Your instructor is a male he holds HIGH rank and is at least a local celebrity
His wife who you hardly ever see study see to go up in rank verry fast.
The fact that she seems to be tested off to the side when everyone else is testing in front of the Board is often noticed.. Her test seems to get over in have the time of eveyone else.
In class if a femal student is talented , the wife makes sure the student may not get all the forms needed for the next test or she teaches them wrong to the student then laughs when durring testing you do them wrong.
Ever been in any of these situations? Reconise (sp) these people?
How do you deal with the situations .
I know of such a school but can and will not go beyound asking the above questions. I am not associated with the school I know of I only get 2nd hand information on some of the BS that supposidly takes place.
Shadow:asian:

I have seen things like that happen in various places around the country, what usually happens is that they wind up fading away as people quit coming and start training elsewhere.

The one I know of has been around for 25 years it was the only MA class in its area for years.
Ladys, please , how do you handle such things?

Well I for one being a head instructor's wife and a co-owner of our school thinks that is despicable behaviour.. I teach both males and females and I partake in all the warmups - Sparring and technique nights.. I test right along side of everyone else and if I mess up I'm told so by my instructor who btw.. becomes only my instructor when I'm in class.. I treat the females and males with respect and the main reason I'm in MA's is to teach.. and the more I learn the more I want to pass along.. sounds like this woman is a selfish person who has no right to be an Instructor. Unless you have absolute proof of her actions.. and knew what affiliation she was with.. then only a student whom this has occured to should be the one to take it to a higher level than her husband.
It's sad to hear about such things in the MA community but alas there are schysters out there and egoists who have no business with a school.. Unfortunately there is no accreditation needed .. any joe blow can open a School and hang a shingle.

Just my thoughts..
Tess

well, if the instructor is unethical enough to do something like that with his wife's training, I wouldn't stay at that school very long.

However, give them a little bit of the benefit of the doubt...they may be practicing when students aren't around. dunno about the test thing and the teaching stuff wrong thing, unless he's really training her poorly and she doesn't know better.

well I'm not a lady but If I was at a school where I thought there was preferential treatment or bad instruction I would simply quit. If my freinds went to a school like that I would advise them to quit and find a new school for them, I realy don't like BS like that myself.

Hey all...

That, I believe will never take place in our school.. only because the Instructor's wife isn't on the floor with us.. I personally don't know if she even helps with the office stuff...
BUT.. if something like that were to ever happen.... I would leave... I hate to do it.. but i would not want to be in an organization that rewards that kind of behaviour. What then would be next.. being able to buy your black belt.. (trust me we have some here in my hometown) i shiver at the thought!!

Chow...:)

What then would be next.. being able to buy your black belt

Well now that you mention it. BUt I will not get into that aspect of that school and organization in this thread. Lets just say the instructor has changed organizations many times gainning rank with each change.

I was talking with a student of the school I know of where such things happen. It seems that about six months ago a group of the femal students all threatened to walk out if certian changes did not take place. I did not find out what all of thoses changes where OR if they where all agreed to but I do know some of the students stayed some left.
Shadow:asian:

I haven't witnessed that at any m.a. school, but it reminded me
of officer's wives, who weren't in the military. They go on thinking
they wear the rank too. NERVE racking! I imagine things could
be worse if the wife never studied a day in her life.

I met my wife in class. We were sparring in line and she had been trounced by every guy in the place. I scored my points cleanly, but without making her feel like she knew nothing and without adding any more lumps or bruises. The owner of that school didn't like teaching women and didn't mind when the guys hit them a little too hard. Things progresses from there for us and we started dating, became engaged and eventually got married. When we were engaged my wife and I bought the school we tarined at. As a little bit of just deserts we had her sign the check and give to the previous owner.

Having owned a school in the past I knew the pitfalls. We decided that with her schedule and her owning half the school that she would be doing private lessons with me and my instructor, this greatly accelerated her abilities, she still waited the mandatory time periods for belts, but she did test withthe group, she tested with my instructor. He felt it was best she as an owner of a studio put a professional distance between her and the rest of the students.

What is your opinion of this? I sometimes have second thoughts as whether it was a wise decision for her to be singled out like that or not. As my instructor stated my students would not be attending my tests, so why should they attending the tests of the other owner.

Do your students test befor a board or just in front of you and maybe one or two other ranking people? If they test (lets say at Black Belt level) infront of a board then I think everyone should be treated the samr. If the students see her test on an equal bases they will never question her rank.. If they only see her come in with the new rank it may cause problems down the road. Just my thoughts

Originally posted by tshadowchaser

Do your students test befor a board or just in front of you and maybe one or two other ranking people? If they test (lets say at Black Belt level) infront of a board then I think everyone should be treated the samr. If the students see her test on an equal bases they will never question her rank.. If they only see her come in with the new rank it may cause problems down the road. Just my thoughts

It really doesn't matter anymore, because of the politics of the association and us having to close the school she has never trained again. She was only a purple belt when we closed the school, but she could easily beat some of the brown belts that were there when we bought the school. When we first started seeing eachother I did a lot of private training with her and some of the students we had made comment sabout how it was unfair that she was getting private lessons from me. This is one of the reasons it was decided that she work in private and grade privately. The only time she was in the classes was to help beginners and childrens classes.

If anything I think I was harder on her for her pretests than my instructor was for her tests. The biggest problem we had was buying an existing school that had people that had trained with the previous instructor for 5 years. They had a chip because I walked in as a 4th degree Black Belt and starte working through the ranks to be certified by the WKKA, the may have been with theorganization longer than I had but i had been train for almost 20 yrs at that time, and always in one form of kenpo or another.

Very few of the beginners that joined when my wife and I did had any problem with my rapid acceleration or her working privately, it was just some people that had their nose out of joint because their instructor sold the school to us.

Originally posted by tshadowchaser

Your instructor is a male he holds HIGH rank and is at least a local celebrity
His wife who you hardly ever see study see to go up in rank verry fast.
The fact that she seems to be tested off to the side when everyone else is testing in front of the Board is often noticed.. Her test seems to get over in have the time of eveyone else.
In class if a femal student is talented , the wife makes sure the student may not get all the forms needed for the next test or she teaches them wrong to the student then laughs when durring testing you do them wrong.
Ever been in any of these situations? Reconise (sp) these people?
How do you deal with the situations .
I know of such a school but can and will not go beyound asking the above questions. I am not associated with the school I know of I only get 2nd hand information on some of the BS that supposidly takes place.
Shadow:asian:

Although a couple things were different, most of this is a "been there" type situation. Instead of it being a wife it was "the girlfriend" and although she didn't teach, she did laugh at the performances of others.

There were two instructors at the school, one was the owner who concealed his true rank, and the other who had been studying this particular local system for something like 14 years. The second instructor displayed his rank honestly (3rd degree black belt).

These two instructors had differing opinions on the material being taught. Because the girlfriend never worked with the black belt instructor, she never learned what the rest of us were, and that was the material for the tests.

The final straw for me came when I tested on Friday night with the Master of this local system, in front of parents and other students. The girlfriend was sick and didn't make the test. We were testing for the same rank. The following morning when I attended a family class with my daughter, the girlfriend was making up the new ranking cards and she handed me mine while informing me she too had obtained a new rank.

At that point I lost all respect for this particular school and the founders. I understand that there are cases where people attend private lessons and do advance quicker for several reasons. When I questioned this particular case, I was told to leave the school and never come back. In addition, once I was no longer at the school, I was a target for many rumours that would conceal the true reason why I was terminated at this school.

Looking back now, yes, I was angry. I had believed the teachings of this school, I invested money and many hours a day in my training to find out that it really didn't matter in the end. It is unfortunate that this kind of thing happens and the people who do it don't understand the negative impact they make on the maritial arts.

In retrospect, I learned to investigate the reputation of the school / instructor. This has been my advise to the many people I have met since that are interested in the martial arts. Also, don't let one bad experience stop you from training. There are many great instructors out there! I would also like to point out that there are cases where the wife or girlfriend work VERY hard and are a great asset to the school. I know of such a case where the wife is an intermediate rank, but is an incredible help and support to all the students in the school. She is recommended for testing by other black belts in the school, not her husband, and tests in front of all students/families/and the judges. There is no doubting her qualifications and rank. I truely admire this couples ability to work the way they do for the good of all their students.

Personally I have decided to keep my distance from martial arts schools for now, however, I have kept up my training with the 3rd degree black belt, and several friends. I decided to use the IKCA program as the base for my training. I continue to train hard in hopes that I am better than I was yesterday. If I do achieve the rank of Black Belt with this association, I know I will have earned it and have no doubts everyone will have gone through the same scruitiny. I will not think that someone wearing the black belt either bought it, made a deal for it, or was personally involved with the instructor.

I understand what may of you are saying and this too was a serious concern for me. As many of you know, my wife is not only my partner in the school but one of my two very senior students. She does receive some private instruction from me (when she can get me to do it) but not much. She pretty much trains with every one else and tests with everyone else. The result, no one questions her rank or the vailidty of what she says when she is teaching. While I do not necessarily feel it is necessary for the Owner/Lead Instructor of a school to test inf front of his students, or even higher ranking Black belts, I feel everyone should test in front of everyone up through 1st black.
Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.:asian:

I want to say that I do know of a school that has a wife in it at a lowr rank and that she works out with the rest when she can. A youngchild in the family makes it hard sometimes. The students all seem to treat this lady with respect for her rank . She works out verry hard .
Lifewise. I'm truly sorry that you incountered one of the BAD ones. They can leave a sour tast that is hard to get over. I hope that you can find a school where you will comfortable and start your studies again.
Shadow:asian:

Thanks Shadow, and yes, I am optomistic about my martial arts future.

At the Tracy's school where my daughter Tashtigress trains, the head instructor's wife is also co-owner of the school, and a part-time instructor who attained her first Black last fall. No-one ever saw her train for her BB test, as she trained totally outside of school hours, with her husband teaching her in his spare time. She had expressed to me a similar concern about whether people would judge her to have received her BB without deserving it merely because they hadnt' been observing her progress. I thought it wise of her to test with her original instructor, a high ranking and well-known Tracy's BB, a half day's travel from here. By doing so, she left no question in anyones mind about the quality of her training and her level of skill. I don't believe she ever seriously considered testing with her husband, but I think that was also because she felt he would have been excessively harsh on evaluating her, as well as making her nervous as heck!

Conflict of interest comes under suspicion in all other areas of our society, and it stands to reason that there will always be some level of deception and dirty dealing in the MA, just like anywhere else. It's up to the individual to keep his/her record clean and let their lineage tell the tale. :soapbox: