier, if it was true it would be all over the net by now.

Yup, I read the thread on the other forum, and yes, I agree with you, it does sound like a bunch of crap. IMO, its just another guy that is probably a huge fan of Emin and his WT org. and thinks that he is unbeatable. I'm sure that if there was such a tape, it probably would be all over the net. And how would the guy making the post get a copy? Was he there?

I'm definately taking it with a grain of salt.

Mike

[Kroy]

They should get Ashida Kim and Count Dante to fight each other.:rofl: :rofl:

[pknox]

Originally posted by Kroy
They should get Ashida Kim and Count Dante to fight each other.:rofl: :rofl:

Perhaps Frank Dux has the time to be the special guest referee. ;)

[Kroy]

Originally posted by pknox
Perhaps Frank Dux has the time to be the special guest referee. ;)

I smell another movie!!!!!

[Karasu Tengu]

Let me get this straight:

He was a Hairdresser and died of an "exotic" blood disease.

Hmmmm can you say ****** and AIDS

[OULobo]

Originally posted by Karasu Tengu
Let me get this straight:

He was a Hairdresser and died of an "exotic" blood disease.

Hmmmm can you say ****** and AIDS

Holy hate filled sexual preferance slander batman!!

[rmcrobertson]

Yeah, I agree.

It's just always good to see folks standing up for the principles of respect, good manners and common decency that are central to the martial arts...

Guess they don't apply if you're gay. Not to mention the unrepressed happiness buried not very deep in the comment...

[pknox]

Originally posted by Karasu Tengu
Let me get this straight:

He was a Hairdresser and died of an "exotic" blood disease.

Hmmmm can you say ****** and AIDS

I guess I could, but that would make me both a bigot and a jerk. :mst: Evidently you've filled the quota quite well on your own.

[rmcrobertson]

I am so very far behind the power curve on well-deserved insults. Good for you guys, and I mean that sincerely.

The only useful thing in martial arts that that sort of--post--teaches is that there really are some things worth fighting over. So thanks, "Tengu," for helping remind me of what's worth it...

[Cruentus]

Originally posted by OULobo
Holy hate filled sexual preferance slander batman!!

No kidding..where the hell did that come from! :rolleyes:

[Seig]

Ok,
That was totally uncalled for. The rest of you guys ignore it. The moderation team is looking at this and deciding what we are going to do. If there is another comment like this or about this, I will lock it imeediately and further action will be taken.
Seig
MT Moderator

[Brother John]

That's kinda funny.
Until you realize that some believe it.


:rofl: :rofl: :eek:
Your Bro.
John

[Bob Hubbard]

Originally posted by Karasu Tengu
Let me get this straight:
.....
stuff snipped

Please note that while not specifically spelled out in the forum rules, the ideas contained here are against the spirit of this forum.

Put another way "Posts that are racist, sexist, homophobic or bigoted are not allowed.".

Please, lets move back to the topic at hand. And please avoid quoting the material.

Thank you.
:asian:

[Seig]

Originally posted by Brother John
That's kinda funny.
Until you realize that some believe it.


:rofl: :rofl: :eek:
Your Bro.
John
John,
Unfortunately it is not funny at all. Not only does it totally go everything this board stands for, it goes against the spirit of the martial arts. In addition to that, if we let it stand and ignore for the uneducated tripe that it is, it opens us up to liability. Things like this cannot and will not go unadressed.

[pknox]

Originally posted by MartialArtist
And the title of being the "Deadliest Man Alive" - hahahahahahahahahahahaha, what a joke, the deadliest guy alive IMO was an old guy from Asia a couple hundred years ago, but you can't match him up.

Just curious -- which old guy from Asia?

[OULobo]

Originally posted by pknox
Just curious -- which old guy from Asia?

My guess would be Musashi.

[pknox]

Originally posted by OULobo
My guess would be Musashi.

That's what I was thinking too, but I was just wondering if he had someone else in mind.

[Don Roley]

Originally posted by Karasu Tengu
Let me get this straight:

He was a Hairdresser and died of an "exotic" blood disease.

Hmmmm can you say ****** and AIDS

Uh, was anyone aware that if you do a search of a person's posts or try to quote them then the original, hate filled, homophobic terms they use will be there for them to see?

As long as hate- filled bigots are allowed to frequent these boards and use their discrimtory language, then maybe the moderators should try to eliminate the hole in the software that allows others to see their messages of hate.

Incidently, Steve McGovern (Karasu Tengu) works in a supply capacity for the Navy in San Diego. It saddens me that the military allows such hate to exist in it's ranks. McGovern is obviously not concerned that his homophobic message will feature negativly on his performance. He has not apologized for it and does not seem contrite for his actions. When I went through basic training I witnessed another trainee use a racial term and he got an article 15 (non-judicial punishment that resulted in his losing one- third of his pay for the month) as a result. Either no one has told the military, and/or the standards of behavior have been lowered so much that McGovern does not seem to care if he uses the terms he used and is gets back to his superior officers.

[Acronym]

"Count Dante held the first 'World Karate Championship' in 1962. This was the first open international Karate championship ever held. Count Dante' held this same championship for seven years (up to and including 1968). In 1967 Count Dante' held the first Professional World Karate Championship' which offered the winner $1O,000 in the contact Karate or Kick Boxing division. Black Belt magazine, in their August 1967 issue, criticized the event, polling the leadership of Karate in the United States, along with the heads of every major Karate organization to confirm their contempt of this innovative competition. All persons and organizations contacted criticized the championship without exception. It seems that Count Dante was always ten years ahead of his time because today the same type of contests are being held throughout the United States. The 1967 Champion-ship was won by Victor Ryther, sixth degree Black belt and a student of Count Dante. In 1968 Count Dante held the first professional 'World Fighting Arts Championship'. This was not an exhibition similar to the ones held now. Participants were not selected and the fighters were not matched up beforehand as they are today. In the 1968 championship there was a 10,000 cash prize offered the winner. The championship was open to all fighters from all fighting systems, styles or arts. Anyone could enter, such as professional boxers, wrestlers, judoka, karateists, kung fu experts, Thai boxers, street fighters, etc. In this contest there were no rounds, no protective gear or gloves were allowed and the winner was decided by knockout. "


sounds like mortal kombat to me.