competition sparring

[artful dodger]

I'm interested in hearing about peoples first moves in competition. What do you guys do as soon as sijak is called and what have you found works best?

[fissure]

What kind of competition do you do? ITF point, or WTF full contact.This info will also help me post a reply to your other thread.

[artful dodger]

ITF point sparring, but the contact can be quite heavy without been given a warning.

[Deathtrap101]

Well Im not evan training in TKD, im in karate but the whoel 2 tournaments ive bin to are point matches. Im only a yellow belt but what i do, is just get into a stance and watch and see what the other guy does. Some like to rush me and ill throw a fast punch through there flailing arms and usualy score a point.

Some will rush forward a few steps and ill almost meet them half way and try to stress him a bit with my longer kicks as im usualy the biggest guy in my division.

One guy i fought at both my tournaments changed his style alot at teh 2nd one(i still beat 'em ;), but he just took a stance and held it waiting for me. It got me a little edgy but i moved in. creeped in got a little too close and he tried to psych me out by stomping nice and loud on the floor(small tournament with no matts.), the first time i flinched a bit backing up but after that i didnt care. I gave it back to him and stomped, he jumped back alot. I found it funny. But anyway i just went in with a coupel punch combo's.

What works best for me right now is punch combo's caus im still pretty new. But ive bin working ALOT on my kicks and ill be dishing alot of that out at my next tournament.


Hope that was a half descent answer??

[Danny]

Just take a step back and see what the other guy does. If he runs in drive him with a jumping away back kick. Then take a step back and see what he does. Better off figuring out the guys fighting style before you run in and end up getting smoked.

[Marginal]

I've only sparred in class, but I have decent success against other yellow belts by waiting for them to throw a punch then stepping out of a walking or L stance into a horse stance and counter punching as I'm stepping out. The shift to a wider stance is enough to move my head out of the way without having to worry about being out of posistion to deliver the punch.

I think it'd work better in a pure point sparring environment though. With continous sparring in effect, I don't really have any good followups after I've popped them in the face with that particular move. Lucky for me, they usually back off afterwards so things kinda reset.

Throwing a round, front or side kick then following with punches is good for closing distance, but I don't have much left after getting there.

Finally, I seem to have had a decent success rate with closing with one or two punches, then throwing a high round kick when I'm in close. Nobody seems to expect a kick in that close, much less a high one to the side of their head.

That pretty much taps my 8th gup repitoire though.

[Danny]

Don't get locked into certain favorate combinations. You have to learn to flow when you spar. Actually, come to think of it, I suggest you study the 11 hints for sparring in the encyclopedia. Vol. 5, pg. 246 That should give you some good general advice without getting locked into fixed routines that end up being countered.

[DJDragon]

I've only sparred in class or with a friend and I usually start off the aggressor. I usually go for a mid front kick, or a roundhouse to the torso or leg (depending on the rules).

[fissure]

artful dodger, point fighting is a game of tag (your it , in England).
Knowledge of your opponent is more important in point fighting than full contact I think.After all once they land they score, action stops and you go again. You have to determine their strong points.Do they use speed, reach, motion, superior tech., stepping attacks, sacrifice type attacks.Once you figure out their offenssive system, you can then adjust to screw it up the most for them.All the while trying to set up your advantageous position.The ttrick is to be able to figure all of this out quickly against every opponent you face!!;) I think this is why matches against people you face often get 'stale' and boring.You each lern the others tendecies and favored 'tricks'.
When you go to tournaments, don't throw everything you have at lesser opponents.The top fighters will be watching you ( as you should be watching them:) ), looking for these patterns in your game plan.You'll need to keep a new trick or two up your sleeve, for these guys.:EG:

[fissure]

Hey look at me, I'm a green belt:cool: .Beat you to it Danny:D

[Bagatha]

Well....Im kinda small, so when at all possible, I try to make the first move very aggressively, to just make the opponent respect my space a little before we really proceed. It changes with everyone. If I am unsure of their reaction, I will do a side kick for safety, but if I feel secure that they will just back up, I will try an axe kick. Sometimes though you know for sure that your going to get spanked no matter what, so you try not to risk opening yourself up as much, and just take advantage of what they give you. But if you think you have a chance, I recommed trying to establish yourself as the dominant person right from go. I think if you get 2 guys both the same age, height, weight, flexibility, and coordination together, sparring is just a big mind game. The one who loses is the one who got intimidated.

[Danny]

True it is a mind game. When you enter the ring stare them down. Lock eyes with them and do not look away. First one to look away has probably just lost the fight before it even starts. Basically subconsiously establishes you as being dominate.

If they are bigger then you first off hurt their lead arm with a few side kicks. Remember hit once, rechamber a little and hit again. ALWAYS keep your leg between you and him after you finish all your kicks. Otherwise he may dodge your kick and clock you while your foot in still in motion. (e.g. If you do a Rev. Turning kick, stop it when you hit is face, don't follow through.) They're natural reaction will be to try and protect their sore arm, making them think twice about attacking you cause they now your gonna hit the same spot agian.

Also when fighting bigger people you have got to move. (Remember to move lateral, not back all the time.) Big people tend to be slower than small. Use that you your advantage. Time your attacks so that you attack when the guy is shifting his weight to stay facing you.

If the guy is smaller get on top of him a beat him out of YOUR ring.

Lastly, it is always your ring. Their is no good reason for the other guy to be in it.

Anyway, hope those tips help.

[Bagatha]

Originally posted by Danny



Lastly, it is always your ring. Their is no good reason for the other guy to be in it.

Anyway, hope those tips help.

LOL! I love it!

[Kong]

I find the sidekick to be a good opener (I spar wtf rules full contact), often the opponent will not be expecting it, and it`s a relatively safe move. You can control the distance between your opponent fairly easy and test his reaction. It can also be hard to defend against. I just go for the lead arm and if I miss the vest just jam it into the guard. If the kick is really hard usually you`re awarded a point anyway. It`s always good to start out aggressive to make an impression on the judges and have them watching for your moves.
:asian:

[Marginal]

Originally posted by Danny

Lastly, it is always your ring. Their is no good reason for the other guy to be in it.

Anyway, hope those tips help. [/B]I gotta hand it to this thread. I finally competed in my first tournament last Sunday, and that advice of Danny's was still echoing in the back of my mind when I was waiting to be called up for sparring. ;)

As far as it goes, it was quite a bit of fun though the brackets were tiny. (3 people to a division in the yellow belt level I was competing in.) It was light contact, continous sparring, and of course my first opponent comes out swinging as hard as he can. I backed off a bit then got tired of dodging the punches, figured if I got in close he'd just draw himself a foul, and closed taking one square in the chest hard enough to push me backwards. (He got warned) After that, we just went back and fourth until he managed to get three low kicks called on him in a row (last one was a side turning kick to my groin... Glad I had my cup.) I ended up winning that one.

Second, and final match, I was up against a guy who looked like he was about 6'5" (Damn tall vs my 5'11" in any case.) Thrilled my classmates. Ended up winning that one too (after what seemed to be mainly a few dozen lead leg side kicks and a lot of counterpunching on my part) and took first place in yellow belt sparring. Whee.

[celtic bhoy]

Congratulations!!

[Marginal]

Thanks.

Anyway, to add a bit more to the thread, I noticed two other things that helped me as well.

First, in the matches I'd watched up to that point, I noticed that the guy with the most warnings etc tended to be the guy that lost, so I went into mine aiming to stay conservative and keep my techniques in control.

Other than that, I went in consciously trying to be relaxed and patient. Helped me keep my focus a lot.

[Kong]

I noticed that the guy with the most warnings etc tended to be the guy that lost
This is becoming even more of a factor in WTF style competition, with the changing of the rules so that if you fall you`re fouled and get a point against you, alot of people won`t be as eager to jump spin kick against the head anymore,,,but then again if you succeed you score that extra head point,,,

[fissure]

This rule was added to deal with the tech. used over the last few years wher a fighter would fall to the floor after firing off a head kick ( usually spinning hook kick).The down side to aggresive turning head kicks is the vunnerable postion one is left in if the tech. fails. Diving to the floor takes the risk out of the movement.The rules comitee is trying to stop this type of tactic with the new ruling.

[Marginal]

Parallels everywhere. I was sparring in USTF style, (which is essentially ITF style as I understand it).

[artful dodger]

I have to agree with the warnings comment. I underestimated how much they had to do with the final score until I had a go at judging recently. It made a difference to every fight and often the poorer sparrer won.

[Kong]

I think the new rules are a really good thing for competition TKD, I`ve been to way too many tournaments, were it seems like every second technique someone is rolling around on the floor. I just hate the way that looks in itself, and I think it makes TKD look bad as well.
With the new rules, hopefully people will keep their game a stand up one, and with the awarding of an extra point for headshots, it should take none of the excitement away.
:asian:

[fissure]

I`ve been to way too many tournaments, were it seems like every second technique someone is rolling around on the floor. I just hate the way that looks in itself, and I think it makes TKD look bad as well.
It must be understood that WTF/USTU competition is nothing more than a contact sporting event.An intelligent player will bend any or all of the rules to their advantage.At this point the coverning body will try to even things out a bit. This happens in every sport - how many times has the shape of the goal crease been changed in hockey over the last couple of years? NASCAR has there teams using one engine for the whole of race weekend, they used to use as many as 3! Some enterprising TKD player will figure a way to use this new rules package to their advantage, others will copy him, and in a few years the rules will be tweaked again.
As to the issue of it making TKD "look bad" , it is not possible for a sport to make a Martial Art look bad or good - unless the spectator has zero concept of the later.
I should say that warnings and deductions play less of a role in WTF style events that most point formats.You really have to play dirty to get to the point where it will affect score cards! I have to say that the bigger tournys. (states and nationals) have a fairly high level of judging, and you don't have to deal with the petty local political BS as much!:EG: ( you notice I said "as much"!)

[Marginal]

Originally posted by artful dodger

I have to agree with the warnings comment. I underestimated how much they had to do with the final score until I had a go at judging recently. It made a difference to every fight and often the poorer sparrer won.

I watched a few matches like than in the juniors division. One kid got the snot beaten outta him. Took a turning kick to the nose, collapsed, and ended up getting his nose packed by the EMT. Match started back up, the kid was clearly angry about the bloody nose, and tried to go after the other kid. They went back and fourth for a bit until the kid went down again clutching his ribs. EMT came over again. Mach starts again, he takes another kick to the face EMT visits again... He ended up winning the match just due to his opponent being penalized for excessive contact.

[Kong]

As to the issue of it making TKD "look bad" , it is not possible for a sport to make a Martial Art look bad or good - unless the spectator has zero concept of the later.
I agree with this, but the sport format does to a certain degree represent the art to the public, and most people draw conclusions on the art based on what they see in public tournaments (and demonstrations).