Fed up with training now!!!!

[Corporal Hicks]

Hi,
I've been praticing MA for about 4/5 years and it seems like I'm getting absolutely no where at all. I know I'm a slow learner and it takes a while but no matter how much I pratice, at home as well, it always seems that there's always flaws in what I do. I'm not looking for perfection but it would be nice to be able to think that I could at least not hit in play fights with mates, yet somehow some hit always seems to get in.
I've tried different arts, but then I realised that I wanted one to focus on self defence and it just seems that no matter what I do somebody who is less experienced than me, can beat me, or stand a very good chance of beating me.
It would be nice to have a little natural talent or something but at the moment it just seems that I'm really inexperienced.
What am I doing so wrong? Why can I not feel confident?
I learn a self defence move then the next day it goes out the window! I'm limited to training with just myself at home, and the gym at the moment, so what do I do? mental image or what? In the end percievance may be the key but if you feel like I do, it seems a waste or time and money!

[Marginal]

There's no way to avoid getting hit. Even folks like Sugar Ray Leonard who were known for their incredible defensive skills will tell you that. Nobody's defense is perfect,and no MA is going to give you perfect defense.

[rmcpeek]

Practice. Practice. Practice. It is the only real way to get better. I understand your frustration, but look at when you get hit as a learning process, not some failure.

You already know you don't like getting hit, it shows by your frustration in your message post. Now take and evaluate what you're doing after your training session. Be calm. Think through what you might have done differently to avoid it.

You will never, ever be completely able to avoid being hit. It happens to all of us. We get hit. It's part of it. It's what you learn from it that counts.

Remember, patience, stay calm, focus, and above all try not to let it get to you.

[Andrew Green]

"Self-defence moves" are generally silly and useless.

If you want to see progress and know you can beat others do something full contact for a while. Boxing, wrestling, Judo, Muay Thai, mma, etc.

Something that is based around sparring.

Traditional styles can be good or bad, but the marketing and way to sell people is to tell them they will be able to learn some moves and not get beat. But winning has a lot less to do with cool moves then it does with mindset and comfort zones.

As for getting hit, you're always gonna get hit, it's just a matter of how hard and how often. Until you accept that you can't fight.

[rmcrobertson]

If you're studying a worthwhile art, at a good school, have a good instructor, and are practicing regularly, don't worry about it. That's just your unconscious, trying to talk you out of advancing in your art. Big deal; happens to me and everybody serious all the time.

It may help to hear something I was told a while back--it's common for students to "plateau," and for everything to go flat, just before they make a big leap forward.

And sorry, Mr. Green, but I disagree. Assuming the stuff I wrote above is true, the last thing you should do is to switch to a "reality-based," or, "full contact," art. In the first place, you're probably doing all that stuff now. In the second, there are long-term considerations....like how much of a mess you would like your body to be when you're my age. And in the third--and particularly important--switching to any other art right now is just another way for your unconscious to talk you out of advancing.

So the long and the short--on some level, who cares if studying and practice are "fun," in the sense we Americans have got all too used to. Screw fun; you're trying to learn and to change.

Or as was said, just keep practicing. Good days, bad days...just keep at it.

[MJS]

Looks like you've already received some good advice. There is no sure shot defense that will totally protect you at all times. We all have our good days and our bad days, and I think its safe to say that everyone, at some point in their training has been down the same road you're on. I wouldn't say to constantly change arts, but instead, re-evaluate your training, how you're training, etc.

Get together with some people for a sparring session, and have someone watch you closely. If you have a video camera available, you might consider taping yourself, and watching the match to see where you may have had openings, etc.

It appears that you have a strong desire to train in the arts. I know its easier said than done, but don't get frustrated. Keep training hard, and you'll see the results!! :supcool:

Mike

[bdparsons]

Hi,
I've been praticing MA for about 4/5 years and it seems like I'm getting absolutely no where at all. I know I'm a slow learner and it takes a while but no matter how much I pratice, at home as well, it always seems that there's always flaws in what I do. I'm not looking for perfection but it would be nice to be able to think that I could at least not hit in play fights with mates, yet somehow some hit always seems to get in.
I've tried different arts, but then I realised that I wanted one to focus on self defence and it just seems that no matter what I do somebody who is less experienced than me, can beat me, or stand a very good chance of beating me.
It would be nice to have a little natural talent or something but at the moment it just seems that I'm really inexperienced.
What am I doing so wrong? Why can I not feel confident?
I learn a self defence move then the next day it goes out the window! I'm limited to training with just myself at home, and the gym at the moment, so what do I do? mental image or what? In the end percievance may be the key but if you feel like I do, it seems a waste or time and money!

If I may add one observation: You state that you've been in the martial arts 4-5 years, yet I see three pretty different sysytems listed in your personal info. My recommendation would be to pick an art, one with an emphasis on self-defense (since that's what you mentioned you're interested in) and stick with it. Many times folks expect things to happen far too quickly in the martial arts. The reality is most stuff with any lasting value will take quite a while to learn and become reasonably competent at. Grab a sack of stick-to-it and be ready for the ups and downs of hard training. Sometimes you'll feel like your not going anywhere, that's the plateau Robert mentioned. Hang in there, your confidence will come as your skill increases.

Respects,
Bill Parsons
Triangle Kenpo Institute

[Andrew Green]

And sorry, Mr. Green, but I disagree. Assuming the stuff I wrote above is true, the last thing you should do is to switch to a "reality-based," or, "full contact," art. In the first place, you're probably doing all that stuff now. In the second, there are long-term considerations....like how much of a mess you would like your body to be when you're my age. And in the third--and particularly important--switching to any other art right now is just another way for your unconscious to talk you out of advancing.

All depends on what is going on, if it a dissillusionment with functionally lacking techniques, then switching to a contact based art will sort that out.

As for the body... I know what has done the long term damage to my body - years in traditional arts. The contact stuff is much easier on the body as odd as that might sound...

And on switching, depends, the frustration could be the unconcious telling you you're not yet in the right place.

[Gemini]

I found that most everything mentioned above to be true. Especially about plateauing. Being agitated will only hinder your progress. A clouded mind is always a hindrance, and you sound prtty clouded. I would recommend you acknowledge improvement will take a long time and stop making mental expectations.

I would just like to support something mentioned earlier by MJS about video taping. I went this route and found it to be a huge help. Watching the video, what I thought I was doing and what I really was doing, were two very different things. Good Luck!

[lulflo]

I heard a great quote. "If you're complaining, you're not training". I know that I feel the same as you on occasion and since we are at about the same amount of time in serious training, your words ring loud and true. I find that strategy is something that has to be incorporated with training and specifically sparring.

For instance, I have been sparring the same person for a long time and he was a much lower rank in the beginning and I had no problem avoiding his kicks and punches, but as he has learned more offense, my defense has been lacking. It was only after I decided that I needed to pursue more of an offensive stand against him that I was able to subdue his attacks again and that insight has put me at a strong advantage again - until his next leap and so on.

You can't win a football game with great defense only, the same is true with a fight or sparring, you need to work on your offense as well. Consider your situation and do what is best for you, I'm sure you will find out that you know a lot more than you think and your confidence will surely be boosted when you take away the veil in front of your eyes and ATTACK! (once in a while at least)

Good luck to you.

Farang - Larry

[rmcrobertson]

Skip the gimmicks. Just practice.

[searcher]

Remember that perfection is a road, not a destination. If being an elite martial artist was easy then don't you think we would all be elite? You have to just keep on going and you will get there. You are not going to see the changes, but others will over time.

[MJS]

Skip the gimmicks. Just practice.

What gimmicks are you talking about?

[rmcrobertson]

Video, ATTACK!, switching arts. Technologies are useful; slogans are sometimes useful but usually just marketings; endlessly switching arts is a dead end. From what he's describing, I don't even see what the real problem is, so I say, skip 'em; just practice.

[evenflow1121]

Hits will always get in, no one is perfect, and no one can block effectively 100% of the time, but it is reacting to the hit that is also important, that will come with time. At the moment, you seem to have studied 3 different styles with what seems a lack of enthusiasm. Might I suggest you give an MMA school a try, maybe you need something less orthodox.

[MJS]

Video, ATTACK!, switching arts. Technologies are useful; slogans are sometimes useful but usually just marketings; endlessly switching arts is a dead end. From what he's describing, I don't even see what the real problem is, so I say, skip 'em; just practice.

I agree. That is, ideally what needs to be done...practice. As for the video. This is in no way a gimmick. In fact, it is a very useful training tool. The poster was asking for suggestions, and suggestions were given. Ultimately, we are all going to have our own opinions as to what is best and what isn't but the fact remains that that person will have to decide for himself what he wants to do and what'll work for him. He is having a problem, and if the video taping works for him, so he can see an opening, weak spot, etc., then he is obviously on the road to improving his training.

As for attack...well, that is not my post, so I can't give the meaning of it, but I will give my opinion as to what I think it means. I take that as him saying that he needs to be more aggressive.

Mike

[Kamaria Annina]

Getting hit is a part of martial arts, it is inevitable. However, if you have a bad night training, let it go, and continue with your training. It isn't worth getting frustrated over. Forget about it and move on.

[Corporal Hicks]

Ah, some really good replies!

Thanks guys I really appreciate your feedback! Its made me think again about what I'm doing and how I'm percieving things. A big thanks to all of you again :)

Kind Regards

[arnisador]

Plateaus are inevitable...maybe even helpful. Remember, the only battle is to improve yourself. Work through it!

[Han-Mi]

Pick ONE art, and work on it for a while. It takes coninuity to make your mind quick with techs.

[Adept]

Video, ATTACK!, switching arts. Technologies are useful; slogans are sometimes useful but usually just marketings; endlessly switching arts is a dead end.
One could just as accurately say that staying with a single art is a dead end.

Saying that someone should do this, or do that, because doing the other is a dead end, or not effective, or not going to advance them towards their goals is meaningless unless we address the goals of the person in question. Hicks here seems to express a lack of confidence in the techniques he is learning, and his competence as a 'fighter'.

Switching to a 'reality based full contact' art, as suggested by Andrew Green above is, IMHO, a very good idea. Switching arts is not going to impeded ones growth in the martial arts, as the measure of ones growth is up to the individual. If you feel you are advancing, then you are, regardless of the colour of your belt or how many tournaments you win.

Switching to a full contact sport like boxing will mean the Hicks gets hit. And hard. And hopefully, he will learn that it isn't the end of the world, and that getting hit doesn't mean you are out of the fight. Learning to take a hit is just as important as learning to avoid one in the first place. It will also hopefully demonstrate that when you hit someone, they will feel it. It's going to hurt. It will help him to be confident in a sparring or fighting situation, and IMHO can only help his martial arts career.

[An Eternal Student]

I was in pretty much the same boat as you for a while.Im doingthe same thing, Ive been training for about 5 years in a few different styles and I had a similiar problem.Maybe you should think of making your training slightly rougher.Whenever you're practicing you're defence make sure you're opponent puts some decent force into his attacks, giving you a proper incentive to dodge.If it doesnt hurt when you get a hit,you're never going to be properly motivated to dodge it.As well as that, getting used to being hit hard a few times, will mean it wont unbalance you if it happens in real life.
A lot of people who train too gently, completely cave in when they are hit in a real fight.All this stuff worked for me, so it might help you as well.
Good luck, dude.Its nice to see another young guy who wants to succeed.

[Bod]

Keep play fighting with your mates. It is clearly the sparring you are missing. I've been training MA for around 10 years in total, and playfighting with my mate and brother always advances me, even though I box and have done 3 years judo.

They always get one in, because the unitiated but plucky opponent who knows you are into MA always looks at ways of taking your MA out of the equation. This will generally include sneaking up on you throwing unorthodox shots grappling if you are a striker, striking if you are a grappler and so on.

Swallow your pride and be thankful you have a sparring partner. Just make sure your friends are careful about your welfare, and that the sparring does not get out of control.

[hammer]

Corporal Hicks, some may take offence to this post well thats there choice, hey! and even you may, look Just give up!!! Yep just give up!!! thats right!! give up!!, boo hoo!

Much of the advice that has already been give is sound, yet I feel alot of it is back patting! and at times thats what we need, So just to put a different prospective on things, Just give up! (lol)

I'm sure that over the past 4/5 years you must of heard the words , committment , perseverence, deterimination,dedication, focus, and in doing so you must know the meanings of these words.

The time that is dedicated to your study / practice must be proportionate to your skill and understanding, if you are committed to the value of learning and achieving ,Then you realize that one of the most important keys to your success is commitment, sweat and more sweat!!!

As with all learning activities , acquiring skill is a process of time and the effort that is applied to the time spent,

So regardless of grade, understanding the above charcter traits makes a significant difference when they are employed in any situation. and its through developing these traits and over commimg the obstacls that are before you. You will develop your confidence.

As for the material that is taught, no would would expect you to remember a technique, that was only shown once or twice in class and practiced a few times, parts of it yes! It is only after you have be guided through the movements for sometime so that you will develop those sequneces of movement, "hey thats practice" to a more proficent level.

Its easy to make excusses rather than impovements,

so like i said just give up , it easy!!!! lol

All good cheers

[DarrenJew]

As with most... there is no such thing as perfection, no one ever really finnishes their trainning, it's the journey in which you'll find your answers.

[Andrew Green]

I've been training MA for around 10 years in total, and playfighting with my mate and brother always advances me, even though I box and have done 3 years judo.
Funny how so many people can be doing martial arts that aparently came from studying animals and miss that completely.

Animals learn to fight through.... Play Fighting!

Maybe there is something to be learnt from animals after all....

[RRouuselot]

Hi,
I've been praticing MA for about 4/5 years and it seems like I'm getting absolutely no where at all.

Train harder

[rmcrobertson]

It is very unlikely that switching to a Real Manly art, or guaranteeing that you Feel More Pain, is going to help.

If you're at a good school, and you have reason to trust the people who run it, the good advice is train harder; stop worrying about where you're gonna get to.

Unfortunately, we live in a culture that promises quick rewards.

[Andrew Green]

Not true.

I could be in a very good Ballet school with top international instructors and still feel stupid about being there.

What you are doing is just as important as who is teaching it too you.

After 3 unsuccessful attempts at traditional styles, maybe its time to take a different approach. COntinuing with something you are not enjoying is often the worst thing you can do, as it won't be long before you are doing nothing.

[Marginal]

It is very unlikely that switching to a Real Manly art, or guaranteeing that you Feel More Pain, is going to help.


Might land him a better instructor. A lot of the problems Hicks has hit over the course of his posting career seems to come from just being tossed into sparring with no real explanation of how things fit together, or how using strategy etc may be helpful to his sparring.

[SMP]

Lots of good suggestions. I would suggest trying less and have fun. After 5 years your mind may be getting in the way of your training/instict. Good luck

[rmcrobertson]

If you're in a good school with good instructors, just keep practicing. Skip the gimmicks and the manly men jazz; it's perfectly normal to get discouraged.

And if you went into a ballet school, you should just plie.

[MJS]

Well, I'll say again...there are many learning tools out there. Just because one person thinks that something is no good, does not mean that the next person won't find value in it.

Mike

[Corporal Hicks]

Alright so it happens again, playfighting and this time I get a split lip! How crap am I? This guy had aboustely no previous knowledge!
This is annoying now!

Makes me feel like I'm a failure as a martial artist.

[Adept]

Alright so it happens again, playfighting and this time I get a split lip! How crap am I? This guy had aboustely no previous knowledge!
This is annoying now!

Makes me feel like I'm a failure as a martial artist.
Once again I recommend boxing as an additional training tool. When you take up boxing, you are going to get hit. At the same time, you are going to hit people. Doing this, and taking the experience on board lets you know a few things about what you can take, and what you can dish out.

Sure, you got a split lip. But maybe, while you took that split lip it gave you an opportunity to throw the other guy, or take him down. Maybe it set you up to break a joint, or make an otherwise powerful attack. And all you got out of it was a split lip. A split lip! Who cares! I've playfought with untrained mates before, and they've scored a few blows, but I almost always end up getting their back and either choking or tapping them out. Being better, being trained, isn't about never getting hit. It's about only taking the hits you have to, and making the other bloke pay for them.

[Eldritch Knight]

Makes me feel like I'm a failure as a martial artist.

Happens to most people some time during their martial arts career. At least you recognize it and want to find a solution. Personally speaking, I just got out of one of these plateaus, and in my experience I found that the best thing to do is to force yourself to learn and grow as a martial artist. Spar people who you know can grind you to a pulp (instructors, advanced students, etc.). Sparring them will at least show you where your weak points are. From there, you can work on eliminating vulnerabilities and maximizing attack opportunities (through speed, tactics, any flavor of the month). Just keep pushing through.

[BlackCatBonz]

Alright so it happens again, playfighting and this time I get a split lip! How crap am I? This guy had aboustely no previous knowledge!
This is annoying now!

Makes me feel like I'm a failure as a martial artist.
sounds to me like you're not keeping those hands up. also sounds to me like you're afraid of attacking first. its not about being crap......its about initiative.....see an opening, take it....no hesitations.
when i first started sparring i had this attitude that i didnt want to hit the other person because i didnt want them to get hurt. that lasted about 2 weeks and several beatings.......my lovey-dovey nature only ended up with me getting bruises and fat lips.
next time you spar with your friends.....as soon as he puts one of his hands down...pop him in the chops. when you hit first, fast and hard......they dont want to hit back.

[Andrew Green]

Alright so it happens again, playfighting and this time I get a split lip! How crap am I? This guy had aboustely no previous knowledge!
This is annoying now!

You're always gonna get hit. Playfight with a pro fighter and he'll still probably get hit a few times.

But getting hit doesn't mean much without knowing how much, how hard and how accurate.

Also the fear of getting hit can actually get you hit more, because you overreact and extend out to catch things too early exposing yourself. Relax, realise that you WILL get hit, accept that and carry on.

Until you're ok with getting hit you'll have a very time not getting hit.

[arnisador]

Dude, sounds like a learning experience to me.

[Corporal Hicks]

sounds to me like you're not keeping those hands up. also sounds to me like you're afraid of attacking first. its not about being crap......its about initiative.....see an opening, take it....no hesitations.
when i first started sparring i had this attitude that i didnt want to hit the other person because i didnt want them to get hurt. that lasted about 2 weeks and several beatings.......my lovey-dovey nature only ended up with me getting bruises and fat lips.
next time you spar with your friends.....as soon as he puts one of his hands down...pop him in the chops. when you hit first, fast and hard......they dont want to hit back.
Yeah I started analyising the fight later and I foudn that it was my guard that I had let down. Something I will continually train over and over now, until it truely comes without thinking. Thanks for your responses everybody.

And I agree with you arnisador, I've changed my mindset and look upon it now as a learning experience, not a lost.

Cheers!
Regards

[MJS]

Alright so it happens again, playfighting and this time I get a split lip! How crap am I? This guy had aboustely no previous knowledge!
This is annoying now!

Makes me feel like I'm a failure as a martial artist.

Keep in mind that its not going to happen overnight. There are no short cuts. There is no sure shot way of positioning the hands to 100% cover your self. In addition, as Blackcatbonz said, don't wait..be the aggressor and hit first. Don't forget, when someone is going to punch you, there will be that before, during and after phase. As soon as you see some movement, THAT is the time to make your move. Again, none of this will happen overnight. Keep training hard, and with time, you will see results! :ultracool

Mike

[arnisador]

And I agree with you arnisador, I've changed my mindset and look upon it now as a learning experience, not a lost.
Great!