Looking for a Good Katana

[Sin]

I'm looking for a Really good Katana...Something that they would use in the old times...something you can actually use...and not worry about the handle falling off....::looks at Tiger Claw and Shudders::

I don't train in Sword arts..at least not yet, but it would just be nice to have a good Katana.

[Grenadier]

I'm looking for a Really good Katana...Something that they would use in the old times...something you can actually use...and not worry about the handle falling off....::looks at Tiger Claw and Shudders::

I don't train in Sword arts..at least not yet, but it would just be nice to have a good Katana.

What is your price range? There are good katanas to be had in all sorts of price ranges, but just as a warning, we're talking about something at least in the $250+ area.

How "traditional" do you want your katana to be? There are some folks (such as myself) that are perfectly happy with a katana that is well-built, but may deviate from what pure traditionalists may want. There are also some folks who absolutely must have something that is as traditional as possible.

[Sin]

100% Traditional Katana....Price is no object, because Its gonna be a long term saving project for me.

[Flying Crane]

100% Traditional Katana....Price is no object, because Its gonna be a long term saving project for me.

A 100% traditional katana, made by a true Japanese Master Swordsmith will cost you about $50,000 for the blade alone. And we are talking about a modern sword, not an antique.

The furniture, i.e. hilt fittings and scabbard, will run you another $15,000 or more.

Is this what you are really looking for, or perhaps something not quite 100% traditional?

[Gemini]

I would be more inclined to think you could land a high quality live blade that you'd be happy with for b/t $2500 and $5000. I can send you some links if you want.

[Flying Crane]

I would be more inclined to think you could land a high quality live blade that you'd be happy with for b/t $2500 and $5000. I can send you some links if you want.

This is probably a better avenue for most people. A $65,000 katana made by a true Master Swordsmith is worth every penny, but that's a lot of pennies...

For the price range Gemini is suggesting, you can probably find something that most any of us would be perfectly happy with.

[pgsmith]

A 100% traditional katana, made by a true Japanese Master Swordsmith will cost you about $50,000 for the blade alone. And we are talking about a modern sword, not an antique.
While this is true, it is a bit misleading. Newly made katana (shinsakuto) that are perfectly suitable for use and completely traditionally made can be had starting at around $7000 complete. These aren't made by award winning smiths, and don't have the art polish that a master's blade would, but they are authentic nihonto. Check out Nishijin Sword, Swordstore.com, or Mugendo Budogu for places that can get you a shinsakuto.

In some instances you can actually get lucky and get a blade made by an up and coming smith that eventually gets a Juyo rating at the annual Token Kai. Then the $7000 sword you bought would jump to two or three times what you paid. Doesn't happen often, but it has been known to happen.

Many production blades are plenty well made enough for regular use. Of course, they aren't fully traditionally made because that would make them as cost prohibitive as nihonto. There are many different places to purchase decent Chinese made production swords, but you have to have some knowledge in order to make sure that you are buying a decent product from a reputable dealer.

[Flying Crane]

While this is true, it is a bit misleading. Newly made katana (shinsakuto) that are perfectly suitable for use and completely traditionally made can be had starting at around $7000 complete. These aren't made by award winning smiths, and don't have the art polish that a master's blade would, but they are authentic nihonto. Check out Nishijin Sword, Swordstore.com, or Mugendo Budogu for places that can get you a shinsakuto.

In some instances you can actually get lucky and get a blade made by an up and coming smith that eventually gets a Juyo rating at the annual Token Kai. Then the $7000 sword you bought would jump to two or three times what you paid. Doesn't happen often, but it has been known to happen.

Many production blades are plenty well made enough for regular use. Of course, they aren't fully traditionally made because that would make them as cost prohibitive as nihonto. There are many different places to purchase decent Chinese made production swords, but you have to have some knowledge in order to make sure that you are buying a decent product from a reputable dealer.

Fair enough. I know there are a lot of levels in this that I am not familiar with. I guess if he wants to be 100% traditional then only the best Master Swordsmith will do. I wouldn't be surprised if this point is being reconsidered right about now...

I agree, a good quality piece can be acquired for significantly less. Good information. Thanks.

[Walter Wong]

Hi Sin. Get this book and read it through.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/087011798X/larmankatanapoli/102-7110037-6466504

It's important to know and understand the product that you are shopping for. Reading books like these are a good start.

[TheBattousai]

I own a katana that cost roughly 350-400 dollars; its made well, but by machine, so not trully authentic but is good enough. I've also seen hand made ones that aren't folded as much as others (like only 40-60 times), but are still good run for 900-1500 dollars completed. I would suggest looking around for for some while you save.

[Sin]

Thanks for all of your insights...I had no Idea that it could get up in the 50,000, I want a costom made sword under 10,000 dollars, something with my name in japannese charecters in it...a balenced sword, made by human hands...Traditional Style.

[Jade Tigress]

Thanks for all of your insights...I had no Idea that it could get up in the 50,000, I want a costom made sword under 10,000 dollars, something with my name in japannese charecters in it...a balenced sword, made by human hands...Traditional Style.

when you're ready you can get it here (http://www.namahagesword.com/)

[Grenadier]

You may want to talk to Howard Clark. He's pretty darn busy, but he makes blades that are about as "traditional" as one can get at a reasonable price.

http://www.mvforge.com/

Also, Bugei would have somethng for you, and they can certainly make you a custom sword in the price range that you seek.

http://www.bugei.com/

[MSUTKD]

Before you buy it LEARN TO USE IT! I would suggest first finding a “real” teacher. One who, only, studies the sword and has for at least 30 years. Then become a “real” student. One who is resolved to learn, not look cool swinging a blade around. Then, after you spend 20 years THEN buy a “real” Katana. Everyone wants to be skilled but no one wants to take the time to do it right. That is why we have 10 Dans, out of shape instructors, and McDojo’s in our country.

Just my rant,
ron

[Flying Crane]

Hi Sin. Get this book and read it through.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/087011798X/larmankatanapoli/102-7110037-6466504

It's important to know and understand the product that you are shopping for. Reading books like these are a good start.

This is an excellent book. I have a copy and have found it extremely informative. If you are interested in acquiring a high quality katana, then DEFINITELY read this book. It will give you a good picture of what goes into the contstruction of a high quality piece. Very eye-opening. Most people have absolutely no idea what it takes to make one of these.

I have been experimenting for over four years with rebuilding Chinese style swords, both straight Jian and curved Broadswords. While I don't yet make the blades, I have been building customized hilts (guard, grip and pommel), and scabbards. My materials have been exotic hardwoods and bronze and silver. While my work is nothing like a Master Japanese swordsmith, I can say from experience that the creation of a good quality piece takes vision, patience, care, and a lot of hard work. I love the work, but it is just amazing how much effort goes into one of these.

[Walter Wong]

Then, after you spend 20 years THEN buy a “real” Katana.
Well, 20 years is a bit extreme in waiting to use a live blade. The procedure is to just get a legitimate instructor to train you and your instructor will advise when you are ready for a live blade. And every school and instructor will vary in a timeframe of when you move on to live blade.

Yes Crane, that book is a great book. I've read it twice and still need to reread it again.

[Sin]

I just bought a Bokken(sp)...So I will begin my training with a buddy of mine that has trained in it for a wile...My Sensei dosn't really use swords, and loacally there isn't anyone...Maybe my buddy and I can work things out....Teach ourselves...He has little training, and I have decent kabudo training, so if we go slow, and work things out, do some 1-2-3-4 etc step sparring, I think we'll do well....Your Views?

[BlackCatBonz]

I just bought a Bokken(sp)...So I will begin my training with a buddy of mine that has trained in it for a wile...My Sensei dosn't really use swords, and loacally there isn't anyone...Maybe my buddy and I can work things out....Teach ourselves...He has little training, and I have decent kabudo training, so if we go slow, and work things out, do some 1-2-3-4 etc step sparring, I think we'll do well....Your Views?

Any self training for sword purposes isnt really a good idea.

[dobermann]

Any self training for sword purposes isnt really a good idea.

isnt there this thread with the disturbing images on page 2?

just yesterday in iaidoclass one guy had accidentelly made his iaito slip from his fingers when putting back to saya. that guy is really good, doing it for ten years. not want to think about what could have happened if it was a live blade..

[BlackCatBonz]

the sound of fingers hitting the floor....ewww

[splice42]

I just bought a Bokken(sp)...So I will begin my training with a buddy of mine that has trained in it for a wile...My Sensei dosn't really use swords, and loacally there isn't anyone...Maybe my buddy and I can work things out....Teach ourselves...He has little training, and I have decent kabudo training, so if we go slow, and work things out, do some 1-2-3-4 etc step sparring, I think we'll do well....Your Views?

I think that's ridiculous. Get a sensei that is qualified to teach this, move near one, or just forget about it.

Seriously, have you ever considered how illogical this "I have decent kobudo training, so it'll work out" is?

How about this: I have decent Iaido training, so I think teaching myself jujutsu will work out. Or hey, how about karate? Or anything not Iaido?

IT DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY. Kobudo training is applicable to kobudo. Iaido training is applicable to Iaido. They are totally different arts. Get a teacher, else you're just twirling sticks. They might be japanese sticks, but it's still more twirling and jacking off and not a Japanese Sword Art or anything similar.

[splice42]

I own a katana that cost roughly 350-400 dollars; its made well, but by machine, so not trully authentic but is good enough. I've also seen hand made ones that aren't folded as much as others (like only 40-60 times), but are still good run for 900-1500 dollars completed. I would suggest looking around for for some while you save.

Researching a subject like this will prevent you from putting your foot in your mouth when discussing it, and will even benefit you in the long run; you'll have a better idea of what you're looking at and buying.

"folded only 40-60 times" is ridiculous. Katana are folded around 12 to 16 times. If you know your math, you'll know that folding it 16 times results in over 65 thousand layers. 40 times would give you over 1 TRILLION layers, each of which would be thinner than an iron atom itself (by a factor of 100,000 even). Definitely not going to happen.

[Grenadier]

"folded only 40-60 times" is ridiculous. Katana are folded around 12 to 16 times. If you know your math, you'll know that folding it 16 times results in over 65 thousand layers. 40 times would give you over 1 TRILLION layers, each of which would be thinner than an iron atom itself (by a factor of 100,000 even). Definitely not going to happen.

That amount can be twice as great, since some folded katanas start out with two bars of different steels.

I would also further add, that folding the metal 40-60 times would end up burning out all of the carbon in the steel, resulting in a soft iron blade, unsuitable for sword use.

The most layers I've seen on the more common katana stopped at 8,192.

[TheBattousai]

I get layers and folding confused, sorry about that. *Brain stops
I want a cookie

[Walter Wong]

There's a whole thread on self teaching.
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29955

Go to this link and scroll down for pics of after effects of self teaching then read the whole thread after.
http://forums.swordforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=53083&perpage=25&pagenumber=2

Last I heard, the gentleman still hasn't regain full use of his left hand yet.

[Sin]

Well now...I understand your concerns for self taught sword training. My friend has had classic japanesse training, so where not going in blind here.

Also TheBattousai has offered to train with me...and I for got to ask him in a PM, if he has had any sword training?

[Flying Crane]

Well now...I understand your concerns for self taught sword training. My friend has had classic japanesse training, so where not going in blind here.

Also TheBattousai has offered to train with me...and I for got to ask him in a PM, if he has had any sword training?

But the question remains: "Classic Japanese Training" in What?

The other guys have raised some good points. Iado is a specific art with many subtleties. You definitely need a good teacher, or else you are just waiving your sword around. If you try this with a live blade, you will probably get hurt, or hurt someone else. If you try this with a cheap wallhanger that isn't meant for anything but decoration (i.e. probably anything that costs less than about $1200), then at some point it will break and you will get hurt or you will hurt someone else. This is actually pretty serious. Take some advice from the guys here. They aren't just being a bunch of killjoys. They are trying to help you understand that there is a right way to do this, and then there is a wrong way to do this and the wrong way carries a very high liklihood of someone getting hurt, and with a live blade it can be bad in the blink of an eye.

If you want to own a quality katana, then seek one out and purchase it. But be safe and don't try to really use it until you get the proper training.

[Walter Wong]

Sin, I'm curious, what style has your friend trained in that involves sword training? And what style has TheBattousai trained in for him to teach you sword as well?

Here is a post by a legitimate sword sensei's perspective on the self taught or those trying to figure it out:
http://swordforumbugei.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=36993&highlight=#36993

Granted Sin, if your friend is instructed in a legitimate sword art and is qualified to teach it to you, then that's fine. If they aren't instructed in a legitimate sword art, it'll be risky not only in learning bad habits, but very dangerous. The real sword arts are dangerous enough. It's even more dangerous for the nontrained to self teach or experiment.

[TheBattousai]

I have have a sensai rank in kobujutsu, and I've had extensive sword training with my instructor in the aspects of kenjutsu, battoujustu, iaijutsu, and other forms of sword training (like other than a katana). Sorry I didn't mention this sooner Sin.

[Sin]

Well, my friend has trained in Akido and his Akido instructor gave him sword training...Now guys, I'm not some yahoo looking to swing a sharp object around...hence the reason I will be using a bokken a 100% "Wooden" sword...And is only for practice...I don't even plan on buy a Live blade for some time now...I was only asking if TheBattousai had any sword training

[kenpojujitsu]

I just bought a Bokken(sp)...So I will begin my training with a buddy of mine that has trained in it for a wile...My Sensei dosn't really use swords, and loacally there isn't anyone...Maybe my buddy and I can work things out....Teach ourselves...He has little training, and I have decent kabudo training, so if we go slow, and work things out, do some 1-2-3-4 etc step sparring, I think we'll do well....Your Views?

If all you want to do is swing wooden sticks at each other then this is fine.
If you truly want to learn Japanese Swordsmanship (Kendo, Kenjutsu, iaido - which ever) the this is a really bad idea.
Why start from scratch with ignore hundreds of years of knowledge?
These are very unique arts and completely different than Kobudo. You will need to learn proper stances, grip and cutting (and drawing, etc if doing iaido).
If you think you are going to stand in a karate stance and pull a bokken out of your obi, the best that will get you is your photo in the baffling budo section of e-budo.com
Think about how seriously you want to learn these arts. If there is no instruction in your area, then find someone who comes to your area for seminars - even if you have to travel some. Most likely you will be able to get with someone before and after the seminar. I am sure you can find someone willing to work with you.
If there are no listings in the phone book, try one of the dedicated sword forums and ask around. You may be surpised.

[Sin]

Well, my Friend has had some training, and all I want for now is the basics...and when I find a "actual" instructor, I will continue my training, more in depth.

[MSUTKD]

The "basics" can only be learned from a real teacher.

ron

[Charles Mahan]

kenjutsu, battoujustu, iaijutsu,

Do you know which styles?

[TheBattousai]

Do you know which styles?

I may be misunderstanding the question, but the three I mentioned earlier I have studied extencively (Five years and going), plus others (like the to/broadsword). If I missed the question, just correct me.

[Walter Wong]

Sin, if your friend is legitimately trained in Aikido and he does sword work with bokken, then it is likely he is doing Aikiken which is fine. It is good he is not self trained in sword. Does he have a certification or some qualification from his sensei to teach? Just keep in mind that Aikiken is to teach Aikido principles rather than the killing aspect of Japanese swordsmanship. Nothing wrong with Aikiken as this is fine to train with your friend if he is qualified to teach or share with you his Aikiken. It's mostly bokken work so it should be fine to do. Good luck and enjoy.

TheBattousai, I'm still curious like Charles, what style of sword you do still. Kenjutsu, Battojutsu and Iaijutsu are as unspecific as Karate cause there are different styles of Karate. So there are different styles of Kenjutsu, Battojutsu and Iaijutsu. And Battojutsu and Iaijutsu are relatively the samething as they both deal with cutting from the draw. Kenjutsu is fighting with your sword already out of the saya. In some ryu, Iaijutsu is an aspect of certain Kenjutsu arts. Some Iaijutsu/Iaido arts speak of only the first cut is Iai as it's from the draw, then afterwards, the followup cuts after the drawcut is Kenjutsu.
The Toyama Ryu group which have branched off into 3 groups of Toyama Ryu, 2 of them use the Batto term, one group calling themselves Battojutsu the other Battodo. And the 3rd one calls themselves Iaido. But they are relatively doing the samething, just they have different titles. So it makes me wonder why you would say you do Battojutsu and Iaijutsu. Are you studying sword from 2 different ryu-ha that one calls it Battojutsu and the other Iaijutsu?
I see in your profile you mention your Martial studies are Ninpo and Ninjutsu among the other arts you train. Is your sword work from Ninja groups like Bujinkan?

[kroh]

Sin,

Where do you live...maybe some of the nihonto-kids on the site can help you find an instructor in your area.

Have you also tried some of the FMA's, CMA's or WMA's for sword training? Also, some jujutsu ryu-ha include the sword as a primary device for training the empty hand, you could also look there. Aikido schools sometimes teach iaido along with the cirriculum (the first Aikido school I studdied in had a Yagyu Shinkage Ryu study group...AwSoMe....too bad I blew out my knee after three classes...:idunno: ).

There are some alternatives that you could try. A good suggestion earlier in the thread is that you could hit the dedicated sword boards and see if there is anyone in your area.

Regards,
Walt

[TheBattousai]

Ok, now I see what you mean. I received my training in those forms through the Bukiho Kempo Kobujutsu (weapon principle fist law ancient martial art) branch in my Kempo school. The ultimate goal of the training is the ability to use everything, from a sword to a purse, as an effective weapon. But we use traditional weapons to help show the adaptability needed when using anything at your disposel. But we train in traditional weapons also to preserve the ancient way of training too. But when I say Kenjutsu, Battojutsu, and Iaijutsu; I mean it in a different way. Kenjutsu is like how you explained it (You just have a katana), but with batto and iai; the idea is with batto you draw, cut and cut 1 or 2 more times to slay your foe and then you return the blade to the sheath (after a blood sling ofcourse), in iai its just 1 draw and then the return. I hope this somewhat clearifies things....

P.S. I'm not a ninja....

[Sin]

I live in Louisville, Kentucky, if there is anyone near by then please PM me...TheBattousai...hopefully will show me a thing or two.

[kroh]

http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/showpost.php?p=36011&postcount=3

http://www.kendo-world.com/forum/showpost.php?p=39696&postcount=3


Hope that helps...it is a start
Regards,
Walt

[Sin]

Thanks...but no where did it give any phone numbers and such

[splice42]

Ok, now I see what you mean. I received my training in those forms through the Bukiho Kempo Kobujutsu (weapon principle fist law ancient martial art) branch in my Kempo school.

I believe that this "Bukiho Kempo Kobujutsu" is part of the Kiyojute Ryu Bugei Kempo of Mr. William Durbin, correct? You should be aware that this is not in any way a Traditional Japanese Sword Art. Mr. Durbin's credentials have often been criticised, to the point that Human Kinetics, who published his book "Mastering Kempo", have removed all references to his fictional PhD (which was obtained from a diploma mill) from their web site and the author's biography in his book.

It may be good enough for you, but you should be aware that his teachings probably don't reflect what is taught in Traditional Japanese Sword Arts.



Kenjutsu is like how you explained it (You just have a katana), but with batto and iai; the idea is with batto you draw, cut and cut 1 or 2 more times to slay your foe and then you return the blade to the sheath (after a blood sling ofcourse), in iai its just 1 draw and then the return. I hope this somewhat clearifies things....
You are operating under definitions that are not widely accepted. Your definition of Iai goes against all the Iai I've seen and done; only one kata I practice has only one cut, all the others have more than one. All the waza include chiburi. From this point of view, batto-jutsu and iai are pretty much interchangeable terms. In fact, so is kenjutsu. This is a quote from Dr. Karl Friday, Dept. of History, university of Georgia:


Standardization, of course, is an interesting phenomenon. As I've noted repeatedly (here and elsewhere), there really WAS none prior to modern times. In Tokugawa period and earlier sources swordsmanship is referred to as "kenjutsu," "kendo," "kenpo," "hyoho" (also read as "heiho"), "tojutsu," "toho," "gekken," "gekishi no jutsu," and several other names, with no apparent distinction of form or content. (The prevailing term during the Tokugawa period seems to have been "hyoho" ["heiho"], BTW.) It's only in this century that "kenjutsu" and "kendo" have emerged as the more-or-less standard terms.
Every school decides on the term to use for their particular art. You won't find one generic quality that differentiates batto, iai, and kenjutsu. The only exception is kendo, since that's now a well-defined term for the art of kendo. There is no art of batto, iai or kenjutsu, just styles that decide to classify themselves as such. Heck, different branches of the same style sometimes use different terms too. I know the art I practice (Muso Jikiden Eishin Ryu) has been referred to as iaido, iaijutsu, iai heiho and battodo, but it's pretty much the same thing all around.

[kroh]

some domestic blades to consider for non-japanese-japanese-swords.

http://oniforge.com/katana.html
http://www.dragonflyforge.com/
http://www.mvforge.com/
http://tigerclawforge.net/home
http://www.shadowofleaves.com/
http://dfoggknives.com
http://dynastyforge.com (I own one of these...good sword)
http://j-armory.com


definately some good offerings in there...

http://japanesesword.net/eng/

And there's one from Japan just in case.

Regards,
Walt

[Charles Mahan]

... only one kata I practice has only one cut, all the others have more than one.

On a side note you will discover that there are more the farther into your training you get. There are 2 in Seiza no Bu(ukenagashi), another in Tate Hiza no Bu, 6 in Oku Tachi Waza... That's just the one's I can think of off the top of my head.

[TheBattousai]

It may be good enough for you, but you should be aware that his teachings probably don't reflect what is taught in Traditional Japanese Sword Arts.

I'm aware that this isn't exactly taught in the same way as most, but its combat effect and is sound in terms of defending yourself, which to me is what counts.

[Charles Mahan]

I'm aware that this isn't exactly taught in the same way as most, but its combat effect and is sound in terms of defending yourself, which to me is what counts.

How do you know it's effective? On what do you base that assertion?

[TheBattousai]

How do you know it's effective? On what do you base that assertion?

Threw the training. We've pratciced test cutting on some one to one and 1/2 ft thick trees and it worked. Plus mainly, the other weapon training have worked in real life, why should I doubt the sword training. I can't help people think lowly of him or the bitterness between MA just because such'in such happend. I don't care about politics between MAs and all I can say is that what I have learned works in the streets to protect myself and others, isn't that the point of training? I say, let the big whigs handle politics and they can decide what they think is real, legit, or whatever, cause all I know is tha it works, I like it, and I don't care about the other stuff/politics, just let me train. If that isn't a good reason for me or other people to do the arts they like, then too bad.

[Charles Mahan]

So your assertion is based on having spent some time cutting and on proving sword techniques on the dojo floor?

[TheBattousai]

I was refering to the empty hand and other weapons (i.e. Hambo, Bo, Jo, etc.), but no not the classical Katana. But when a student left for the military and joined special forces, they used a machette (Not sure about the spelling) and it worked the same way as a katana/wakizashi. They cut a guy from a point inbetween the neck and shoulder, followed a diagonal line out the side right above the hip, and the top half fell off the bottom half, that simply. Sorry about that rant, earlier but I really hate politics in a shape, form, and fashion of life.

[Charles Mahan]

I'm still not sure that using a machete to cut someone in a modern conflict is proof that what you've learned would have worked back in the day.

It's the fundamental problem with creating a new sword style. There is simply no way to ever be sure it's worth anything. With the few remaining extant styles the techniques can be followed back in time to a point where they were actually used against other people who were similarly trained.

[shesulsa]

Sin, are there any professional cutlery stores in your area? They might also carry hand-forged swords made to order. Expect to spend a bit.

[tshadowchaser]

I'm looking for a Really good Katana...Something that they would use in the old times...something you can actually use...and not worry about the handle falling off....::looks at Tiger Claw and Shudders::

I don't train in Sword arts..at least not yet, but it would just be nice to have a good Katana.

As has ben noted in earlier posts a good Katana is going to cost you a bit of money. Cheap immatations are all over the place and have proven to break at the most unoppertune time and cause injury to those holding them at times

[MSUTKD]

Sorry, they do NOT teach "machette" in special forces training. Actually, very little hand to hand (6hrs). They use Ka-Gun.

ron

[Sin]

Sin, are there any professional cutlery stores in your area? They might also carry hand-forged swords made to order. Expect to spend a bit.


There isn't anything in my area...at least none that I know of...

Hey and guys...This thread is dangerously getting close to being a "flaming" one, so as a fellow Martial Talk member....I ask for everyone to cool there Jets and rememmber...Where all family within the Martial Arts.

[kenpojujitsu]

I live in Louisville, Kentucky, if there is anyone near by then please PM me...TheBattousai...hopefully will show me a thing or two.

Here's a Muso Shinden Ryu Dojo in Lexington

http://www.bluegrassbudokai.com/BGB/

It's not that far of a drive if you are serious. I used to live in Louisville and worked in Lexington. Even if you can just make weekend classes you can atleast get some proper training. If this does not work, maybe they know someone in Louisville or some where close.

[kenpojujitsu]

..."but with batto and iai; the idea is with batto you draw, cut and cut 1 or 2 more times to slay your foe and then you return the blade to the sheath (after a blood sling ofcourse), in iai its just 1 draw and then the return. I hope this somewhat clearifies things"....

Actually, Battodo is an older word for Iaido. No real difference in the 2, just a more modern versus an older name.

Battodo is the way of drawing the sword (basically)
Iaido is a way of pulling together in harmony (loose translation).

There are numerous "iaido" kata with more than 1 cut after the draw.

This is just one reason why you have knowledgable, experienced sword people saying "find a qualified instructor". A buddy with some training and someone who thinks 5 years is extensive will only mislead you. Maybe not intentionally, but they have been misled themselves if they think they are qualified to teach.

[kenpojujitsu]

Well now...I understand your concerns for self taught sword training. My friend has had classic japanesse training, so where not going in blind here.

Also TheBattousai has offered to train with me...and I for got to ask him in a PM, if he has had any sword training?

I would definitely keep looking for someone else. Your friend, i don't know him, but seems unqualified to teach based on your posts. As does TheBattousai based on his posts.

[kenpojujitsu]

TheBattousai said..
..."they used a machette (Not sure about the spelling) and it worked the same way as a katana/wakizashi"...

Sorry, but this is ridiculous. A machete is a hacking tool that is a different size, weight and shape than a katana and a wakizashi. They do not and can not work the same. Please, please, do not try to teach someone how to draw and cut with a katana, you will get them hurt.

[Sin]

I don't plan on using a LIVE blade for a long time.....so don't worry about me doing that...I know the risks of that and they are too high with my level of experince...so I will stick to my bokken for a long time eh...and when a 100% certified instructor in Louisville comes about...I'll hook up with him/her...but until then...I'm just gonna talk to other MAist about it and if they know anything I will ask that they demonstate...WITH THE WOODEN BOKKEN....

[Gemini]

I don't plan on using a LIVE blade for a long time.....so don't worry about me doing that...I know the risks of that and they are too high with my level of experince...so I will stick to my bokken for a long time eh...and when a 100% certified instructor in Louisville comes about...I'll hook up with him/her...but until then...I'm just gonna talk to other MAist about it and if they know anything I will ask that they demonstate...WITH THE WOODEN BOKKEN....

I'm sure you have a good head on your shoulders with every intent on keeping it there. :lol2:

So we digress. Have you checked any of the links yet? See anything you like? Gotten any ides? Learned some new and (IMO) interesting stuff?

C'mon, man! Share!

[Walter Wong]

Sin you can find seminars on Japanese swordsmanship in these links.

http://forums.swordforum.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=136

http://swordforumbugei.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=16&sid=9adebb9f0a4df027ff0e0d8af61eef45

[Sin]

I have checked a few, but not all of them are local...and I can't be sure...if there are any here local...driving to Lexington is out of the question...thats way to far...even for someone as devoted as I...I'm 19 and and in college...and I have a part time job...so yeah out of the question...

[tshadowchaser]

Folks I know there is some interseting suff being posted and there is some that is more personal so

Mod. Note.
Please, keep the conversation on topic..

Sheldon Bedell -MT Moderator-

If you wish to start treads on some of the subjects that are not about the original topic feel free to do so

[Sin]

Horray,
I just got my taxes back, and I'm getting like 500 dollars, so I'm like 2.3 percent closer to getting my new katana...Little joke there...

Anyways...I'm still open to whoever wants to send me links to whatever site to purchase a Traditional Katana.

[kroh]

Horray,
I just got my taxes back, and I'm getting like 500 dollars, so I'm like 2.3 percent closer to getting my new katana...Little joke there...

Anyways...I'm still open to whoever wants to send me links to whatever site to purchase a Traditional Katana.

Did you happen to check out the links that I posted? Some good stuff there.

Regards,
Walt

[BlackCatBonz]

i'd go with a bugei katana myself.......ive been reading about people's experiences with them for the past 2 years, along with various others.......and they always seem to get a good review as having an excellent product for a decent price.

[kroh]

Do you own a sword Shawn?

Regards,
Walt

[arnisador]

Sin you can find seminars on Japanese swordsmanship in these links.

http://forums.swordforum.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=136

http://swordforumbugei.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=16&sid=9adebb9f0a4df027ff0e0d8af61eef45

Also the seminars forum at www.e-budo.com.

[Walter Wong]

i'd go with a bugei katana myself.......ive been reading about people's experiences with them for the past 2 years, along with various others.......and they always seem to get a good review as having an excellent product for a decent price.
I'm a Bugei fan myself. They are very high quality made for the rigors of practice and countless years of tameshigiri practice for the Japanese sword art practitioner. And every year the batches of swords being sent from Bugei to their customers are getting better and better. Bugei have their swords made at the Hanwei factor under Paul Chen's supervision. The Bugei set of swords get a different set of special requirements over the nonBugei Paul Chen sword popularly sold by other retailers. Paul Chen's son also had completed apprenticeship under Yoshindo Yoshihara as well so some of that training and education under Yoshindo will likely be reflected in future Bugei swords. In fact last year's batches of Bugei swords had shown great improvement already which maybe hint that that reflection is already happening.

[BlackCatBonz]

Do you own a sword Shawn?

Regards,
Walt

i do, but it's only a trainer that my teacher made for me. It's quite heavy.....so when i pick up an iaito it feels like a toothpick.

shawn

[kroh]

http://www.foodservicedirect.com/productimagesthumb/UFRP147T.jpg

Oh like one of these?

[BlackCatBonz]

lol....something like that!

[Walter Wong]

i do, but it's only a trainer that my teacher made for me. It's quite heavy.....so when i pick up an iaito it feels like a toothpick.

shawn
Is this your sword Shawn?

http://takumikai.at.infoseek.co.jp/kataoka.jpg

[BlackCatBonz]

that is scary......imagine dropping it on your toe?

[kroh]

I always wanted a katana that could kill people from three states away.

Regards,
Walt

[shesulsa]

That has got to be the biggest blade I've ever seen a picture of. Wow.

[Brian R. VanCise]

That is one gigantic sword!

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com (http://www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com)

[Brian R. VanCise]

Sin,

Have you tried looking at www.winjutsu.com (http://www.winjutsu.com) for a Bujinkan
school in your area. The swordwork within budo taijutsu is
amazing when practiced by someone with skill.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com (http://www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com)

[Sin]

I finally got my Bokken after a week of waiting, and I still continue the search for a decent Sword arts instructor....Until then...I'll learn basic tech. from a friend of mine...**Note: No real Blades will be used by me or anyone around me until there is a certified sword instructor, and he gives the ok.**

[kroh]

Good luck with it man! Just let us know when you find a qualified instructor. It could help other people in the area find instruction if you shout out about what you find.

Regards,
Walt

P.S. What kind of Bokken did you get ?

[Sin]

hecks yeah, if I find one I'll be sure to post about it....

I got a Ninja bokken....Its nice and light, but sturdy.

[Charles Mahan]

A ninja bokken?

[kroh]

Do you have any pics of it?

Regards,
Walt

[Sin]

Aye...heres a picture



http://store1.yimg.com/I/martialartsmart_1883_177263

[Grenadier]

I'm going to be a bit blunt on this matter. Please don't take it personally, since I have absolutely nothing against you, and if anything, enjoy reading your posts on other matters.

That ninja-to style bokken is not going to last very long at all.

Given it's price, I'm almost certain that it was made with a very porous grain red oak slab. If you stripped off the black paint and the varnish, then you would see all sorts of wood fillers used to fill up the gaps in the wood.

There are many kinds of wood that will be far superior, and that bokken made from the better woods are going to make you a happier practitioner. They may cost more, but in the end, it's safer, since you don't have to worry about splintering bokkens to nearly the same extent.

[Walter Wong]

That's not a good training bokken.

Get a bokken from these places:

http://www.swordstore.com/cgi-bin/htmlos.cgi/03407.1.3628772060778422614/apps/cart/docategory.html
http://bugei.com/subcategory_31.htm
http://kendo.tozando.com/shinai/index.html
http://www.e-bogu.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=31
http://www.tozaiimports.com/subcategory_5.htm

Or contact Justin Britton to make you a custom bokken that's tough, long lasting and beautiful:
www.bokken-art.com

[Brian R. VanCise]

Sin,

These bookens are made to last and resemble a
fuedal tachi. I have a bunch of them and they will
probably last longer than me. http://www.pennsylvaniabujinkan.com/Dojo/New%20Equip.htm
These are built to last a long, long time and will
really give you a workout.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com (http://www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com)

[Charles Mahan]

That's not to mention that that black paint is gonna come off all over your hands the longer you train with it.

[rutherford]

And then there's the fact that the straight blade is an American creation with no historical accuracy. Oh well.

[MSUTKD]

So true. The Japanese never made a straight blade like that. Many "Ninjas", when they actually go to Japan, find that out. The movies and the Ninja boom in the early 80's created the "Ninja Sword".

[Charles Mahan]

Maybe no straight blade quite like that one, but there were certainly straight swords in Japan. The old stuff.

http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/glossary.htm

I know you meant there were no ninjato that match the short straight bladed, giant square tsuba'd design mimiced by that bokuto, but perhaps all readers may not. Even the ninpo guys use more standard katana style weapons.

[Sin]

If mine goes FUBAR then I will borrow Sensei's until I get a new one....I go this one cause it was cheep and I had a little extra cash...So no worries